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Cooperation: Islam and Christianity

Thalassa

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Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors.

There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.

How about .... I have Aspergers and sensitive stress, communication, and need distance? Hold back ... Hold back the river let me look in your eyes...

How about I don't believe you when every single Muslim majority nation seems to like persecuting anyone of any other faith - not like in the sense of stopping someone from having an abortion or telling them domestic partnership is better - but honest to God Nazi Germany shit, and murdering people for disagreeing with Islam peacefully.

The only thing you have to worry about in the West is someone drawing a cartoon of your prophet, a woman wearing a mini skirt, or you not getting free dole from the government. ..but we should hold back. That's rich.

If you are for real, you're very misguided.
 

fetus

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I tried reading this thread but my eyes glazed over. No idea what's going on here.
 

Mole

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No. I have Asperger. You are very hurting.

I am sympathetic to those with Aspergers and I don't think you should allow yourself to be hurt.

So perhaps it is best to advise you that Typology Central does not make diagnoses and does not give therapy.

So you might like to consider talking to a trusted friend or a trusted professional and seek ways to make the most of your Aspergers.

I am sorry you are hurting but you are making yourself a punching bag on Typology Central. You can probably find somewhere where you can develop your gifts.
 

Mustafa

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I'm trying to get us together and she has made it a cause to hunt muslims, and muslims are good people.
 

Mustafa

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I am sorry you are hurting but you are making yourself a punching bag on Typology Central. You can probably find somewhere where you can develop your gifts.
I am talking to that woman, and seeing if I can get her less motivated to hunt muslims ... They talked about Social Justice Warriors, do you think you are such?
[MENTION=6877]Marmotini[/MENTION]
 

Mole

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I am talking to that woman, and seeing if I can get her less motivated to hunt muslims ... They talked about Social Justice Warriors, do you think you are such?
[MENTION=6877]Marmotini[/MENTION]

I support liberal democracy and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

I don't think Marmotini is hunting muslims. But I do think muslims see themselves as victims even while they are mounting global terrorism.

So when you make threats it is against the background of Islamic terrorism.

I suspect you don't know why you are here, it may be that you are simply lonely.
 

Coriolis

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I admit that I might be biased through my agnostic point-of-view.

And I accept that many parents expose their children to other religions since an early age. But there's a difference between sharing one's religion with one's children and telling them that it's the absolute right one.

My point is that presenting their religion as the ultimate truth to someone that will rarely if ever question what they say in that stage of their lives, and trust them completely, is immoral to me. Young children are incapable of critical thinking when it comes to their parents, and when those parents tell them that a very debatable belief is the actual truth, they believe it entirely. And that is irresponsible. Though of course, I'll assume most of those parents just don't know any better.
Now the highlighted is not what you wrote the first time. You wrote:

I do have a problem when children are taught the "truth" of their parents' religion. Such irresponsibility, honestly.
Teaching your children the truth as you know it, and insisting to them that all other perspectives are categorically wrong, are two very different things. Every child grows up speaking the language of his/her parents, or whomever is raising them. That doesn't require that they be told other languages are bad or wrong, to be avoided rather than studied. If parents don't provide spiritual guidance to children, even if it is to explain how they think spiritual beliefs are unnecessary, this leaves a vacuum for other people to fill as the child grows up.

What part?
The part about spiritual truth being subjective.

It doesn't seem this is true for everyone. Faith allows one to believe in something with impunity even if that belief is shown to be wrong compared to the facts of reality. I'd agree with this claim that we'd change our minds if we've arrived to our previous beliefs by way of reason and evidence and not faith or indoctrination.
If something can be disproved (falsified), it is not a matter of faith but rather of scientific or historical fact. Faith is acceptance of something that cannot be proven.

Your comment about the Trinity not making logical sense made me chuckle. If God is really an all-knowing supreme being, would you really expect human minds to be capable of fully understanding such an entity? Herein lies the problem that most people have with faith, they can't accept that anything could be more intelligent or capable than man-- this of course makes no sense in light of the concept of deity.
The trinity makes no more or less sense than any other construct humans use to try to relate to the transcendent, infinite entity that is Deity. IME, why limit it to three? Even the various pantheons of Hindu, Native American, and pre-Christian traditions can be viewed as simply aspects of a single divine entity, though not all believers see them this way.

Why not? I love Jesus. He is my prophet. One of them. One of the greatest. And only Islam mentions Jesus, not Hinduism, not Buddhism or Judaism.
Bahai faith honors Jesus, and Muhammad, and Abraham. As expressed in their doctrine of progressive revelation, all the divine prophets came to reveal the same truth to humanity, in different ways suitable to the different times and circumstances. And the Bahai's are persecuted in Shiite Iran.

That said, your claim that Christian Faith and Islam are more simmilar than not, is false from a Christian perspective. You seem to not quite understand some of the theology: Christ said that no one comes to the Father, except through him-- through the law-breaking grace that he gave us by making a sinless sacrifice of himself. This is the main difference between Islam and Christ: in Christ I have grace from a loving God, so I don't have to be perfect (which I couldn't achieve anyway)! Good fruit and a desire to live a loving, God-honoring life comes naturally out of that freedom-- which is totally different than seeking to measure up, strive or attain perfection based on a legal structure (of sin). Christ defeated sin's power over us, and all we need do is claim that-- that's why, in Christianity, there is no "worst sin" because my God is bigger than any mess we humans could find ourselves in. Islam and Judaism are still slaves to sin, with no way to sustainably atone for it. And let's be real, you sin, I sin, we all are guilty of sin. Christ just provided an eternal solution. The Christian God sacrificed his own son for his people, Allah expects you to earn your own way (even though no one can ever attain perfection enough, to be in the presence of a holy God).

So bottom line: my God and your God have very different character traits, and we have totally different ideas about how one deals with the sin problem.
Actually, "your God" and "Mustafa's God" have many commonalities as well, perhaps because they really are the same God (perhaps because there really is only one?) Have you read anything by Joseph Campbell? He does a good job of showing the common threads among all the world's religions. And no, that isn't justification to merge them all into one holy mess, any more than we should all adopt a common language, cuisine, or style of dress. There are many paths up to the mountain top. Put another way, God never stops reaching out to people, to bring them closer to him.

There's also no scriptural basis of comparison as to how husbands and wives should behave, while wives should submit to their husbands, husbands are instructed to be gentle and loving to their wives, giving her no cause to hate him. In Islam race isn't an issue, but they still make a huge difference between men and women, while in Christianity while there's also no difference between "Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, MALE NOR FEMALE"...there's no scriptural grounds for beating or demeaning women or treatment of women as second class citizens after the gospels of Christ.
There is no difference between male or female, until there is. One of the many contradictions in the Bible. At best, the Bible offers a kinder, gentler sexism.
 

Lark

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I'm actually interested in Islam, I've read about have of Washington Irvinig's book on Mohammed, I've read quotations from the Quran and found the idea of a "Zen Sunni" in the novel Dune interesting.

Although I find that the culture and religion exhibits some traits which I find disturbing, I am not talking about all of the things which secular society or atheists find problematic about Islam because those generally apply to all religions, but I do think that Islam involves more of a constant surrender and submissive posture, I do not believe that man should have any illusions about himself or God but that I dont believe God is a "Persian King" or desires constant capitulation to an authoritarian, patriarchal vision.
 

Mustafa

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[MENTION=9811]Coriolis[/MENTION] I think Bahaullah is considered the fullfillment of the end-times prophecy, springing out from the Shia branch. Likewise in Sunni they say the Prophet Muhammed is not the last prophet. once i heard those with brown eyes are patient and persistent, they got muslim blood and are dangerous therefore. they are like AIDS. you kill bacteria and cancer. if you oppose the democracy (rule of the majority) you get imprisoned in the west.
 

Thalassa

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I am talking to that woman, and seeing if I can get her less motivated to hunt muslims ... They talked about Social Justice Warriors, do you think you are such?
[MENTION=6877]Marmotini[/MENTION]

I don't hunt Muslims. Nor do I want to kill anyone, nor do I want them to die. I have known very nice individual Muslims. However, I'm sure as hell tired of the lie that it's "only the extremists" when Christians or Jews can be arrested or slaughtered in wealthy "mainstream" Saudi Arabia if they don't hide in their respective caves obediently.

A LOT of predatory Western hating Muslims claim to be "sensitive"...it's the sensitivity of narcissism. ..that is overreacting to everyone else not agreeing with your religion.

You really have some nerve, after saying you'll make peace with Christians if they deny Christ and agree He is a minor prophet.

That's why I have a difficult time believing you're a real person.
 

Thalassa

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[MENTION=6877]Marmotini[/MENTION] you lack presicion.

I don't lack precision. Read the article I posted from the very liberal Guardian from six months ago, of where Christians are being executed. They're not necessarily countries where Al Queda, or Boko Haram have invaded. In MAINSTREAM MUSLIM COUNTRIES, with the exception of *secular* Turkey, Islamic governments, apparently in the mainstream, feel it's perfectly fine to punish or exact violence upon people of other faiths for simply wearing religious symbols or celebrating holidays openly.

The hypocrisy is so disgusting, that it's no wonder the same "non extremists" are coming to Europe and complaining about seeing crosses or living next to Jews, even if they aren't terrorists, they want Sharia Law and special treatment.

If I have to wear a freaking hijab in your country, you best shut up about seeing churches and mini skirts from a distance in mine.

If anyone else in this thread missed it, Mr. Sensitivity here suggested that the road to peace is for Christians to deny Christ.

I am so very tired of the poorly informed liberal ass kissing, as well as you framing me as a "Muslim hunter" because I call you out on your bs.

If you are that "sensitive" stop posting here.
 

Mustafa

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No missy. Christians will be judged by their loyality to their own book. Women shouldn't talk in congregations. They can, but you are agressive.

Peace
 

AphroditeGoneAwry

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No missy. Christians will be judged by their loyality to their own book. Women shouldn't talk in congregations. They can, but you are agressive.

Peace

What if the men call themselves women. Who should talk then?
 

Mustafa

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What if the men call themselves women. Who should talk then?

Hi. In our mosque ... Iraqi men don't talk to women except their families, if women would talk they would be sexually objectified, noone can do anything about that. And they would cause temptation, Christians pray to God save us from temptation. Temptation is like a snake.

Sorry for hurting your feelings.

For the same reason women couldn't be priests and can't now be imaams.

- - - Updated - - -

Good afternoon Mustafa.

Hey! :bye:
 

Cowardly

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Hi. In our mosque ... Iraqi men don't talk to women except their families, if women would talk they would be sexually objectified, noone can do anything about that. And they would cause temptation, Christians pray to God save us from temptation. Temptation is like a snake.

Sorry for hurting your feelings.

For the same reason women couldn't be priests and can't now be imaams.
I wonder if you fellows are creating sort of a loop there.

Women are tempting alright, but they become much more tempting if you hide them.
 
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