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Random Star Wars Thoughts

Doctor Anaximander

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Revisiting The Chosen One Prophecy

I think the Jedi misread their own prophecy. I don't think Anakin was the chosen one. He was, but the chosen one is not an exclusive status limited to one person. It can be any number of individuals gifted with an insanely high midichlorian count and the potential and discipline to bring balance. Anakin was the (first? maybe it's a reoccuring position like the One in the matrix universe and he just happened to be the first necessary in a long time. Perhaps whenever the universe is in extreme crisis and the dark side gaining too much influence, the force instinctively influences the creation of an extremely powerful individual to kickstart or reboot the system).

Anakin had the potential to bring balance, but when he fell and put the galaxy further into darkness, it passed on from him. The force had already reacted by willing the creation of two twins whose potential would match Anakin's. So by circumstance, Luke became the next Chosen One, although it could've just as easily been Leia under different circumstances. And Luke succeeded or failed, depending on how you looked at it, and so Rey is the next logical heir to the Chosen One status when the force becomes increasingly unbalanced. She probably exceeds both Anakin and Luke in midichlorian count, as the force wills her to use it in a way that most individuals would require years of training.
 

Doctor Anaximander

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TCW really makes me feel for the tragedy of the clones. Unlike their jedi commanders and eventual non-clone replacements, they were doomed to be forgotten. The whole aging at double speed aspect is also tragic. By the time of the original trilogy, most surviving clones would already be senior citizens. I seem to remember reading about a legends source that a lot of former clones formed the basis of imperial cyborg supertroopers, their past experience as soldiers melded with new and improved bodies. Becoming more and more like the mindless droid soldiers they were originally bred to fight against. I hope this is something that will be mentioned in the new canon, as I doubt the empire would just discard all of the clones after the clone wars. Would love to see a battle between old Rex and a cyborgified Cody. For Rex to see what became of his surviving brethren after the war.

Another aspect of TCW I like is how the jedi actively encourage individuality among their clone soldiers and seem to genuinely value the lives of the clones. A nice contrast to the sith and emperor who viewed soldiers as expendable, nameless pawns. The biggest tragedy is they were ultimately proven to be mindless pawns with the events of order 66. All of these clone soldiers who had been encouraged to be individuals and take personal nicknames suddenly revert to a nameless force of murderers, forgetting everything they learned from their jedi commanders.
 

Doctor Anaximander

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I saw a good post on Reddit that made the point that everything would work better if there was no prophecy. I'm inclined to agree, especially because it was never actually explained in the movies what the prophecy was.

And yeah, I think they did some really interesting stuff with TLJ, and it's unfortunate that all of it was completely ignored. I especially hate the fact that it made Luke's sacrifice meaningless. That was a pretty good way for that character to go out (much better than Solo's), and it appears to have not impacted anything. The movie doesn't even seem to acknowledge that it happens, instead engaging in lots of dumb fanservice. ROS made it look like he didn't realize he was wrong until he died.

There was no real plan going into the new trilogy. The left hand didn't know what the right hand was doing and the brain seemed disconnected from the entire body. As such, it feels like a hodgepodge, like TLJ was from a separate trilogy (had Johnson been and Abrams each made their own trilogies, then someone decided to swap out the middle films) just sandwiched in-between two Abrams movies. I'd be happy with a Johnson trilogy or an Abrams trilogy if either were cohesive wholes. Kennedy is a good businessperson but should have exerted more oversight or put someone in an executive role that would have overseen a more cohesive trilogy. Abrams was not the guy to helm this. Classic case of a decent director who can satisfy visually but doesn't know the first thing about how to write a solid arc. And I realize similar complaints have been levied against Lucas, who to be fair didn't know the entire story when he was working on ANH, but at least he seemed to have some general idea of the grand story when he finished his trilogies.

Johnson does get some unfair hate, when really Abrams is to blame. Abrams didn't leave him much to work with. There were no arcs to continue, just a bunch of loose threads and maguffins left over from TFA. He did a decent job of making TLJ seem like it was actually picking up and continuing arcs that were nonexistent to begin with.

I hope they do scrap this trilogy from canon, I know they won't, but it leaves a bad taste that exceeds even that left by the prequels. At least the prequels still feel like parts of a mostly cohesive whole. And for all their flaws, they weren't just total retreads or reimaginings of the OT. At least the people making the anthology movies and the TV shows have done a decent job of picking up the mantle. Too bad Solo did poorer than expected. I was always more excited by the prospect of the anthology films than I was of anything they were going to do in the new trilogy.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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There was no real plan going into the new trilogy. The left hand didn't know what the right hand was doing and the brain seemed disconnected from the entire body. As such, it feels like a hodgepodge, like TLJ was from a separate trilogy (had Johnson been and Abrams each made their own trilogies, then someone decided to swap out the middle films) just sandwiched in-between two Abrams movies. I'd be happy with a Johnson trilogy or an Abrams trilogy if either were cohesive wholes. Kennedy is a good businessperson but should have exerted more oversight or put someone in an executive role that would have overseen a more cohesive trilogy. Abrams was not the guy to helm this. Classic case of a decent director who can satisfy visually but doesn't know the first thing about how to write a solid arc. And I realize similar complaints have been levied against Lucas, who to be fair didn't know the entire story when he was working on ANH, but at least he seemed to have some general idea of the grand story when he finished his trilogies.

Johnson does get some unfair hate, when really Abrams is to blame. Abrams didn't leave him much to work with. There were no arcs to continue, just a bunch of loose threads and maguffins left over from TFA. He did a decent job of making TLJ seem like it was actually picking up and continuing arcs that were nonexistent to begin with.

I hope they do scrap this trilogy from canon, I know they won't, but it leaves a bad taste that exceeds even that left by the prequels. At least the prequels still feel like parts of a mostly cohesive whole. And for all their flaws, they weren't just total retreads or reimaginings of the OT. At least the people making the anthology movies and the TV shows have done a decent job of picking up the mantle. Too bad Solo did poorer than expected. I was always more excited by the prospect of the anthology films than I was of anything they were going to do in the new trilogy.

Honestly, everything I've heard about Treverrow's script makes me wish they'd actually went with that. It seems so much more like an actual continuation of TLJ than a sloppy retcon aimed at fanservice. Also, Coruscant plays a big role in it, which really should have been a part of this trilogy, at least at the very end to bring things "full circle." I didn't care about seeing Luke's x-wing again but that was something I was really hoping to see because it would have helped bring a sense of closure to things (and another complaint about this is how little closure I actually feel... I realize they probably plan on making more movies set after this, but that's no excuse for ending the damn thing at a place that only has meaning for the viewing audience and has no meaning to any of the actual characters in the story. Why the hell should Rey care about Luke's house that she never visited before? Maybe we're supposed to know she won't go bad because she LIKES sand?
 

Doctor Anaximander

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Honestly, everything I've heard about Treverrow's script makes me wish they'd actually went with that. It seems so much more like an actual continuation of TLJ than a sloppy retcon aimed at fanservice. Also, Coruscant plays a big role in it, which really should have been a part of this trilogy, at least at the very end to bring things "full circle." I didn't care about seeing Luke's x-wing again but that was something I was really hoping to see because it would have helped bring a sense of closure to things (and another complaint about this is how little closure I actually feel... I realize they probably plan on making more movies set after this, but that's no excuse for ending the damn thing at a place that only has meaning for the viewing audience and has no meaning to any of the actual characters in the story. Why the hell should Rey care about Luke's house that she never visited before? Maybe we're supposed to know she won't go bad because she LIKES sand?

Would be like Luke visiting Kenobi’s old apartment on coruscant. “Gee willikers, I bet Ben had some fun memories of this place I’ve never seen or heard mentioned before”
 

Totenkindly

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Maybe the lesson should be not to hold to old ideals and prophecies, regardless of whether they came from jedi or sith. Seemed they were sort of pushing that theme in TLJ before the Rise of Reddit just retconned everything because we needed the big showdown with Palpy.

That would have been a more mature and interesting angle for a final film -- that we are what we choose and/or choose to do, and destiny is not the final arbiter of our lives. It's the story of every adult who has self-individualized. Instead we got the same old regurgitated nonsense. Whatever.

I hate seeing all the star wars stuff in other mediums coming out now trying to "explain" and justify the final movie. Yeah, see ya, Star Wars, it's all BS. I'm okay with stuff unrelated to the film series, especially set in other time periods, but will be happy once the professional apologists stop trying to ram the supposed coherence/value of the last film down our threats to somehow make it work.

Would be like Luke visiting Kenobi’s old apartment on coruscant. “Gee willikers, I bet Ben had some fun memories of this place I’ve never seen or heard mentioned before”

For some reason, that makes me think of a sitcom with Obi-Wan Kenobi and Mace Windu as roommates, and Obi-Wan is kind of a fussy neat-freak and Mace keeps bringing home women and throwing wild parties while Obi-Wan scowls from the doorway.

I think the Jedi misread their own prophecy. I don't think Anakin was the chosen one. He was, but the chosen one is not an exclusive status limited to one person. It can be any number of individuals gifted with an insanely high midichlorian count and the potential and discipline to bring balance. Anakin was the (first? maybe it's a reoccuring position like the One in the matrix universe and he just happened to be the first necessary in a long time. Perhaps whenever the universe is in extreme crisis and the dark side gaining too much influence, the force instinctively influences the creation of an extremely powerful individual to kickstart or reboot the system).

Now you're getting all Matrix-y on us -- talk about mixing franchises that bombed the last film at least in part if not the whole.
 

Doctor Anaximander

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I was always more partial to the Y Wing starfighter/bomber. All the cool kids were into the X and the Falcon. I was happy they brought back an earlier version for TCW, especially since I’d remembered reading somewhere that it was an older model the rebellion had put into use. TCW version basically retcons the original version to being a stripped down, hot-rodded version, but that works because the original already had the look of something that had been converted from an earlier version. A lot of the rebel ships had that feel actually, since they were using older tech, whatever they could find leftover from earlier conflicts to fight the imperial machine.

It makes me so happy there was always at least one y wing that made it the final Death Star run in 4 and 6

 

Doctor Anaximander

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That would have been a more mature and interesting angle for a final film -- that we are what we choose and/or choose to do, and destiny is not the final arbiter of our lives. It's the story of every adult who has self-individualized. Instead we got the same old regurgitated nonsense. Whatever.

I hate seeing all the star wars stuff in other mediums coming out now trying to "explain" and justify the final movie. Yeah, see ya, Star Wars, it's all BS. I'm okay with stuff unrelated to the film series, especially set in other time periods, but will be happy once the professional apologists stop trying to ram the supposed coherence/value of the last film down our threats to somehow make it work.



For some reason, that makes me think of a sitcom with Obi-Wan Kenobi and Mace Windu as roommates, and Obi-Wan is kind of a fussy neat-freak and Mace keeps bringing home women and throwing wild parties while Obi-Wan scowls from the doorway.



Now you're getting all Matrix-y on us -- talk about mixing franchises that bombed the last film at least in part if not the whole.

Yoda would be the eccentric neighbor who always walks into their apartment without knocking and starts rambling about the latest get rich quick scheme he imagined via a force vision.
 

Doctor Anaximander

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Not counting Vader’s Tie, I think the Tie Interceptor is my favorite canon imperial fighter.
 

Doctor Anaximander

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I like how the love of piloting a fighter is the one constant that ties Vader to his former identity as Anakin. Even his lightsaber style changes as Vader. But he never gave up on flying. And he always personalizes his ships to reflect his own status and personality. Bright colors on his Jedi fighter give way to the black and matte finish of his Sith tie fighter

He was always first and foremost a pilot, dating back to episode 1, it’s the one love neither the Jedi or the Sith could take away from him. Enough so that it’s one of the key aspects of Anakin that Ben chooses to note when telling Luke of him in ANH.

I only wish we’d gotten more of Vader piloting in the rest of the OT. Would have been cool if his fighter participated in the asteroid field chase. Oh but then Han would be dead and the Falcon a cloud of vapor
 

Doctor Anaximander

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I read somewhere Han may have been mildly force sensitive. Not enough to have any real powers or even be aware of it, but more than the average non sensitive person. Enough that it may have given him a slight edge with his intuition and instincts. So what Han called “luck” may have actually been due to his own mild connection to the force.
 

Doctor Anaximander

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I’m now into season 5 of The Clone Wars and it’s gotten pretty great. I’m currently in the Saw Gerrera arc. I think this series improves the prequels immensely and I’d recommend people watch it alongside II and III for the best results. I can’t wait until season 7, where it actually starts to coincide with events in episode 3.

Watching Kenobi team up with Asajj was pretty awesome. There was definitely a mutual attraction
 

Siúil a Rúin

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So is Jar Jar Binks a Jedi? I heard a convincing case made in favor of it once, but I don't remember the details, except it's kinda funny how he ended up in the senate, and he kept getting away with quite a bit from the beginning. Also, he was perhaps the answer to Yoda for the newer movies.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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So is Jar Jar Binks a Jedi? I heard a convincing case made in favor of it once, but I don't remember the details, except it's kinda funny how he ended up in the senate, and he kept getting away with quite a bit from the beginning. Also, he was perhaps the answer to Yoda for the newer movies.

He's more of a Sith Master.
 

Doctor Anaximander

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I actually like jar jar and the gungans in the show. They translate better to animated format
 

Totenkindly

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The joke is that Jar Jar was a Sith Lord, and all his bumbling was actually a sign of his crafty malevolent machinations, resulting in the fall of Anakin Skywalker and the Senate. Why not hide in plain sight? Palpatine did.

Anyway, yeah, you can make a case he represents the fanbase too lol. Everyone wants to be important, but most of us are incapable or clueless.



I still haven't summoned enough courage yet to watch the sequel trilogy, after blowing through the first six films. I just dread getting to ROS. Now I hear they want to do some spinoff on Kylo Ren. Like, who the freak cares anymore? We all know what happened, the movie bumbled the entire storyline, and all the apologetics and "pre-exploration" of the character amounts to crap. I'm so sick of hearing about all these "pre-details" from comic and book writers and whoever else trying to reshape the final film into something sensible. The film did not do what it needed to do. All the stupid massaging of continuity and whatever else doesn't change that. It's trying to salvage a charred corpse. It's almost worse than the original movie failure -- just own this debacle, then move on to SOME OTHER STORYLINE PLEASE.

I actually like jar jar and the gungans in the show. They translate better to animated format

Well, that is probably true. Although they are all animated in some way regardless of format. I don't think we've ever seen a conventional effects gungan except in cosplay.
 
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Totenkindly

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.... trying to read this, but honestly I'm done with a lot of the stuff surrounding Anakin Skywalker. It makes me throw up in my mouth a little, and it doesn't even matter what it is. It's just oversaturated at this point. Lucas badly wounded it, and Disney finished it off.

ANYTHING else would be great.
 

Totenkindly

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"No interest in that"

[response is to dump in more copious posts about said topic]

*eyeroll*

------------------------------------

Anyway, yeah, the problem with "safe" films (and art in general) is that sometimes you DO happen to do something solid and people like it, but you also never take any risks, surprise your audience, and the vision is so diluted that no one gets excited about it. Also, if you have a LARGE audience with a lot of different demographics, tailoring it to one demographic means the rest don't give a shit. Sometimes you have to shock them all to get responses. Or you have to just tell a story that matters to you, and if you care enough about it and you can tell it well enough, it might be interesting enough to capture the minds and imaginations of a varied audience representation regardless.

It's just about human beings trying to bottle lightning, based on where lightning struck previously.

unfortunately, Disney only bought Star Wars because they thought they could package it and sell it as a known quantity. it was the opposite of art.

Big franchises can still do surprising things. I mean, I don't think anyone really expected the end of Infinity War to come down how it did, even if people SHOULD have (based on it being a two-parter AND such a thing having happened in the comics). It was such a wonderful gut-punch, even if some fans were left reeling.
 
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