[Type 7] The Wisdom of the Enneagram Seven

[hjgbujhghg]

I saw the Foo Fighters live and he climbed up the stage rigging, probably 50 feet and continued to play.

Never seen that before.

I am so jealous, where did you see the Foos?

Yeah sounds like Dave , when he plays it seems like he's all over the place, jumps here, runs there, clibms 50ft rigging... He's got thistypical scattered 7ish energy, but he's a great example of what happens when one is able to concentrate this energy toward achiving goals. And it's one hell of a great work he's able to do and I think we all have this kind of thing inside, this energy that can be used to create great things. The biggest obstacle for a 7 is to concentrate this energy toward one goal, to transform it from somthing scattered and all over to place to something productive and creative.
That's why I admire Dave so much he was able to do it.

 

[johnnyyukon]

I am so jealous, where did you see the Foos?

Memphis in May baby!

The biggest obstacle for a 7 is to concentrate this energy toward one goal, to transform it from something scattered and all over to place to something productive and creative.

Yeah, I agree. And it ain't easy. We have charm and charisma and all the potential in the world, but we so easily squander it. Gotta be on our toes.

 

[Starry]

Walt coaches Magic

[MENTION=18694]Magic Qwan[/MENTION]
I tried to find some information on it... What I did find though was vague and in one instance being used commercially to sell a book on temperament I believe. But the poet/writer Walt Whitman actually took an interest in personality theory and from that we understand him to have been one of our people...

I will need more coaching, though...

"This is what you shall do; Love the earth and sun and the animals... stand up for the stupid and crazy, devote your income and labor to others, hate tyrants... have patience and indulgence toward the people, take off your hat to nothing known or unknown or to any man or number of men, go freely with powerful uneducated persons and with the young and with the mothers of families, read these leaves in the open air every season of every year of your life, re-examine all you have been told at school or church or in any book, dismiss whatever insults your own soul and your very flesh shall be a great poem…"

^Notice if you will that Whitman did not say "feel angry and cheated…subsequently wasting more of your precious time for having been exposed to what insults your own soul…and perpetually regret that your reality did not line-up with the *magical ideal in your head*…" No he quite clearly said "dismiss it."

And he's got one more for you...


"I accept reality and dare not question it."


^I get the feeling from this quote that he understood on some meaningful level the dangers of living in an idealized world in your head.



Anyway, Magic Qwan... I've worked with children and young adults for some years now and I'm just going to flat-out tell you not to read any...or anymore Nietzsche until I tell you it's okay to do so haha. No, I'm inappropriately laughing cause that's the kind of sick person I am...but I'm actually being quite serious in what I say. I forget if you are going straight to university now? If so, you will certainly (okay, now that I'm thinking of it maybe not "certainly" these days idk...) In college/university you may be asked/required to read some of his work and that's absolutely fine. But hold-off on attempting to tackle him on your own until you are in a healthier place...mentally, physically, emotionally...and yes...spiritually. More than any other author... I've seen young adults...hell, even older adults...either misunderstand what he is presenting...becoming confused even frightened...or respond poorly to his work/message.

Do, however, see what you can get from this next post though where I will quote him. As you may or may not know about me...I do not believe there are one way pathways to enneagram health as in stress>core>integration. I definitely believe some individuals will at times make healthy connections to their stress point...expressing their stress point in a highly 'integrated' way. Which makes Nietzsche an especially interesting figure to me as I believe there were many times in his career, as a core 5, he was doing just that. He was an e5 making a positive (non-stressful) connection to his stress point....e7.


"The greater the suffering, the greater the potential for joy... Those who wish to experience the fullness of life must also suffer deeply, for it is in recovery from a crippling disease that life is most fully affirmed."

-Nietzsche

 

[Starry]

Amor Fati

Live life!!!

I love this so much Ms. Eyes. How simple it is. How simply beautiful it is. It's really all that needs to be said and I'm so appreciative of you saying it.




I can't wait until [MENTION=5418]Lady_X[/MENTION] and I are both 122 years old and still partying...

this is because I have good reason to believe... that when everyone on the planet is completely bored with me... my sister X will still think I'm quite interesting in all ways and in the things I just have to say. My evidence for this...? Well, it lies in the fact that I...in my scatteredness and poor memory...wouldn't even be able to guess how many times I've repeatedly posted this same quote somewhere on the forum...so thrilled to share it just like it was the first time (over and over again...)

“My formula for greatness in a human being is amor fati: that one wants nothing to be different, not forward, not backward, not in all eternity. Not merely bear what is necessary, still less conceal it...but love it.”

-Nietzsche, On the Genealogy of Morals/Ecce Homo

And Lady_X will then be right there to rep me a wubbie just like it was the first time that happened as well.

Amor fati from wikipedia

Amor fati is a Latin phrase loosely translating to "love of fate" or "love of one's fate". It is used to describe an attitude in which one sees everything that happens in one's life, including suffering and loss, as good.

I was recently talking a bit about my culture of origin on the site...and the painful truth of it is...is I'm no stranger to the Latin concept of Amor Fati. It was just too close for me to see. Too close to home...too embedded in the fabric of my culture...taken for granted and thus not taught. Never explained...and so I had to learn this *thing* from...a German philosopher and poet...with an area of expertise in classical philology. I had to enter in through the back door of my own house.

Even still, when I look back on how I was raised. My God, my own father would never have allowed this kind of thinking to take hold in me had he known... When I stop and consider all of who I am there is no part of me that can comprehend how it is that I came to believe I was...not just entitled to an "all-positive Fati"... (conscious feelings of entitlement came later for me.) No, I absolutely knew my life was going to be 100% awesome the entire time...until it finally occurred to me that it wasn't.

I had to learn as if learning how to walk and talk all over again... how to...not just see but embrace all of life... <-like a 7 (and an Italian for god's sake...and I still need little reminders to myself here and there.)

"How could I wish that my life had been anything other than what it was, for I would not be who I am."

-Nietzsche

 

[Lady_X]

Nietzsche totally ruined the ex husband. Oh God so funny you say that. listen to starry magic.

 

[Starry]

I saw the Foo Fighters live and he climbed up the stage rigging, probably 50 feet and continued to play.

Never seen that before.

Grunge

 

[Starry]

Live life!!!

I don't know if this will work but I had to try and make this bigger.

I also need to make my avatar bigger - dude I keep forgetting.

 

[Starry]

Nietzsche totally ruined the ex husband. Oh God so funny you say that. listen to starry magic.

omg...I had to direct so many people to counseling...I'm not even kidding. I even had a sign on my desk saying...'Whatever you do...Don't read Nietzsche' for a while.

 

[The Great One]

It was when you noticed how I was distancing myself from Ariel wasn't it...?

Great One, I really, really appreciate this. I know I will have more to say on it... but didn't want anymore time to go by prior to thanking you so very much. You are truly Great.

No problem, anytime. Also, I typed it because Elfboy and I have been having a lot of disagreements about the definition of type 7 and all sub-types of type 7. It feels good to have another opinion besides Naranjo.

 

[Avocado]

[MENTION=18694]Magic Qwan[/MENTION]
I tried to find some information on it... What I did find though was vague and in one instance being used commercially to sell a book on temperament I believe. But the poet/writer Walt Whitman actually took an interest in personality theory and from that we understand him to have been one of our people...






"This is what you shall do; Love the earth and sun and the animals... stand up for the stupid and crazy, devote your income and labor to others, hate tyrants... have patience and indulgence toward the people, take off your hat to nothing known or unknown or to any man or number of men, go freely with powerful uneducated persons and with the young and with the mothers of families, read these leaves in the open air every season of every year of your life, re-examine all you have been told at school or church or in any book, dismiss whatever insults your own soul and your very flesh shall be a great poem…"

^Notice if you will that Whitman did not say "feel angry and cheated…subsequently wasting more of your precious time for having been exposed to what insults your own soul…and perpetually regret that your reality did not line-up with the *magical ideal in your head*…" No he quite clearly said "dismiss it."

And he's got one more for you...


"I accept reality and dare not question it."


^I get the feeling from this quote that he understood on some meaningful level the dangers of living in an idealized world in your head.



Anyway, Magic Qwan... I've worked with children and young adults for some years now and I'm just going to flat-out tell you not to read any...or anymore Nietzsche until I tell you it's okay to do so haha. No, I'm inappropriately laughing cause that's the kind of sick person I am...but I'm actually being quite serious in what I say. I forget if you are going straight to university now? If so, you will certainly (okay, now that I'm thinking of it maybe not "certainly" these days idk...) In college/university you may be asked/required to read some of his work and that's absolutely fine. But hold-off on attempting to tackle him on your own until you are in a healthier place...mentally, physically, emotionally...and yes...spiritually. More than any other author... I've seen young adults...hell, even older adults...either misunderstand what he is presenting...becoming confused even frightened...or respond poorly to his work/message.

Do, however, see what you can get from this next post though where I will quote him. As you may or may not know about me...I do not believe there are one way pathways to enneagram health as in stress>core>integration. I definitely believe some individuals will at times make healthy connections to their stress point...expressing their stress point in a highly 'integrated' way. Which makes Nietzsche an especially interesting figure to me as I believe there were many times in his career, as a core 5, he was doing just that. He was an e5 making a positive (non-stressful) connection to his stress point....e7.


"The greater the suffering, the greater the potential for joy... Those who wish to experience the fullness of life must also suffer deeply, for it is in recovery from a crippling disease that life is most fully affirmed."

-Nietzsche

To answer you, [MENTION=10082]Starry[/MENTION] , I am already on my third day of nursing school. I was checking in to say I am going to take a study-leave from TypeC. I will be working part-time in a pharmacy the rest of the time. I have felt the closest thing so far to spirituality when focusing on how to aid people. It will be nice to help people and I will perfect my technique over time. So yes, I will be devoting my time and income to others.

I question all things (or try to), and this has been a point of growth for me. I am becoming less gullible.

The Governing Body of the Jehovah's Witnesses is a tyrant that harms, even kills, many people per day. Should I strike them down in any way possible since they are tyrants? I will tell you now, I will only work within the system to bring them down.

As for Nieztches, I will agree that great struggle brings great rewards if, and only if, your struggles reach fruitation. Otherwise, struggles are struggles, nothing more.


What would healthy connection to e1 look like, and are you sure Nieztches was an e5?

The rest of Walt has yet to strike a chord in me.

 

[Avocado]

I love this so much Ms. Eyes. How simple it is. How simply beautiful it is. It's really all that needs to be said and I'm so appreciative of you saying it.




I can't wait until [MENTION=5418]Lady_X[/MENTION] and I are both 122 years old and still partying...

this is because I have good reason to believe... that when everyone on the planet is completely bored with me... my sister X will still think I'm quite interesting in all ways and in the things I just have to say. My evidence for this...? Well, it lies in the fact that I...in my scatteredness and poor memory...wouldn't even be able to guess how many times I've repeatedly posted this same quote somewhere on the forum...so thrilled to share it just like it was the first time (over and over again...)





And Lady_X will then be right there to rep me a wubbie just like it was the first time that happened as well.






I was recently talking a bit about my culture of origin on the site...and the painful truth of it is...is I'm no stranger to the Latin concept of Amor Fati. It was just too close for me to see. Too close to home...too embedded in the fabric of my culture...taken for granted and thus not taught. Never explained...and so I had to learn this *thing* from...a German philosopher and poet...with an area of expertise in classical philology. I had to enter in through the back door of my own house.

Even still, when I look back on how I was raised. My God, my own father would never have allowed this kind of thinking to take hold in me had he known... When I stop and consider all of who I am there is no part of me that can comprehend how it is that I came to believe I was...not just entitled to an "all-positive Fati"... (conscious feelings of entitlement came later for me.) No, I absolutely knew my life was going to be 100% awesome the entire time...until it finally occurred to me that it wasn't.

I had to learn as if learning how to walk and talk all over again... how to...not just see but embrace all of life... <-like a 7 (and an Italian for god's sake...and I still need little reminders to myself here and there.)

You are ahead of me in wisdom, and your soul is far more alive than mine...

I just fear screwing up on this job and hurting somebody. I am scattered, misplace things, and forget details I should remember.
I see these as my primary flaws.

 

[Avocado]

[MENTION=10082]Starry[/MENTION]

I like you so much that I literally hand typed this description straight from "The Wisdom of the Enneagram" book. This is the description from that book for the sexual 7, word for word....

I still think I am a Social dominant but I wonder if I might be SX secondary? So/sp and So/Sx look similar...

 

[The Great One]

I still think I am a Social dominant but I wonder if I might be SX secondary? So/sp and So/Sx look similar...

If you are Sx second then you are a sp/sx 6w7 and are social last.

 

[Lady_X]

You are ahead of me in wisdom, and your soul is far more alive than mine...

I just fear screwing up on this job and hurting somebody. I am scattered, misplace things, and forget details I should remember.
I see these as my primary flaws.

i am too but surprisingly not at all as a mom...i mean i'm scattered and forget stuff but i'm super cautious and careful about their safety n stuff. i think you'll find you can be hyper focused/aware when it matters.

 

[Avocado]

i am too but surprisingly not at all as a mom...i mean i'm scattered and forget stuff but i'm super cautious and careful about their safety n stuff. i think you'll find you can be hyper focused/aware when it matters.

I put Ice Cream in the fridge a few days ago, tried to start my car with a wooden spoon yesterday, lost my wallet in pants I was still wearing today, and tonight I almost threw a letter in the trash instead of putting it in the mailbox tonight (I caught it, though)

Thank you for encouraging me, but I have always had anxiety about helping people because I am accident prone, but I desire to help people because I feel it is the only thing worth doing and helping people gives meaning to my life.

You are right, though...
The more important a task is to me, the less likely I'll mess up...though it is always possible...

 

[Lady_X]

sure no i get it. one of my biggest fears is that i'll be so absent minded that i'll just accidentally die some unpossibly stupid way....

 

[Avocado]

sure no i get it. one of my biggest fears is that i'll be so absent minded that i'll just accidentally die some unpossibly stupid way....

Same.

 

[Avocado]

Life is good...

It is truly amazing we can live in such a time that we can learn as freely as we can. To understand is bliss...

 

[johnnyyukon]

Swamp Song

My warning meant nothing.
You're dancing in quicksand.
Why don't you watch where you're wandering?
Why don't you watch where you're stumbling?
You're wading knee deep and going in.

And you may never come back again.


This bog is thick
And easy to get lost in
When you're a stupid, beligerant fucker.

I hope it sucks you down.

Wander in and wandering.
No one even invited you in.
But you're still stumbling, stumble in.
Suffocate.

Why don't you get away,
While you can?

No one told you to come.
​

Undertow

Two times in.

I've been struck dumb by a voice that
speaks, from deep beneath peerless water that's,
twice as clear as heaven,
twice as loud as reason.
Deep and rich like silt on a riverbed,
just as neverending.
Current's mouth below me;
opens up around me.
suggests and beckons all while swallowing.
Surrounds and drowns, and wipes me away.

But I'm so comfortable... So comfortable.

Shut up, shut up, shut up, shut up,
you're saturating me.
How could I let this bring me,
back to my knees?

Third time in.

I've been baptized by your voice that,
screams, from deep beneath the cold black water that's,
half as high as heaven,
half as clear as reason.
cold and black like silt on the riverbed.
Just as neverending.
Current's mouth below me;
opens up around me.
Suggests and beckons all while swallowing.
Surrounds and drowns, and wipes me away.

But I'm so comfortable... So comfortable.

Shut up, shut up, shut up, shut up,
you're saturating me.
How could I let this happen?

Why don't you kill me?
I am weak and numb and insignificant,
How could I let this bring me back to my knees?

Eu...phor...ia. [x4]

I'm back down, I'm in the undertow.
I'm helpless and I'm awake, I'm in the undertow.
I'll die beneath the undertow.
There doesn't seem to be a way out of the undertow.

Eu..phor..ia.​

 

[Dr Mobius]

*heavy sigh*

Once again you seem completely oblivious of the fact you are/were putting-forth something extraordinarily relevant... something forgotten that must be seen again...

My memory has not served me well lately. Dave Grohl, a constant in my life, not yet having been mentioned in this thread is astounding to me...and evidence of my clear and present insanity. Massive, unspeakable quantities of ginkgo biloba - here I come.

(excuse me for one brief moment Dr.)

Well I often find that bringing Dave Grohl into a discussion enhances things.

I consider myself an individual that runs towards interesting people and away from relationships. I mean, I'm wired to run towards relationships and away from pain which creates a strange push-pull I imagine. But as an sx dom I take relationships so seriously...and while I am quite certain it doesn't show in my outward behavior beyond just being there...I still am entirely invested with my soul...my heart will be...entirely devoted. Knowing what kind of pain I'm potentially setting myself up for I'll most definitely do the "gone in sixty-seconds" if I feel the person will bring me heartache and harm with their actions and treatment of me (I have since gotten over the heartache of my last relationship...and yet I still get mad at myself for not having seen in him...or known via what should be a mandated public service announcement... the dangers of turning your heart over to fuckin-crazy Ni>Fe>Ti.) So, because of the extreme seriousness of it all...I've never personally used relationships as a form of escapism... But day dreaming of some amazingly awesome and hot dude has caused me to avoid many of Life's more unpleasant realities and for this I'm quite grateful haha (<-that's a joke MQ.)

7 sx will use actual *romance* as well as literature, day dreams, fantasy as escapism

7 sp will feed their hearty appetites with food, sex, luxuries as escapism

7 so it's these guys I worry most about when it comes to actual running in and out of relationships. They seem to have a more difficult time feeding the beast...quieting the 7 beast...and so they just keep on running. Dave Grohl's running has worked for him...but I could still see long before I even knew what enneagram was that he was running...and that his running looked "identical just better rewarded" than my ENFP 7w6 so/sx bestie.

Interesting I like these distinctions. I think I know a couple of sp and so first e7s IRL; but I don’t think I know any sx first.

All my life I've been searching for something
Something never comes never leads to nothing
Nothing satisfies but I'm getting close
Closer to the prize at the end of the rope

And I'm done, done and I'm on to the next one...

Love this song, actually I love most of his songs so that really isn't saying all that much; but it's a lot of fun to head bang to though.