Identity Relationships (ever been in one? what was it like?)

[Ingrid in grids]

I've had a number of very close friendships with other EII females. I probably felt most understood in those friendships. They were all very involved. I haven't met many EII males, but the ones I have met I've found a bit hard to reach out to. If my friendships with the females is anything to go by, I can understand how a friendship with that level of easy understanding could easily develop into a romantic relationship. I think romantically I tend to look for more contrast, though.

 

[1487610420]

the bourne identity

 

[Kheledon]

No no no I didn't mean the article, I was implying to the ISTJs' usual constant reference to the rules which is a part if their nature that I don't like, I think the article is interesting though

Sorry for misunderstanding you. What you describe is supposed to be typical of our dual, LSI. This couple can change the world, theoretically, because LSI will enforce your rules. In this duality couple (EIE/LSI), EIE is supposed to be the visionary with its head in the clouds envisioning a better future, whereas LSI has its feet on the ground and possesses the force of will to make the EIE's vision into reality by "enforcing" the rules of conduct that emerge from the EIE's vision.

The LSI must believe in the EIE's vision, but if they're in love, this shouldn't be a problem because LSI can't see the future well at all. If LSI senses its own weaknesses, trusts that the EIE can see the future better, and believes in the EIE and its vision, LSI has the natural ability both to stabilize and comfort the emotionally-unstable EIE, plus the pure strength of will to convert the EIE's vision into reality.

Supposedly, that's how this particular dual pair should function.

 

[Kheledon]

Similar information processing but disparity in a few core values/different stages in life. I am actually grateful to know the individual because it's sometimes like looking into a mirror and he's more of a natural optimist and go-getter.

There's no doubt that two EIEs are going to have disparate, cherished Fi values in their id. These will be both static (hard to change) and strong if, as I postulate, the id functions are actually stronger than the ego functions, and the job of the ego is to keep the id in check so that a well-developed human being can choose not to react to a given stimulus (and this separates us from less-intelligent life forms which must respond to stimulus).

The trick with another EIE, I think, is to figure out which of your Fi values are cherished and which of your EIE mate's Fi values are cherished. When these cherished Fi values conflict, there is a problem that must be addressed and negotiated. Mercifully, because the EIEs are both Js, they will want to address these conflicts. They will also be both empathetic and sympathetic to their identical mate's Fi values, and because they're both looking for harmony and a strong, interpersonal union, they can compromise well together. The fact that they're both "idealist/humanitarians" (NF) gives them a powerful incentive to compromise with one another. As natural givers, they want to please the ones they love and will compromise on certain Fi values in order to maintain their relationships, as relationships tend to be of singular and extreme importance to an EIE.

Supposedly, one of the more serious problems with an EIE/EIE identity pairing is that they have a devil of a time reaching decisions on important issues together.

Often wavering and hesitant, which makes it difficult for him to make important decisions.

Socionics - the16types.info - ENFj The Mentor profile by Gulenko

For what that's worth.

 

[GIjade]

Looks like something I want to put on the outside of my shoes.

 

[geedoenfj]

Sorry for misunderstanding you. What you describe is supposed to be typical of our dual, LSI. This couple can change the world, theoretically, because LSI will enforce your rules. In this duality couple (EIE/LSI), EIE is supposed to be the visionary with its head in the clouds envisioning a better future, whereas LSI has its feet on the ground and possesses the force of will to make the EIE's vision into reality by "enforcing" the rules of conduct that emerge from the EIE's vision.

The LSI must believe in the EIE's vision, but if they're in love, this shouldn't be a problem because LSI can't see the future well at all. If LSI senses its own weaknesses, trusts that the EIE can see the future better, and believes in the EIE and its vision, LSI has the natural ability both to stabilize and comfort the emotionally-unstable EIE, plus the pure strength of will to convert the EIE's vision into reality.

Supposedly, that's how this particular dual pair should function.

I'm still in the process of understanding socionics, however this would make us a good partners in work since I think I can always depend on ISTJ on watching some very complicated details, gathering information, making sure everything is on point (something that I'm not specifically brilliant at) while I have a clear vision of where I want to be in the future and what strategy should I adapt, but as a husband and wife mmm I don't know.. I always thought of them as the least possibility for a romance, I think that's interesting ..
Nevertheless, I think I'd prefer an identity relationship with another ENFJ rather than a dual, ENFJs are just so lovely

 

[ZNP-TBA]

When two ENTPs meet [MENTION=5643]EcK[/MENTION]

^ Identity relationship

 

[EcK]

When two ENTPs meet [MENTION=5643]EcK[/MENTION]

^ Identity relationship

That thought has crossed my mind quite a few times.
by 'that thought' I mean everything in this comic.

 

[Kheledon]

Nevertheless, I think I'd prefer an identity relationship with another ENFJ rather than a dual, ENFJs are just so lovely

I hear you on that. Face-to-face (and especially body to body, as close as one can imagine) two ENFjs can virtually read one anothers' minds. They're even better at reading one anothers' bodies. I've seen it and felt it, and it's amazing ... utterly indescribable. When the two of them are happy, healthy, and in love a "love wave" expands around them that affects nearly everyone they encounter. Their happiness is contagious.

For reasons they can't even identify or notice, nearly everyone that encounters a couple of happy ENFjs catches the love, starts thinking about love, and starts seeking love. I had a client of mine, so inspired, who, at the age of 71, recently sent a letter to the only person he truly fell in love with in his entire life--some thirty years ago (the only time, he said, that he had ever really "fallen in love" and which he forever regretted not properly pursuing). In the letter, he asked to meet his long-lost love once again. I wrote the letter for him. She responded and agreed to meet him, and the sole cause of this action on the part of my client was witnessing and feeling two ENFjs in love.

That said, those same two ENFjs struggle enormously when they have to solve complicated problems. Someone has to take over the T duties in the relationship, and they both know that they stink at it.

 

[ZNP-TBA]

I hear you on that. Face-to-face (and especially body to body, as close as one can imagine) two ENFjs can virtually read one anothers' minds. They're even better at reading one anothers' bodies. I've seen it and felt it, and it's amazing ... utterly indescribable. When the two of them are happy, healthy, and in love a "love wave" expands around them that affects nearly everyone they encounter. Their happiness is contagious. For reasons they can't even identify or notice, nearly everyone that encounters a couple of happy ENFjs catches the love, starts thinking about love, and starts seeking love. I had a client of mine, so inspired, who, at the age of 71, sent a letter to the one person he truly fell in love with some thirty years ago (the only time in his life), asking to meet her again. I wrote the letter for him. She agreed to meet him, and the sole cause of this action was witnessing and feeling two ENFjs in love.

That said, those same two ENFjs struggle enormously when they have to solve complicated problems. Someone has to take over the T duties in the relationship, and they both know they stink at it.

Well I guess we found the next break out author of some future typology love novel. The protagonist won't even have a name, just ENFJ.

 

[Kheledon]

Well I guess we found the next break out author of some future typology love novel. The protagonist won't even have a name, just ENFJ.

That's a great idea. I have a couple of other novels I need to write first (as I must change the world and make it better if I can), but that would be a really good one.

 

[ZNP-TBA]

That's a great idea. I have a couple of other novels I need to write first (as I must change the world and make it better if I can), but that would be a really good one.

What's the topic of these couple of novels you're writing?

 

[Kheledon]

What's the topic of these couple of novels you're writing?

Loving relationships, of course, but not between a pair of ENFjs.

 

[ZNP-TBA]

Loving relationships, of course, but not between a pair of ENFjs.

Do you believe there is a logic to love?

 

[Kheledon]

Do you believe there is a logic to love?

Interesting question. I believe loving is logical because I believe that love is a primary and essential human need. That said, I think that love, itself, is illogical (in Jungian cognitive terms), and that makes it somewhat difficult for a T-dom to recognize and grasp. T-doms also tend to be quite suspicious of it, in my experience, and for good reason. It's dangerous, for love makes one very vulnerable, emotionally.

 

[ZNP-TBA]

Interesting question. I believe loving is logical because I believe that love is a primary and essential human need. That said, I think that love, itself, is illogical (in Jungian cognitive terms), and that makes it somewhat difficult for a T-dom to recognize and grasp. T-doms also tend to be quite suspicious of it, in my experience, and for good reason. It's dangerous, for love makes one very vulnerable, emotionally.

Can you explain how love is a primary and essential human need? Do you mean for individual people or humanity in the abstract?

 

[Kheledon]

Can you explain how love is a primary and essential human need? Do you mean for individual people or humanity in the abstract?

I can't tell whether you're asking one question or two, here, but, if it's two questions, let me focus on the second one only.

In my opinion, each and every unique human being needs love, and this applies to all human beings. We are loving, social creatures, and we're often both miserable and destructive when our needs aren't getting met.

Hope that's responsive in some way.

 

[geedoenfj]

Interesting question. I believe loving is logical because I believe that love is a primary and essential human need. That said, I think that love, itself, is illogical (in Jungian cognitive terms), and that makes it somewhat difficult for a T-dom to recognize and grasp. T-doms also tend to be quite suspicious of it, in my experience, and for good reason. It's dangerous, for love makes one very vulnerable, emotionally.

Some NTs refuse to admit the importance of expressing love and sometimes deny they have feelings in the first place, but they believe love is only shown in actions and duties towards the one they love, my ENTP is one of the least romantic guys you can ever encounter with, in fact he's the ultimate anti romantic man and cruel at many times, specially in times when I most in need for someone to stand by me like when I'm in the ER (I've been there multiple times) he refuses to help at all instead he just shush me and treat me as if it's my fault that I'm sick, so I have to hardly get off the bed and serve myself..
I think no other woman can put up with that, even his family admit that I'm such a strong woman to stay with him
but yeah, it's a marriage

 

[Kheledon]

Some NTs refuse to admit the importance of expressing love and sometimes deny they have feelings in the first place, but they believe love is only shown in actions and duties towards the one they love, my ENTP is one of the least romantic guys you can ever encounter with, in fact he's the ultimate anti romantic man and cruel at many times, specially in times when I most in need for someone to stand by me like when I'm in the ER (I've been there multiple times) he refuses to help at all instead he just shush me and treat me as if it's my fault that I'm sick, so I have to hardly get off the bed and serve myself..
I think no other woman can put up with that, even his family admit that I'm such a strong woman to stay with him
but yeah, it's a marriage

 

[ZNP-TBA]

Some NTs refuse to admit the importance of expressing love and sometimes deny they have feelings in the first place, but they believe love is only shown in actions and duties towards the one they love, my ENTP is one of the least romantic guys you can ever encounter with, in fact he's the ultimate anti romantic man and cruel at many times, specially in times when I most in need for someone to stand by me like when I'm in the ER (I've been there multiple times) he refuses to help at all instead he just shush me and treat me as if it's my fault that I'm sick, so I have to hardly get off the bed and serve myself..
I think no other woman can put up with that, even his family admit that I'm such a strong woman to stay with him
but yeah, it's a marriage

Your husband sounds like a douche. Sorry.