[sx] sx relationships?

[1487610420]

Yes, now that I'm identifying as sx/sp and paying attention to this discussion, I like what you're saying here.

I've always been mostly dismissive or even negligent about "social stuff": Ties of acquaintanceship, social obligations, etc. I was always a good and dutiful team player in the workplace etc., but only out of obligation and commitment. Once I put in what was owed, I was pretty dismissive about anything further.

Meantime, I invested a lot in "special ties": Bonds of love, close friendship bonds, even a special work relationship like a particularly good boss or a good subordinate. I would give them 110 percent, ideally rewarding loyalty with loyalty, etc. I would even feel the same way about a special interest or calling or hobby. In other words, life was kind of gray for me overall, or even a pain in the ass, but once in a while some interest or connection would really stand out for me and I had to do that thing, at least for a while.

I think Jung calls it an animus/anima attraction, which is usually described as a "soulmate" attraction. It can happen with a great love, a great friendship, or even a calling or job that really suits you. But I need to read up more about that particular Jungian concept--so far I have only encountered that idea in passing.

However in the last 10 years I've actually tried to steer away from the attitude that I've described above (the idea of "anima attractions"). In the last 10 years, I've been focusing more on social stuff: I have been working on what I call my "Fe skills" and cultivating more "acquaintanceship ties"; and at the same time I have been downgrading my attention to "anima attractions." After two divorces and numerous changes in interests throughout my life, I've realized that those "anima attractions" can be misleading. They're good and worth following up on, but they aren't permanent and one can over-invest in them. They need to be treated with a measure of reserve, like anything else in life.

Just my opinion, of course.

The bulk just reminds of that nothing in life is permanent, except change and death. Although self awareness and mental plasticity exist, we are creatures of habit and familiarity feels comfortable. The path of least resistance. But the ego can feed on any narrative, often drama and conflict. Or memes. To each their own etcetera. The water is wet, sky is blue. Knawlidge.

 

[Tennessee Jed]

The bulk just reminds of that nothing in life is permanent, except change and death. Although self awareness and mental plasticity exist, we are creatures of habit and familiarity feels comfortable. The path of least resistance. But the ego can feed on any narrative, often drama and conflict. Or memes. To each their own etcetera. The water is wet, sky is blue. Knawlidge.

True enough, I guess(?).

You get a big attraction to someone or something: You project all kinds of positive things onto that person or thing. You bond, and you go through a honeymoon phase with it lasting anywhere from 6 months to 6 years.

But the honeymoon wears off (the projection fades and reality takes over), and you get the "7-year itch." Hopefully "habit and familiarity" with your rut will continue to keep you content and happy past that point. "The path of least resistance," as you said.

But sometimes as the honeymoon wears off, your eyes are opened and you realize that you've committed yourself to someone or something that is very badly flawed. And then, depending on the nature of the commitment, it can be a lot of drama and upset to fight and claw your way out of the rut and back to freedom. Or you can stay in the rut and stagnate: You just put up with your role as enabler to some abusive spouse or fight to stay afloat in some dead-end career, and you work on your endurance skills--try to outlast the situation. Or something like that.

That's basically how I experienced the sx/sp mindset.

[Edited to add:] Anyway, as I suggested a previous post, the answer in my case was to be more reserved toward these "anima attractions," that is, test them out more: Try to see past the projection and get at the reality.

Also, commit more slowly, try out alternatives, and be quicker to jump ship when problems arise. As I said, I found that my main problems in life arose from overcommitment based on projection. So reducing the level and speed of commitment has helped.

 

[Peter Deadpan]

Oh the mysterious of how I fuck up. I have bizarre ways of making mistakes. I DID copy and paste, but the beginning magically disappeared when I typed in the hyperlink. I saw that and went back to edit. Every time I register for something online I always make a weird mistake like a wrong email address or something. I identify as sx/sp, along with the descriptions, so the mysteries abound.

I'm sure it was just autocorrect then because it always wants to change it to Sx/So.

 

[The Cat]

I'm sure it was just autocorrect then because it always wants to change it to Sx/So.

auto correct is racist.

 

[Obfuscate]

How do you experience relationships in general if you are SX?

umm... as opposed to what? not experiencing a relationship?

What differs, and in what way do they differ from other instincts?

differs from what? i honestly can't say what other people experience with certainty...

How would you describe it?

is this the first question rephrased?

What makes it SX?

a relationship? i don't feel that relationships can be classified this way...

How do you value them?

on a case by case basis...

What do you seek in and from these individuals?

which individuals?


i wouldn't mind responding, but the format of your questions isn't one that i know how to respond to...

 

[Earl Grey]

How do you experience relationships in general if you are SX?

umm... as opposed to what? not experiencing a relationship?

What differs, and in what way do they differ from other instincts?

differs from what? i honestly can't say what other people experience with certainty...

How would you describe it?

is this the first question rephrased?

What makes it SX?

a relationship? i don't feel that relationships can be classified this way...

How do you value them?

on a case by case basis...

What do you seek in and from these individuals?

which individuals?

i wouldn't mind responding, but the format of your questions isn't one that i know how to respond to...

Check the link in OP- it is differentiated there, as well as in other sites. I had thought the differentiation was ridiculous till I observed some differences that do exist myself. How each variant treats the relationship, but mostly what they value from it. You cannot answer for others, only yourself.

A common difference I noted (that may be a more extreme, and thus more visible and notable example) between my type and those which aren't my type (especially sx-lasts) is that there seems to be a clash in 'priorities' and how we view and define a relationship that I observe in myself and others; such as sp-firsts such as myself generally tending towards putting stability, career, etc first before relationships. Each of us view the other as doing things backwards- due to that difference in priority. Enneagram and childhood influences/environmental influences also come into play, but there is that general trend.

It is fascinating.

 

[Earl Grey]

True enough, I guess(?).

You get a big attraction to someone or something: You project all kinds of positive things onto that person or thing. You bond, and you go through a honeymoon phase with it lasting anywhere from 6 months to 6 years.

But the honeymoon wears off (the projection fades and reality takes over), and you get the "7-year itch." Hopefully "habit and familiarity" with your rut will continue to keep you content and happy past that point. "The path of least resistance," as you said.

But sometimes as the honeymoon wears off, your eyes are opened and you realize that you've committed yourself to someone or something that is very badly flawed. And then, depending on the nature of the commitment, it can be a lot of drama and upset to fight and claw your way out of the rut and back to freedom. Or you can stay in the rut and stagnate: You just put up with your role as enabler to some abusive spouse or fight to stay afloat in some dead-end career, and you work on your endurance skills--try to outlast the situation. Or something like that.

That's basically how I experienced the sx/sp mindset.

Very interesting. Your answers contain similar points to other sx-firsts I've asked.

[Edited to add:] Anyway, as I suggested a previous post, the answer in my case was to be more reserved toward these "anima attractions," that is, test them out more: Try to see past the projection and get at the reality.

Also, commit more slowly, try out alternatives, and be quicker to jump ship when problems arise. As I said, I found that my main problems in life arose from overcommitment based on projection. So reducing the level and speed of commitment has helped.

I have asked others who I've typed, and who self-types as sx-first offsite, as well as those older than me. They mention very similar things you do, which is quite fascinating. There seems to be a general trend here, though I have found it difficult to put into words myself- it is not something I personally experience. The general impression I gather is that sx can have a relationship 'for the sake of a relationship', that generally gets tempered as the sx individual gets older (being more careful, selective, etc), just as how you've described it. sx seems to be a very relational function. This is all very interesting. Thank you for all your answers.

 

[Obfuscate]

Check the link in OP- it is differentiated there, as well as in other sites. I had thought the differentiation was ridiculous till I observed some differences that do exist myself. How each variant treats the relationship, but mostly what they value from it. You cannot answer for others, only yourself.

A common difference I noted (that may be a more extreme, and thus more visible and notable example) between my type and those which aren't my type (especially sx-lasts) is that there seems to be a clash in 'priorities' and how we view and define a relationship that I observe in myself and others; such as sp-firsts such as myself generally tending towards putting stability, career, etc first before relationships. Each of us view the other as doing things backwards- due to that difference in priority. Enneagram and childhood influences/environmental influences also come into play, but there is that general trend.

It is fascinating.

i understand what instinctual varients are... i skimmed your link, and that seems to be the subject... the problem i ran into was the phrasing of your questions.. if you respond to each question i asked, i would be able to awnser perhaps...

 

[Earl Grey]

i understand what instinctual varients are... i skimmed your link, and that seems to be the subject... the problem i ran into was the phrasing of your questions.. if you respond to each question i asked, i would be able to awnser perhaps...

Then we are at a standstill. Your questions are exactly the ones I'm asking; if there is any distinction at all, and if present, what are they? You are right when you ask "Is this the first question rephrased?" if by 'this' you meant your questions. I am here with questions, myself. In that instance,

What makes it SX?

a relationship? i don't feel that relationships can be classified this way...

If you feel they cannot be, why?

What do you seek in and from these individuals?

which individuals?

Since you do not differentiate between individuals nor do you seem to pinpoint which individuals you specifically have a stronger 'sx attraction' to over others, then you can answer for the relationships you have in general with individuals you do form a relationship with. In other words, what do you seek in a relationship? (In accordance to OP- I mean this in general- friendships, family, etc- any kind of relationship)

 

[Obfuscate]

Then we are at a standstill. Your questions are exactly the ones I'm asking; if there is any distinction at all, and if present, what are they? You are right when you ask "Is this the first question rephrased?" if by 'this' you meant your questions. I am here with questions, myself. In that instance,

my questions are to clarify what you mean, and are not about instinctual variants or your relationships... they are very specifically "what does this mean?", "what is the context?", "what type of relationship?", etc sort of questions... in short, i am not asking what you are asking...

If you feel they cannot be, why?

this is like asking why granite can't be classified as a particular sort of fruit... it is because relationships aren't people; they are an interplay between individuals... the individuals involved might have matching or diverse social instincts, but relationships aren't people... relationships don't have their own hopes, fears, personalities, goals, etc...

Since you do not differentiate between individuals nor do you seem to pinpoint which individuals you specifically have a stronger 'sx attraction' to over others, then you can answer for the relationships you have in general with individuals you do form a relationship with. In other words, what do you seek in a relationship? (In accordance to OP- I mean this in general- friendships, family, etc- any kind of relationship)

i am able to differentiate between indviduals; that is what prompted me to seek clarification initially... i wasn't asked to identify relationships in which i felt a stronger sx connection... again, that was the point of seeking clarification: to identify exactly what you were asking...

what i seek in a relationship varies based upon the nature of the relationship, in addition to a host of other factors...

the problem we are reaching is that you seem to think of this matter as one in which an individual is most likely to have a blanket approach they apply to all relationships... my confusion is because my approach is highly specific to circumstance... i don't seek the same thing from all relationships, nor do i think of them as all that similar... perhaps that is because you are so first and i am sx first? in any case, your questions are too broad for me to really apply to anything in my experience...

it seems you are unable or unwilling to refine them in a way that i am able to apply them... perhaps we are at an impasse...

 

[Morpeko]

How do you experience relationships in general if you are SX? What differs, and in what way do they differ from other instincts? How would you describe it? What makes it SX? How do you value them? What do you seek in and from these individuals?

I don't wish to speak for other variants, but my main goal is to achieve the strong one-on-one bond with anyone to whom I become connected, sometimes platonically but especially romantically. I burn bridges when I can't get the level of bonding that I desire, even if the other person physically and mentally is unable to meet my needs. I find it to be a waste of time to have a superficial or shallow relationship with anyone, so I'm picky about whom I let into my life or consider as a friend. I'm shocked when people can maintain large social circles without the level of selectiveness that I possess.

That being said, I really don't have many friends. In real life, I find it impossible to keep anyone. I find that friendships are too on-and-off for my liking. It's impossible to find a friend who would be as committed to me as I would like. I'm not sure if it's just an American thing, but friends seem to spend a lot of time apart and only get together once in a while, which isn't enough for me. It's also harder to find honest people who are willing to dive deeper into topics with me, especially the gritty subjects.

I can make online friends a lot easier, and they can meet my standards better, except for the fact that I can't actually see them or hang out with them, which sucks since I'm very much a "quality time" type of person. Still, it seems like the people whom I want to get to know better are uncomfortable when I ask them too many questions, so I have to hold myself back. I've even had close friends who would withdraw from me for long periods of time because my messages got too long and time-consuming. I'm starting to understand that it's not easy for everyone to get that deep.

As for family, I'm stuck with them. I have a fairly good one, some problems of course, but they're loyal and want to help me with any problems I have. I do know that we don't see eye to eye on many things and they can be judgmental so I have to be careful with what I say, but I am loyal back. I care a lot about what they have to say, and I know that they care about my feedback as well.

 

[Lady_X]

I have read various posts, threads, articles, and whatnot of varying levels of accuracy in content that SX is love, lust, mating, partnership, consummation, finding 'the one', the 'soulmate', spark, magnetism, seduction, etc. Very often, these descriptions seem to very specifically describe, or at least imply, a more romantic or even eros- erotic, lustful- kind of partnership (I have yet to find someone describing their mother as eliciting magnetic sparks of charismatic desirability. Yet, obviously, SX individuals do bond with more than romantic or sexual interests. Obviously, something is wrong here in how SX may be advertised).

Just like how SP does not mean that the person does not care for other people, or SOC doesn't mean that the person loves groups and would not be interested in marrying, I wonder about the view of relationships- general relationships, friends, family, or even with your pet- how it is viewed from an SX lens.

How do you experience relationships in general if you are SX? What differs, and in what way do they differ from other instincts? How would you describe it? What makes it SX? How do you value them? What do you seek in and from these individuals?

---

Subtypes - Enneagram Monthly

Here is a simple site listing down what each variant is or isn't. You can refer to these if you do not know where or how to begin, and to provide yourself with more context of where and how these instincts may differ- your own views are also very much welcome, as well as agreements or disagreements with any point present in this site. You do not have to be sx- you may post your own observations and understandings. Anecdotes and internet sources are welcome. Adding more questions are also very very welcome.

not sure if you care to hear more answers 3 years later but i think the instincts are fascinating.

as an sx dom who is a mother, sister, daughter, friend etc in addition to being a wife. i'll say this...

i feel very close and bonded with all of the people in my life but it is a very relaxed, low intensity, low preoccupation type of energy. we are all good...all the time. i don't get irritated, upset, disappointed etc at all pretty much always.

With my husband who is sx last btw --the energy is constant. my expectations are high and i'm more inclined to be upset or disappointed. i'm easy going af just as a person so its not like i'm a nag or anything but...if anyone sees me upset. it would be him...for not doing whatever seems to me like the thing that should be done.

i can't brush off an argument and go to bed. i can't sleep if i'm upset. it will legit ruin my whole day if there's distance. if we feel off etc. and it will need to be repaired asap so i can get on with life.

i have never felt that intense in any other kind of relationship.

 

[Coriolis]

i feel very close and bonded with all of the people in my life but it is a very relaxed, low intensity, low preoccupation type of energy. we are all good...all the time. i don't get irritated, upset, disappointed etc at all pretty much always.

With my husband who is sx last btw --the energy is constant. my expectations are high and i'm more inclined to be upset or disappointed. i'm easy going af just as a person so its not like i'm a nag or anything but...if anyone sees me upset. it would be him...for not doing whatever seems to me like the thing that should be done.

i can't brush off an argument and go to bed. i can't sleep if i'm upset. it will legit ruin my whole day if there's distance. if we feel off etc. and it will need to be repaired asap so i can get on with life.

i have never felt that intense in any other kind of relationship.

Are you saying you feel more intensity in the relationship with your husband than in all the other relationships you mentioned? Is it because of the nature of the relationship (romantic vs. others), or because he is sx last while you are sx first, or something else?

 

[Lady_X]

Are you saying you feel more intensity in the relationship with your husband than in all the other relationships you mentioned? Is it because of the nature of the relationship (romantic vs. others), or because he is sx last while you are sx first, or something else?

yes, i'm saying my romantic relationships are more intense than any other relationship i have. i have higher expectations of it than any other relationship. like we have to be everything to each other and always deeply connected and passionate etc.

i'm an easy breezy mom...i don't have to be their everything. my sisters...my closest friends etc...easy breezy. they can be however they want to be...i don't need them to be any particular way.

 

[Siúil a Rúin]

yes, i'm saying my romantic relationships are more intense than any other relationship i have. i have higher expectations of it than any other relationship. like we have to be everything to each other and always deeply connected and passionate etc.

i'm an easy breezy mom...i don't have to be their everything. my sisters...my closest friends etc...easy breezy. they can be however they want to be...i don't need them to be any particular way.

I completely relate to this, although i've had reciprocity issues in romantic relationships, but would like intensity and passion and feeling like the connection is unique and deeper than any other. My ideal connection would be very physical both sexual and affectionately.

I'm laid back with low expectations of everyone and while I adore my sister, I don't think she would want me living with her for example. There is still a type of autonomy and distance that is different than what I would want to have in a romantic, intimate relationship with someone I sleep together with every night and have that little longing of togetherness. That longing is not something i feel with everyone. I feel ongoing ache for the people I love to be happy, but if they are taken care of, I don't need a lot of attention or interaction. For me a romantic relationship is completely different in nature - primarily because of the physical intimacy aspect.

 

[Pessimistic Hippie]

I think my answers probably make me sound bad and it's not something I'm proud of. But I wanted to answer as candidly as possible.

How do you experience relationships in general if you are SX?

I'll be the first to admit that I idealize a lot in relationships and am often disappointed, mainly in the area of sex because it's something I like constantly want to do. And if my partner's attention seems regularly directed elsewhere -- I've made the mistake of dating hardcore gamers -- then I get bored pretty damn quickly. In some ways I think it could be said that I often don't care enough about the relationship itself (there's only been one case where this wasn't true,) and just want an avenue to throw my sexual energy into after a while. Leading up to me breaking up with them when the other things they do get on my nerves enough. I never seem to realize I'm doing this.

What differs, and in what way do they differ from other instincts?

Well, I'm usually really jealous of sp-doms lmao. Because it seems like they take care of themselves for their own well being and aren't as likely to fall into a depression if all of that pent up energy (that I at least feel) isn't being catered to enough externally. As for so-doms, I'm not sure how they see things really. I just know there's no emphasis on group dynamics for me involved.

How would you describe it? What makes it SX? How do you value them? What do you seek in and from these individual?

So all in all, subconsciously I think I'm on a chase for someone I like enough to the point where I like who they are at their core and don't just fixate on sex with them. And that's just been difficult for me to find since the one relationship I'd found where it WAS the case. I think this is why I'm naturally drawn to very exciting people overall. Keeping things fun and interesting/non-stagnant matters a lot to me.

 

[Luminous]

I think my answers probably make me sound bad and it's not something I'm proud of. But I wanted to answer as candidly as possible.

How do you experience relationships in general if you are SX?

I'll be the first to admit that I idealize a lot in relationships and am often disappointed, mainly in the area of sex because it's something I like constantly want to do. And if my partner's attention seems regularly directed elsewhere -- I've made the mistake of dating hardcore gamers -- then I get bored pretty damn quickly. In some ways I think it could be said that I often don't care enough about the relationship itself (there's only been one case where this wasn't true,) and just want an avenue to throw my sexual energy into after a while. Leading up to me breaking up with them when the other things they do get on my nerves enough. I never seem to realize I'm doing this.

What differs, and in what way do they differ from other instincts?

Well, I'm usually really jealous of sp-doms lmao. Because it seems like they take care of themselves for their own well being and aren't as likely to fall into a depression if all of that pent up energy (that I at least feel) isn't being catered to enough externally. As for so-doms, I'm not sure how they see things really. I just know there's no emphasis on group dynamics for me involved.

How would you describe it? What makes it SX? How do you value them? What do you seek in and from these individual?

So all in all, subconsciously I think I'm on a chase for someone I like enough to the point where I like who they are at their core and don't just fixate on sex with them. And that's just been difficult for me to find since the one relationship I'd found where it WAS the case. I think this is why I'm naturally drawn to very exciting people overall. Keeping things fun and interesting/non-stagnant matters a lot to me.

So is not just group dynamics. Hudson says it's the "human capacity to connect with other human beings, to be focused on others, to even be aware of others." It's focusing on the other, while sx is focusing on whether there's energy (so your response about the energy is spot on). It's about reading others, attuning/adapting ourselves to them, caring about them, connecting, communicating, play, reciprocity, participating, contributing, belonging. The key here is that it can be with just ONE other. It can be with the person you have sex with. It can be with your kid. Or friend. Or the grocery store clerk. Or your dog. It doesn't have to be a group of more than two for social to apply.

 

[Lady_X]

^^ yeah I hate to admit all this about myself but yeah this is how I know I'm so last. I'm occasionally drawn to people like magnets...specific people that we feel strong energy towards each other. It can be just friendships sometimes.gay guys or straight girls so I know for sure it's platonic haha but Its rare... when it happens I'm charming and engaging etc but other times in groups I can be aloof, disinterested, checked out. I have to remind myself to be polite and talk to people.

 

[Pessimistic Hippie]

So is not just group dynamics. Hudson says it's the "human capacity to connect with other human beings, to be focused on others, to even be aware of others." It's focusing on the other, while sx is focusing on whether there's energy (so your response about the energy is spot on). It's about reading others, attuning/adapting ourselves to them, caring about them, connecting, communicating, play, reciprocity, participating, contributing, belonging. The key here is that it can be with just ONE other. It can be with the person you have sex with. It can be with your kid. Or friend. Or the grocery store clerk. Or your dog. It doesn't have to be a group of more than two for social to apply.

Where'd you read this if you have the direct link on you? I just want to see what they have to say about how Sps act in relationships by comparison, if it's in the same article.

 

[Luminous]

Where'd you read this if you have the direct link on you? I just want to see what they have to say about how Sps act in relationships by comparison, if it's in the same article.

It's from a video, in a series from a class about the instincts I signed up for. Sorry, no link to text as far as I know of. I wish there were. Instincts Education

But basically he says sp is about self care, practicality/resources, and home life (which could be stuff like pleasing environment or organization, safety, privacy, having a base of operations). So relationships can come in because some types will share their resources (the OP [MENTION=35920]Earl Grey[/MENTION] has actually talked about this himself). Hudson said something like "For people strong in sp, a relationship is building a home together, making a nest."

And I just as well elaborate on sx since I already did for the other two... Sx is about attraction, exploration, merging, energy, activation. "For animals, it's just about mating. For humans, it's also about many things beyond that but of course is also about mating. It's not romance. It is not one-on-one and it is not intimacy. One-on one is not an instinct. It can happen in any of the 3. In a great relationship, there are all 3. Sx is not about wanting to relate to one person at a time."