Star Trek vs. Star Wars

[sprinkles]

Give me Star Trek with Star Wars ships and technology and I'd be happy.

Edit: yeah seriously. The giant pizza cutter needs to go. And the shuttles look like a fricking space microbus... or a box of crackers.

 

[Doctor Cringelord]

Star Trek, by a slight edge

 

[Doctor Cringelord]

They're not remotely parallel.

Of course. But you can't really compare Trek to, say, Babylon 5...Trek will probably always win in such a poll, if for no other reason than better name recognition; likewise, Star Wars will probably dominate any poll where it goes up against similar films or shows...These two franchises are (or were at one point) representative of the best of their respective subgenres. All this type of poll ever does is tell you what type of science fiction people prefer (hero's journey space opera vs utopian morality play), if SW can even be considered true sci-fi (it is).

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

For someone that's only seen the new movies, where should I start? DS9?

That's where I started. I haven't finished the series yet, but I'm working on it. It worked for me.

 

[Passacaglia]

I was a big TNG nut starting in college when it came out, then soured on it because it was all a bit too pat and smug to me in hindsight even though I watched the entire run and there are a few episodes that stand out (like The Inner Light or the whole Worf/Duras plotline). Ensign Ro was a breath of fresh air.

I haven't seen a whole lot of TNG episodes, but one of the few that I have seen had a line that's stuck with me even after ~20 years. The Enterprise comes upon a planet, deserted except for an elderly human couple. There's obviously something fishy going on, and at the end of the episode Picard confronts the husband...

...who turns out to be an alien entity of deific power. (Like Q, I guess, except not irritating.) The entity tells Picard his story: There was once a human colony on the planet. He came upon the colony, took human form, fell in love with one of the women, married her and then lived as a human for some time. But then the planet was invaded by some alien army, and in the mayhem his wife was killed. (What appeared to be his wife during the episode is merely an illusion.)

"In a moment of anger, I killed the aliens." The entity tells Picard. "And then out of remorse for what I'd done, I became a hermit here."

"Well you may have overreacted, but the invaders did kill your wife. Your rage and retribution are understandable." Picard replies.

"No," the entity replies. "You don't understand; I didn't just kill the invaders. I killed all of the aliens, everywhere."

 

[Totenkindly]

What about upcoming stuff, though? JJ Abrams is in charge of both (he IS the guy who got the cake and ate it) and while I do favour Star Trek, just seeing the crashed Star Destroyer as a backdrop in the second teaser cemented in my very mind that I may be very blown away by the new film. Then again, it may just turn out again to be CGI swordfighting and Jim Henson.

I think Abrams has a better track record with his past work in connecting and emphasizing the humanity of his characters. his people tend to be people first, who are then layered with the trappings of the setting.

With Lucas, I always felt like it was just a little-kid director playing "Star Wars figures" with his toys, pushing them around and staging fights and smash-up battles. The more psychologically enduring elements in later movies seemed to come from other contributors.

The Star Wars expanded universe is interesting though (only because there had to be an expanded universe, to add more content?), I played Dark Forces (if they draw upon this for Rebel One, I would be impressed, especially if they namecheck Kyle Katarn) and the first two KOTOR games and I liked being immersed in that way. Is there only so far you can go with the Star Wars theme though, before you end up repeating yourself?

Well, pretty much all stories are like that. What hasn't already been said? But you can change the details of the drama and the people involved. I think again this is a problem when you're focusing on the cosmetics ("Star-cruiser battles! Lightsaber battles! Force choking! Pod races!") and not as much when you focus first on characters and then toss them into a setting... because the main thrust of the story are the characters, not the trappings you already know.

I haven't seen a whole lot of TNG episodes, but one of the few that I have seen had a line that's stuck with me even after ~20 years. The Enterprise comes upon a planet, deserted except for an elderly human couple. There's obviously something fishy going on, and at the end of the episode Picard confronts the husband...

...who turns out to be an alien entity of deific power. (Like Q, I guess, except not irritating.) The entity tells Picard his story: There was once a human colony on the planet. He came upon the colony, took human form, fell in love with one of the women, married her and then lived as a human for some time. But then the planet was invaded by some alien army, and in the mayhem his wife was killed. (What appeared to be his wife during the episode is merely an illusion.)

"In a moment of anger, I killed the aliens." The entity tells Picard. "And then out of remorse for what I'd done, I became a hermit here."

"Well you may have overreacted, but the invaders did kill your wife. Your rage and retribution are understandable." Picard replies.

"No," the entity replies. "You don't understand; I didn't just kill the invaders. I killed all of the aliens, everywhere."

That was actually one of my favorite episodes, with John Anderson playing the husband. (Don't ask me why I remembered THAT; I couldn't remember the character's name, just the actor.)

It was interesting throughout, but that moment that you describe... it was like the ground opened up under me. Great moment. I still feel a void, recalling it.

 

[Luke O]

I think Abrams has a better track record with his past work in connecting and emphasizing the humanity of his characters. his people tend to be people first, who are then layered with the trappings of the setting.

With Lucas, I always felt like it was just a little-kid director playing "Star Wars figures" with his toys, pushing them around and staging fights and smash-up battles. The more psychologically enduring elements in later movies seemed to come from other contributors.



Well, pretty much all stories are like that. What hasn't already been said? But you can change the details of the drama and the people involved. I think again this is a problem when you're focusing on the cosmetics ("Star-cruiser battles! Lightsaber battles! Force choking! Pod races!") and not as much when you focus first on characters and then toss them into a setting... because the main thrust of the story are the characters, not the trappings you already know.

If this is the case (well, I plan to go see The Force Awakens when it comes out) I'm hoping for something to reconnect me. Since 2005 I've been very 'meh' towards Star Wars.

 

[Totenkindly]

If this is the case (well, I plan to go see The Force Awakens when it comes out) I'm hoping for something to reconnect me. Since 2005 I've been very 'meh' towards Star Wars.

I was kinda meh on Star Wars as soon as the prequels started coming out.

Playing the games was a totally immersive experience, though; the characters were more interesting, and the line between Jedi and Sith was more muddy.

We'll see what happens this fall. I'm actually a lot more sketchy on the third Star Trek movie due to all the [pre-]production problems that've had (ditching a director or two, redoing a script with only five weeks before production starting up, etc.)

 

[Luke O]

I was kinda meh on Star Wars as soon as the prequels started coming out.

Playing the games was a totally immersive experience, though; the characters were more interesting, and the line between Jedi and Sith was more muddy.

We'll see what happens this fall. I'm actually a lot more sketchy on the third Star Trek movie due to all the [pre-]production problems that've had (ditching a director or two, redoing a script with only five weeks before production starting up, etc.)

Oh, I had no idea about that at all. I really hope the next one doesn't turn out to be a turkey. With the new films though, how would you feel about references to the future timeline (i.e. will we still have Picard etc), I've had my own ideas about that.

 

[Totenkindly]

Oh, I had no idea about that at all. I really hope the next one doesn't turn out to be a turkey. With the new films though, how would you feel about references to the future timeline (i.e. will we still have Picard etc), I've had my own ideas about that.

I don't mind it, but one thing i hate is when everything just becomes a rehash of whatever else was done. In fact, I think their overdoing it in the second ST is why there was such a pushback from the fan base.

...I'd actually think it would be kind of cool for them to attend a funeral for a Starfleet student named Picard who got stabbed to death in an impromptu bar fight. ("Tapestry", I think?) you know, like smaller references. Stephen King tends to have a better handle on this kind of stuff in his writing, since he often will tie his books together with little "drop-in" references .... side characters show up briefly in multiple books, or someone mentions something that happened in another book, etc. It gives more of a real feeling to the story without it all being on the nose.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Yeah, those are my favorite games possibly of all time, and it's why I pick the world of Star Wars over Star Trek in general (although Lucas' own stories in his own world probably aren't quite as great as a few of the stories from the Star Trek world).

Maybe that's a better way to say it. I think in general Star Wars had more flavor and interesting world aspects to me, but Star Trek had some better storylines... until of course you look at the SWKOTOR line. I only finished a few of the class stories in the MMO SWTOR (which is kind of SWKOTOR 3), but it was the coolest thing ever and better than the movies... Nothing beat being a Sith marauder wielding two sabers and managing to survive the plots of everyone trying to destroy me as I rose through the chain (and a few masters) and managed to subvert the hope of the Jedi to being my thrall. Bwa ha ha.

I still have yet to play Knights of the Old Republic. Maybe I'll track down an old copy and give it a play.

I was a big TNG nut starting in college when it came out, then soured on it because it was all a bit too pat and smug to me in hindsight even though I watched the entire run and there are a few episodes that stand out (like The Inner Light or the whole Worf/Duras plotline). Ensign Ro was a breath of fresh air.

I did see the episode where Ensign Ro was introduced, and I loved that character. The way Riker acted towards her was very irritating, to say the least.

I struggled through a season of Voyager and quit, and never bothered with Enterprise.

That theme song is the worst.

What about upcoming stuff, though? JJ Abrams is in charge of both (he IS the guy who got the cake and ate it) and while I do favour Star Trek, just seeing the crashed Star Destroyer as a backdrop in the second teaser cemented in my very mind that I may be very blown away by the new film. Then again, it may just turn out again to be CGI swordfighting and Jim Henson.

The Star Wars expanded universe is interesting though (only because there had to be an expanded universe, to add more content?), I played Dark Forces (if they draw upon this for Rebel One, I would be impressed, especially if they namecheck Kyle Katarn) and the first two KOTOR games and I liked being immersed in that way. Is there only so far you can go with the Star Wars theme though, before you end up repeating yourself?

I loved the Dark Forces series; sneaking into Imperial installations and taking out stormtroopers was a lot of fun. They also included a lot of puzzles to solve; which I thought was awesome. I expect they're going to remove Kyle Katarn from the continuity altogether, though.

There's so much Star Wars stuff out there that there are a lot of complicated rules about what actually happened and what didn't. Or at least, there was. Pretty much everything that happened after ROTJ has been thrown out, which is good in some cases, and bad in others. I actually did read a great deal of the Expanded Universe novels, although I lost interest about the time of the Yuuhzan Vong invasion. I checked out with that; the storyline didn't interest me.

I used to feel embarrassed for having read so much of that stuff, but now I'm finding out that a lot of other people my age read those books too, or at least knew of them, and don't look at me like a slimy rotting sea urchin for having read them.

 

[Luke O]

I don't mind it, but one thing i hate is when everything just becomes a rehash of whatever else was done. In fact, I think their overdoing it in the second ST is why there was such a pushback from the fan base.

...I'd actually think it would be kind of cool for them to attend a funeral for a Starfleet student named Picard who got stabbed to death in an impromptu bar fight. ("Tapestry", I think?) you know, like smaller references. Stephen King tends to have a better handle on this kind of stuff in his writing, since he often will tie his books together with little "drop-in" references .... side characters show up briefly in multiple books, or someone mentions something that happened in another book, etc. It gives more of a real feeling to the story without it all being on the nose.

Ah yes, the Nausicaans

Or remained Lieutenant Jr. Grade...

I had an idea for a storyline where in 2363, Picard still has the Stargazer and the Enterprise-C survived Narendra III (figured since the ships are bigger in this alternative timeline, they're tougher), with an Admiral Rachel Garrett. I put a new adversary in, and there's all sorts of detail in there, too much for one post. Yeah, there's a bit of time travel too back to Kirk's era as well as the history behind some of the other factions in the galaxy. It'll never make film though

 

[Kensei]

If a squad of red shirts battled a squad of well trained clone troopers, their shirts would be even redder, with a little black and brown too. If captain kirk battled the average jedi, all he would have to do is take his gun with the force, pick him up with the force, and using the force, impale him with an ewok spear. Star wars wins hands down

 

[Raffaella]

What about Star...gate?

 

[Luke O]

I also had another idea for a Star Wars movie. A movie about the making of A New Hope, with all the challenges George Lucas had making the film, as well as reality seamlessly blending with fantasy. I imagined the following actors playing parts:

Harrison Ford/Han Solo - Chris Pratt
Alec Guinness/Obi-Wan Kenobi - Russell Crowe (it's the voice)
James Earl Jones/Darth Vader (voice) - Chiwitiel Ejiofor

I can see someone playing George Lucas but I can't put a name to a face. Who else could fill the different roles?

 

[Riva]

I prefer star trek.

On a side note @ people who arfued between the serieses; although ds9 was obviously the best written and best acted series there was too much tension in it. The best aspect of star trek is the relaxed vibe of it. they are explorers that come across new species or circumstances that create issues but at the end of the day 'everything was gonna be alright'. This was the pace of tos tng voyager, whereas ds9 didnt have that. It had too much tension and took that everything is going to be alright feeling away from things.

 

[Riva]

Ps - why do star wars fans hate jar jar binks? He was more interesting than those dark force clowns.

Kiddin

 

[Riva]

For someone that's only seen the new movies, where should I start? DS9?

Watch tng. And while you are at it google best episodes on tos and watch them too.

Ds9 is the best but you wouldnt get a star trek feeling from it. Their archs are too long. Tng and tos has one episode archs.

Ds9 will spin you if you watch too much like babylon5, whereas tng you can calmly be entertained for as many episodes as you like. I would say for entertainment purposes tng is the best.

Tos is too old fashioned and kirk apparently has a secret agenda to fuck every alien he sees. He also thinks he is sexier than he is.

Anyway, when you are watching ds9 i recomment you watch elim garak episodes or simply the best episodes.

 

[INTP]

Star wars seems bit too much like a childish fantasy and i really dislike the athmosphere of the movies. Well made movies tho especially the old ones considering the equipment at the time.

Star trek is just meh.. I wouldnt say its crap, but i dont really care about it, i have seen some(maybe like 30 overall) episodes over the years. Thats just because as a kid there wasnt anything else on tv at the time it aired. I did see that some new movie with some Khan dude(title also had khan in it) and it was ptretty good, much better than what i expected from a trek movie. And yes i know saying that is blasphemy

 

[Riva]

Star wars seems bit too much like a childish fantasy and i really dislike the athmosphere of the movies. Well made movies tho especially the old ones considering the equipment at the time.

Star trek is just meh.. I wouldnt say its crap, but i dont really care about it, i have seen some(maybe like 30 overall) episodes over the years. Thats just because as a kid there wasnt anything else on tv at the time it aired. I did see that some new movie with some Khan dude(title also had khan in it) and it was ptretty good, much better than what i expected from a trek movie. And yes i know saying that is blasphemy

It is blasphemy but that movie was quite good.

The issue is in their inability create a good plot they brought back the ace they have used before.

The first new movie is what sucked. It destroyed the star trek universe we've known for 50 years.

It's like revealing that the sith lord is actually jar jar binks all along. Lolz imagine that. I would actually like to see that to see how angry star wars fans would get.

I hated the fact that the appearance of kligons were changed. They werw such typical estjs in the serieses (it was so entertaining) but in the movies they have been given introverted personalities. I am not saying introverted personalities suck but for kligons who are so fun but hardworking and rude at the say time making them introverts suck.