I Think I'm Gonna Puke

[Jeremy8419]

Hmmm, I am absorbing this. It makes sense because I sometimes have had the thought "yes, I could fondly think of J as a friend" and then other times I am not sure of your intent and/or reasoning.

Let me ask you this (something I have often discussed with friends IRL): Do you think it is possible to accomplish more by 1) sharing knowledge OR 2) trying to teach people lessons?

Depends upon the individuals. The only way to learn something is to experience it in some shape or fashion. People, by default, create communication gaps out of self-preservation, because they are unconsciously aware of the reality that they may communicate more of their experiences than they feel are safe to do so. Because of such, different people go through differing acceptable channels of communication, which determine how they will learn and teach most effectively at the current time. One person may choose the better position of their own channels to their own benefit at the cost of the other. This imbalance will continue to increase until eventually the detrimented one will encounter the point that they are overstressed by trying to maintain the minimum amount of experiences they wish to retain for themselves from the other. Then begins a bouncing tug of war between these self-interests. Sometimes, two people have such similar channels, that they immediately begin near synchronous channels, such that they forgo their thoughts of maintaining any restrictions of their experiences. They then enter true synchronic understanding. Sometimes one individual displays little to no signs of maintaining minimum experiences, with the other individual thus encountering very little indication of chance a tug of war could happen, and so the other individual feels safe to leave behind the majority of their own minimum experiences. Of course, what minimums do exist, I believe is a matter in God's hands for designs unknown to any man.

What you encounter is me loading others channels on very deep levels into my own experiences, that they become available channels of my own either directly or by similarity, so that I have all applicable channels should their need arise. The alternate "J" is when I shutdown all defenses of restrictions of my experiences and transmit near the full breadth and depth of the experiences of humanity which I have encountered. Due to such converging on such wide and varied ranges of individuals, it can be said that the breadth and depth of my experiences exist as a consequence of granting peace to those with pains on a fundamental level while others relive joy.

What you have, now, is an experience channel of loss, which has a dyadic opposite of it's own, as placed into design by a God that transcends through all means and manners of existence.

From my own experiences, a family member once lost a husband due to a fire, and considered becoming a nun while stricken with grief and loss of direction including if a direction was even wanted. She ended up meeting another man, the both of them far past the age of average marrying age, who was himself at a loss due to never finding anyone to spend life with. They became married, with all the ensuing joys and woes included, had sons, raised them, and are now retired. I know not the designs of God, but what was one's loss but the stepping stones necessary on the path to common deep understanding necessary for two lives ultimately lived in love and joy?

I know not the designs of God, but I do maintain faith that all paths have love and joy as their ending, that all paths wind as the designs see best, and that all stones exist to remind us of the loneliness which we once felt walking a lonely and the promise that we won't always be alone and, eventually, two hearts burn as one.

"For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the Lord, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future."
-Jeremiah 29:11

 

[Cloudpatrol]

Depends upon the individuals. The only way to learn something is to experience it in some shape or fashion. People, by default, create communication gaps out of self-preservation, because they are unconsciously aware of the reality that they may communicate more of their experiences than they feel are safe to do so. Because of such, different people go through differing acceptable channels of communication, which determine how they will learn and teach most effectively at the current time. One person may choose the better position of their own channels to their own benefit at the cost of the other. This imbalance will continue to increase until eventually the detrimented one will encounter the point that they are overstressed by trying to maintain the minimum amount of experiences they wish to retain for themselves from the other. Then begins a bouncing tug of war between these self-interests. Sometimes, two people have such similar channels, that they immediately begin near synchronous channels, such that they forgo their thoughts of maintaining any restrictions of their experiences. They then enter true synchronic understanding. Sometimes one individual displays little to no signs of maintaining minimum experiences, with the other individual thus encountering very little indication of chance a tug of war could happen, and so the other individual feels safe to leave behind the majority of their own minimum experiences. Of course, what minimums do exist, I believe is a matter in God's hands for designs unknown to any man.

What you encounter is me loading others channels on very deep levels into my own experiences, that they become available channels of my own either directly or by similarity, so that I have all applicable channels should their need arise. The alternate "J" is when I shutdown all defenses of restrictions of my experiences and transmit near the full breadth and depth of the experiences of humanity which I have encountered. Due to such converging on such wide and varied ranges of individuals, it can be said that the breadth and depth of my experiences exist as a consequence of granting peace to those with pains on a fundamental level while others relive joy.

What you have, now, is an experience channel of loss, which has a dyadic opposite of it's own, as placed into design by a God that transcends through all means and manners of existence.

From my own experiences, a family member once lost a husband due to a fire, and considered becoming a nun while stricken with grief and loss of direction including if a direction was even wanted. She ended up meeting another man, the both of them far past the age of average marrying age, who was himself at a loss due to never finding anyone to spend life with. They became married, with all the ensuing joys and woes included, had sons, raised them, and are now retired. I know not the designs of God, but what was one's loss but the stepping stones necessary on the path to common deep understanding necessary for two lives ultimately lived in love and joy?

I know not the designs of God, but I do maintain faith that all paths have love and joy as their ending, that all paths wind as the designs see best, and that all stones exist to remind us of the loneliness which we once felt walking a lonely and the promise that we won't always be alone and, eventually, two hearts burn as one.

"For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the Lord, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future."
-Jeremiah 29:11

Thank you for the reply and letting me know the thrust behind ‘what you do’. The above is a very inspiring and hopeful motivation behind interacting with other's. I will look for that undercurrent from now on when reading your replies to other's.

Questions arise for me. Mostly doing with factors like “is it hubris to think we can properly discern what other’s need?” or “is it really possible to move people forward before they see the need themselves?” or “is unsolicited advice more helpful or dangerous?”.

I respect what you are saying re: people limiting themselves ~ the joy that is to be had between individuals at the same fork in the road ~ and the beauty of expanding each other’s world views.

I think our views are likely somewhat different due to the “P” “J” factor. I understand your “righteous need” to address things and the belief that you are able to identify such opportunities clearly. The “P” in me makes me more prone to ‘read the room’ and ponder the consequences of inserting myself.

You being more forthright and me being more reticent isn’t a slight on either of us. Simply reflects our ‘individual attributes'. Differences are what make life intriguing.

 

[Jeremy8419]

Thank you for the reply and letting me know the thrust behind ‘what you do’. The above is a very inspiring and hopeful motivation behind interacting with other's. I will look for that undercurrent from now on when reading your replies to other's.

Questions arise for me. Mostly doing with factors like “is it hubris to think we can properly discern what other’s need?” or “is it really possible to move people forward before they see the need themselves?” or “is unsolicited advice more helpful or dangerous?”.

I respect what you are saying re: people limiting themselves ~ the joy that is to be had between individuals at the same fork in the road ~ and the beauty of expanding each other’s world views.

I think our views are likely somewhat different due to the “P” “J” factor. I understand your “righteous need” to address things and the belief that you are able to identify such opportunities clearly. The “P” in me makes me more prone to ‘read the room’ and ponder the consequences of inserting myself.

You being more forthright and me being more reticent isn’t a slight on either of us. Simply reflects our ‘individual attributes'. Differences are what make life intriguing.

It's not hubris to accept one's own humanity and the understanding that as you must so question your own heart, full of love and confliction and misunderstanding, that others must do the same. At the end of the day, you believe in yourself and do what you think you must do for others out of love. It may not be the best or the right, but it is your responsibility to do what you think you must, and it is the responsibility of those who love you to listen, and, having the faith and belief in them to choose the best day to day from all those who love them, as all those who love you place their faith and belief in you.

You plausibly being INFP/ESTj and myself INFJ/INFj would just mean that I am forthright with my Mental Superblock and you being reticent with your Vital Superblock (as Socionics says), and vice-versa. If you and I went to a party and my specialty was pouring glasses of fruit punch and yours was dancing, who would be forthright with what and who would be reticent with what? Relationships and Potentiality. This is the topic of discussion. I am forthright. Other conversations or whatever, I'd probably be pretty quiet about. Similar to your perhaps future, if someone close to you never lost someone they were close to, who of the two of you would be forthright and who would be reticent in consoling the individual. There is divine purpose in everything, whether we always see it or pay attention to it or not.

 

[Cloudpatrol]

Relationships and Potentiality. This is the topic of discussion.

Gotcha.

Thanks for your perspectives!

Although we have meandered into the above topic, the purpose of this thread is really to determine type

I will take all of your input and add it to the overall mass of data I am considering. Thanks for the convo.

 

[Jeremy8419]

Gotcha.

Thanks for your perspectives!

Although we have meandered into the above topic, the purpose of this thread is really to determine type

I will take all of your input and add it to the overall mass of data I am considering. Thanks for the convo.

That's within such, though, which is why I chose to yap about it lol.

 

[SearchingforPeace]

Ok, since your type is being discussed in the mistyped members thread, perhaps it is a good time to set forth what I believe your true type is. Interesting enough, I thought this since your very first post and nothing you have posted since really shown me otherwise.

First off, as a matter of MBTI issue, before looking at JCF, you are a J and a E, not a I or a P. As someone who mistyped as an I for a long time, I had trouble reconciling my feeling I was an introverrt. I read Quiet and felt strongly about it.

But that then I learned social introversion isn’t cognitive introversion. Moreover I learned my self-described social introversion does not a fit with the reality of life anyway.

Likewise, you are not a P. Your time management and planning, as discussed in this thread, fit a J. You plan your trips, arrive early at your destination, and plan to utilize your spare time productively.

But enough of that, let's look at functions.

Ni Se or Si Ne, that is the question. i will approach it two ways.

First, Ni. Your topics and posts have a Ni feel. You have long posts on a single topic, with substantial coherence and theme. But, since you are a writer, these could be learned traits rather than natural traits.

But your posts seem to encompass a single complete understanding. Posts from NPs tend to float and weave

Second, Se. In my outdoors thread, you clearly demonstrated a Se love of action and adventure. As much as you love the city, your hearts yearns for nature and experiences.

So, if you are Ni Se, then that eliminates NFPs, STJs, SFJs, and NTPs. I had considered ENTP for a long time.

So, that leaves STPs, NFJs, SFPs, and NTJs. The Ts don't seem to fit you in the least, so we have a SFP vs. NFJ showdown.

Your posts seem to scream Fe. It is possible that you merely internalized Fe values from being with your ENFJ mom and your INFJ husband. Such a ISFP could act very Fe-ish.

But your actions when a certain member challenged you in this and another thread, you responded like a NFJ. Moreover, your discussing getting sympathy sick with others is a very FJ thing to experience.

So, ultimately, I see you as F dom, but not a Fi dom. You are not a ESFJ.

But I believe you are a ENFJ like your mother. Any difference between you and your mom appears to be due to enneagram.....

 

[Cloudpatrol]

Thank you for giving such great in-depth thought to this. In response to the Mistyped thread I am going to post here but want to answer a few things you have put forth first

First off, as a matter of MBTI issue, before looking at JCF, you are a J and a E, not a I or a P. As someone who mistyped as an I for a long time, I had trouble reconciling my feeling I was an introverrt. I read Quiet and felt strongly about it.

For me being an introvert isn't about where I draw energy from or being quiet. It is about the fact that most of what I experience in life is foremost: internal. I hope that what I post below helps color this in I truly believe I would most accurately be called an ambivert.

Likewise, you are not a P. Your time management and planning, as discussed in this thread, fit a J. You plan your trips, arrive early at your destination, and plan to utilize your spare time productively.

I get that this suggests that! I have to say that I answered with business and appointments in mind. I have had to discipline myself to be efficient and successful as an entrepreneur. It isn't my natural inclination, though I am happy I have been able to produce these traits in myself. When left to my own devices, I meander and explore. My family says that I have no concept of time and truly it's something that intrigues me. But, I am completely different as a business person because I have expectations for myself.

First, Ni. Your topics and posts have a Ni feel. You have long posts on a single topic, with substantial coherence and theme. But, since you are a writer, these could be learned traits rather than natural traits.

But your posts seem to encompass a single complete understanding. Posts from NPs tend to float and weave

Yes, I feel the same for the first point. The second is interesting and I will truly ponder it.

Second, Se. In my outdoors thread, you clearly demonstrated a Se love of action and adventure. As much as you love the city, your hearts yearns for nature and experiences.

Here's the thing, I could write just as passionately and deeply about the city. I am truly a city and country mouse. I was raised on a lake and then we moved to the city. I went from taking the boat to go for gas and sleeping under the stars to taking the bus to auditions and befriending graffiti artists. My heart is divided.

So, if you are Ni Se, then that eliminates NFPs, STJs, SFJs, and NTPs. I had considered ENTP for a long time.

FLABBER. GASTED. I wish you could have seen my face when I read that (giggles).

Your posts seem to scream Fe. It is possible that you merely internalized Fe values from being with your ENFJ mom and your INFJ husband. Such a ISFP could act very Fe-ish.

But your actions when a certain member challenged you in this and another thread, you responded like a NFJ. Moreover, your discussing getting sympathy sick with others is a very FJ thing to experience.

Will think these over. Thanks for them.

But I believe you are a ENFJ like your mother. Any difference between you and your mom appears to be due to enneagram.....

Hmmmm.... Thinking...

 

[Cloudpatrol]

[MENTION=23583]Yamato Nadeshiko[/MENTION] [MENTION=17131]Chanaynay[/MENTION] [MENTION=10082]Starry[/MENTION] [MENTION=4945]EJCC[/MENTION] [MENTION=9811]Coriolis[/MENTION] [MENTION=24479]themightyfetus[/MENTION]


I take what you offered in the Mistyped thread to heart. I have perused the Si thread and some others and decided I am going to be forthright in 'opening myself up a bit more'. It's really difficult and I almost bailed completely but I really do want to seek accurate understanding when I visit here. Posting here cuz don't want to dominate the "mistyped" thread.


[MENTION=26674]theforsaken[/MENTION] [MENTION=14015]Urarienev[/MENTION] [MENTION=7111]fidelia[/MENTION] [MENTION=5223]MDP2525[/MENTION] would you guys also weigh in, if you wish? And everyone even if I didn't "mention" you of course...

I am a bit tired so am sure I am forgetting people who excel at this kind of thing or know me better. Yeah, I am already thinking of others I hope will drop by


I have done it in point form and maybe you will be able to assign functions, tell me if things are not type related etc...

I have tried to be transparent and talk about things I don't easily reveal or to do with when I am under stress or at fault. I feel like I identify with many types but it's usually my stressors and faults that help me to clarify.


- Feel emotions deeply but sometimes so deeply that have trouble referencing them at any accessible level. Have great difficulty understanding or putting words to my own emotions but understand other’s immediately. Empathy to point that I almost share the other person’s experience. Not feeling what they do but being able to imagine it. Almost always know right thing to do in social settings. So, when I fail it feels huge and I am very hard on myself. Huge sense of justice and fair play. I will always choose justice cuz it encapsulates mercy within it.


- Access emotions more easily through watching movies or listening to music. The emotion expressed there serves as a conduit to help me understand what I feel.


-Learnt to play-write, wrote & produced play. Finished. Learnt basic phrasing of language. Done. Will be obsessively interested in something till switch flips, and I move on to explore next thing.


-Love trying new things. Not overly sentimental and like throwing things out regularly. Like making new personal traditions as opposed to observing established ones.


-Not a worrier. Believe worrying is ‘borrowing trouble’. Have inherent optimism that everything ultimately works out and provides learning opportunities. If do feel anxious, ask self what worse logical outcome could be, ponder it and then move on feeling unencumbered.


- However, this can make me nervous of people who are anxious and I will sometimes try to “solve the problem” and accidentally make them feel they are needlessly worrying when it actually is important to them.


- Humane and altruistic but not primarily motivated by interest in other person. I do care but first motivation for me is doing what I perceive I SHOULD do to fulfill standard set for myself. I volunteer ect. because I think it is the right thing for me to do and then only secondly, for unselfish reasons.


- I don’t expect the same of other’s or even really care if they aren’t interested in those things. I might think about how the world would be better if we all did certain things, but ultimately I know everyone has do what is right for them personally and set individual priorities. I only truly care if I am living up to my vision for myself. So that I can like myself and be content. Standards for myself are probably a bit ridiculous, so is fault but also has led to extraordinary life?


- Intensely private in some ways. Would rather take pic than be in one or even share a pic = feels like person still ‘has me’ even when I am not there. Will share generic art have made but rare to share truly personal art. Easy to perform (sing, dance) in front of crowd but very hard to do one-on-one unless I trust that person implicitly.


- But, in other ways not so private. No problem skinny dipping or being very physically expressive. Naturally affectionate. Will easily and freely share info I don’t consider as “truly mattering”.


- I like to rally people for things I believe in, get the ball rolling and leave. Will delegate team to handle things and move on to the next thing I am interested in - occasionally checking back in to make sure things are on track - and that everyone feels heard. Because I care, but also because I desire success and change.


- Hate small talk. To point that will wait and watch until can leave social occasion un-noticed and slip out. Unless can find even one good conversational partner, then the event is redeemed.


- Like living alone, choose to work alone.


- Don't care much about authority like government or community. Left home at 16 and Dad disowned me over a difference I would not give in to (we are close now ). Don't care for rules or schedules. Obedience is relative to: if I believe in/agree with authority. I decide what I believe in, regardless of what the rest of the world decides to do.


- Was victim {am victor} of violent crime and waited years before even mentioning it to one other person. Most of what I think matters: stays inside me. Very occasionally I trust someone to be a hearing ear or see all the different sides of me.


- Have huge social network but schedule that part of my life largely as obligation. Steals energy. Happiest alone or with one or a few loved ones. Times when full house or being at a party also thrills me. But, trying to stick to what is inherently natural...


-Will ‘test’ a person if want to know them more intimately. Difficulty trusting initially. Once I feel comfortable - my undying loyalty is “set” - unless there is a HUGE violation.


-Prefer: "leave morals of the world alone and worry more about your own" philosophy.


-Care less about people liking or approving of me and MORE about them accurately perceiving who I am. Want them to know or understand me. Then, liking me is a bonus. Because unless I feel they "get" me I won't accept their compliments or believe their approval is accurate anyway. So, this can make me seem impersonal & somewhat removed from true intimacy.


- Hate closed ends. Nothing is written in stone and major beliefs may be revised tomorrow. Endless possibilities and want to try them all (new restaurants, new ways of using the body, new ways of looking at things, new paths etc). Figure out how everything forms to make a big picture. But, always looking at the big picture view first and smaller details secondary. Both important!


- Love changing and believe it’s essential, as long as my core stays true. Believe most conclusions or judgments probably benefit from amending.


- I like to know exactly where I am on a road. But, if the end of the road is uncertain, that is ok. Don't believe in emotional closure so much as acceptance and processing that leads to different levels of contentment.


- Cautious about declaring things ‘ideal’ or the ‘best’ or the ‘embodiment’ or ‘standard’. Every time I use the word favourite or any other superlative it feels a bit uncomfortable because I know there are probably other options and don’t like to ‘close a case’ or not leave ‘room open’.

- Often more comfortable in social settings with strangers than with people I know or even like.


- I don’t like the sensation of feeling needed or relied on. I WILL be there, willingly and mightily but I find it stifling if I feel it’s expected. I like friendship that is no obligation. See ya when I see ya and we’ll pick up just like the last time we had a great time together. If I sense the person has expectations of me, I may disappear. (To my and other's chagrin) I am not the type of friend that talks to you or sees you every day. The only exception in this regard is a committed romantic relationship. I experience that differently.


- I am not perceived socially as quiet or introverted. But, I am hugely shy and introverted. It just is all inside my head. My eyes are big and expressive, my energy is positive and easy-going. In groups I am not quiet and can be very social and exuberant. But, if deep in thought or alone I am quiet and even stern looking. And, even in a crowd or conversation there is a part of me that is still a lone observer.


- Not dreamy (was when little) or absent-minded but do get tangled in multitude of thoughts. Love intense conversation. Prefer direct communication. Even if it hurts, I want to hear the truth. But, I will only be balls-to-wall honest with people I trust. So, I am a hypocrite in this sense.


- Want to think less about future and be more in the moment. Am idealistic but very interested in hard science, business practices… Romantic but in a pragmatic way. Value respectful team-work over flowers and poetry.


- Extremely playful (to fault at times ). Love to laugh. Literally worship clever, dry, off-color, word-based humor. Hugely creative in every aspect of life.


- When stressed tendency to withdraw, isolate, create art. Playful interaction, planning/trying new things or brainstorming debates will pull me out of it quickly. If dealing with it solo: setting goals and getting out are best things.


- Easy-tempered and easy to live with. But unless person can draw me out/read me they might never have a clue when I was actually upset and might wonder how much actually knew me.


- Like paying bills on time, making lists…because works for success in home/business. But, natural disposition more laid-back and disorganized. Prefer house to be lived in and peaceful then “perfectly kept”.


- Have used a chalkboard as a coffee table (games!), had my bed in the middle of the living room (great for watching movies!) Like decorating and living in ways that involve lateral thinking. Find people easily won over to things they initially think are strange & I care more about just doing the things that appeal to me.


- Even if recipe works perfectly one time, will change it the next. Prefer no recipe at all. Can’t stand doing things the same more than once unless there is VERY good reason. Even then, I am probably still thinking about how it could be done differently while retaining the efficiency.


- Next to living a life that holds integrity to who I am, I most value making meaningful connections. Which is ironic because I also hold back But, the desire to make connections is stronger in the end then desire to keep to myself.


- Instead of teaching or raising children with ‘would’s’ and ‘should’s’ I like the idea of teaching them reason and logic and letting them ultimately choose what meld’s with their beliefs. Not letting the tail wag the dog - I believe in discipline but more letting them be who they were born to be, then fulfilling parental expectations.


- But, when taking care of children or animals I also have a tendency to observe them with amused or scientifically detached observation. Fascinated by seeing what they will do… Have to remind myself of responsibility first and learning/entertainment value second.


- I don’t have many ‘deal breakers’ but if someone continues to question or argue with a CORE belief I hold and is disparaging or persistently close-minded, that may lead to a breakdown in communication. Prefer kind and calm communications even in conflict.


- Continue to receive feedback that am exceptionally easy to get along with but 1) can make people feel they have to meet a certain standard and 2) people wish they had more access to me and I would share or rely on them more (sigh).


- Because my background is in marketing and journalism I can appear more probing and external than my natural disposition or what feels most comfortable. Being a teacher also has a bearing on this. Because I am a writer I have had revising and editing drilled into me. I think this is why my posts seem focused. It's rare they are '1st draft'.

 

[Z Buck McFate]

Bringing this quote over to this thread:

Maybe consider the functions alone as the SFJ descriptions are most unfortunate.

I agree (a lot) about SFJ descriptions being really unfortunate, but find most Fe descriptions to be equally as unhelpful. A lot of stuff you wrote above- sounds Fi according to most function descriptions, but that precisely why a lot of FJs mistype as FPs.

At this point, if there were a pool on what type you might end up identifying as, my money would go on ENFJ. It's the expressiveness.

I'm on my phone right now (woke up, couldn't get back to sleep, grabbed phone hoping it would make me sleepy) and don't have the patience to type out a whole thing on tiny keypad- I'll likely come back later to finish.

 

[Hawthorne]

My mind is oriented to enneagram and I read a lot more E5 in the above than I did E4. so/sx or sx/sp since I think you're both synflow and merging. No opinion on wing and I admit to thinking Fe > Fi before the mistyped members thread.

 

[Norrsken]

My mind is going between INFP and ENFJ for you, [MENTION=27162]Cloudpatrol[/MENTION].
[MENTION=25377]SearchingforPeace[/MENTION] and I talked about your functions before and he agrees to you being an ENFJ, on account of your post on one of his threads about enjoying nature; he said that the way you described having fun in nature sounded like tert-Se rather than inferior-Se. What do you think?

 

[Dreamer]

My mind is going between INFP and ENFJ for you, [MENTION=27162]Cloudpatrol[/MENTION].
[MENTION=25377]SearchingforPeace[/MENTION] and I talked about your functions before and he agrees to you being an ENFJ, on account of your post on one of his threads about enjoying nature; he said that the way you described having fun in nature sounded like tert-Se rather than inferior-Se. What do you think?

I've been thinking about ENFJ as well but wanted to wait a bit to see if any other potential clues may arise through her posts. The way she examines people and really wants to build that deep relationship. Wanting to see past that superficial level of friendship, has me leaning NFJ rather than SFJ if that's where other forum members are heading (without saying it just yet). Of course this doesn't mean SFJs can't go deep, don't jump on my words ya'll! Thank you.

Just comparing to my ENFJ friend. Like both of us love to talk about the big picture, deeper meaning behind life and get to know people on a deeper level, but he does so for the sole purpose of actually getting to know that person, whereas I do it more for my own personal collection of knowledge on people, through that person's experience. I still love to bond with people, but there's that sort of "detachment" there and I don't feel that from you at all. So of the NFs, I'm leaning towards NFJ rather than NFP.

 

[Starry]

Bringing this quote over to this thread:



I agree (a lot) about SFJ descriptions being really unfortunate, but find most Fe descriptions to be equally as unhelpful. A lot of stuff you wrote above- sounds Fi according to most function descriptions, but that precisely why a lot of FJs mistype as FPs.

At this point, if there were a pool on what type you might end up identifying as, my money would go on ENFJ. It's the expressiveness.

I'm on my phone right now (woke up, couldn't get back to sleep, grabbed phone hoping it would make me sleepy) and don't have the patience to type out a whole thing on tiny keypad- I'll likely come back later to finish.

Yah...I actually hesitated writing that when I recalled what the Fe descriptions read like as well...but I did think it would be better than the SFJ descriptions which I'm waiting for [MENTION=24479]themightyfetus[/MENTION] to single-handedly rewrite for the entire world.

I skimmed [MENTION=27162]Cloudpatrol[/MENTION]'s responses...well...a few minutes ago and I actually saw a lot of FJ in them...and yes, ENFJ works.


edit: I would add that she seems very e2

 

[21%]

I'm terrible at typing people, but from my impression so far you don't really give an INFP vibe.

Sorry that's all I've got at the moment

 

[Tater]

enfj is an interesting theory but if she was one i doubt she would be saying that she lives internally. of the two fe dom types, enfjs push the hardest in the external world. they tend to be very outwardly present with the added 'kick' that se brings to the table.

furthermore, she seems more process driven than outcome driven.
[MENTION=27162]Cloudpatrol[/MENTION] , this isn't mbti, but i'd be interested to hear what your top 4 scores are on this test: HelloQuizzy.com: The Socionics Test

 

[SearchingforPeace]

enfj is an interesting theory but if she was one i doubt she would be saying that she lives internally. of the two fe dom types, enfjs push the hardest in the external world. they tend to be very outwardly present with the added 'kick' that se brings to the table.

furthermore, she seems more process driven than outcome driven.
[MENTION=27162]Cloudpatrol[/MENTION] , this isn't mbti, but i'd be interested to hear what your top 4 scores are on this test: HelloQuizzy.com: The Socionics Test

As a ENFJ, it is a battle between the internal and external. Inf Ti is a pull.....like all Inferior functions. So I thought of myself for decades as some cold, introverted thinker, even as I lived as a pretty social guy looking for interaction.

I spend a lot of time in inside my mind. Ni really plays a role here as well. But I am most alive and in the flow state when I am interacting with others....

 

[Pionart]

enfj is an interesting theory but if she was one i doubt she would be saying that she lives internally. of the two fe dom types, enfjs push the hardest in the external world. they tend to be very outwardly present with the added 'kick' that se brings to the table.

furthermore, she seems more process driven than outcome driven.
[MENTION=27162]Cloudpatrol[/MENTION] , this isn't mbti, but i'd be interested to hear what your top 4 scores are on this test: HelloQuizzy.com: The Socionics Test

I like this post. You're right that ENFJ have a noteworthy outward presence. ENTJs are similar in that regard, but I guess ENTJs are more self-contained, whereas with an ENFJ the focus is on -you-.

That's a cool test and I want to point out what I thought were some of the most interesting questions:

3
Do you tend to see...

Resources as scarce but ideas can be freely shared
Ideas as scarce but resources can be freely shared

Personally, I think I do tend to behave in line with the first one, however I feel that the second one is more correct, but then I feel that neither is the actual answer so, ehh...

2
Do you explain...

How things are, e.g. "The situation is improved."
How things progress, e.g. "The situation is improving."

I picked (b) for this one, since the only time (a) would be true, in my opinion, is at the end of time!!!!

7
Do you think that...

Goals should fit the methods
Methods should fit the goals

For this one, I'm sure it's (b)... I mean, isn't that the whole purpose of moral philosophy?

Ok, well... pretty much all of the questions were really cool and had deep meaning to them, but I got this as my result:

44% LII, 55% ESE, 66% SEI, 66% ILE, 55% LSI, 38% EIE, 42% IEI, 44% SLE, 39% ESI, 55% LIE, 45% ILI, 44% SEE, 53% EII, 38% LSE, 52% SLI and 42% IEE!

 

[Tater]

As a ENFJ, it is a battle between the internal and external. Inf Ti is a pull.....like all Inferior functions. So I thought of myself for decades as some cold, introverted thinker, even as I lived as a pretty social guy looking for interaction.

I spend a lot of time in inside my mind. Ni really plays a role here as well. But I am most alive and in the flow state when I am interacting with others....

i think western society has generally expected men to be the 'thinkers'. consequentially this assumption is often reinforced and un-scrutinized.

edit: as an fe dom, you would be more likely to want to fit those standards.

so, even if she is an enfj, the burden of proof weighs heavier in her case than it would in your case.

if i were to compare your activity with hers, i would say that hers is informative while yours is decisive.

for example, i would say that she hangs back for opportunities to add raw data, while you tend to carry conversations and persuade people of your position.

for citation, i'd mention this thread vs. your thread about two-party politics.

i see two very different interaction styles.

what's your explanation? syn-flow vs. contra-flow? even so, she would have to be pushed pretty early on to get into the 'other side' of things with ti. if her mom was enfj, then pressure seems more unlikely to manifest...

 

[SearchingforPeace]

i think western society has generally expected men to be the 'thinkers'. consequentially this assumption is often reinforced and un-scrutinized.

edit: as an fe dom, you would be more likely to want to fit those standards.

so, even if she is an enfj, the burden of proof weighs heavier in her case than it would in your case.

if i were to compare your activity with hers, i would say that hers is informative while yours is decisive.

for example, i would say that she hangs back for opportunities to add raw data, while you tend to carry conversations and persuade people of your position.

for citation, i'd mention this thread vs. your thread about two-party politics.

i see two very different interaction styles.

what's your explanation? syn-flow vs. contra-flow? even so, she would have to be pushed pretty early on to get into the 'other side' of things with ti. if her mom was enfj, then pressure seems more unlikely to manifest...

I see enneagram differences as the primary factors.

 

[Tater]

I see enneagram differences as the primary factors.

what enneagram do you think she is? 9w1? that would be the only half-way reasonable error-term. even so, the differences shouldn't be so day-and-night.

despite their more benign stereotypes, 4 tends to be intense in showing where they stand, and 2 can be domineering.

if she were an enfj 4 or 2, wouldn't she be exceeding your own intensity in overt persuasion?