Random Politics Thread

[ceecee]

Welp.

Trump indicted in federal Jan. 6 investigation: Full coverage

The Department of Justice notified the former president of the charges tied to the events of the 2021 Capitol insurrection on Tuesday.

www.yahoo.com

lol But it doesn't mean anything if these fucking people don't do any time.

 

[Virtual ghost]

lol But it doesn't mean anything if these fucking people don't do any time.

If they don't serve any real time the whole indictment thing will actually backfire massively. I really hope that Dems know what they are doing.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

My impression is somewhat different. Trump has only about 50% of support in the party exactly since other 50% realized that among other things the guy is simply unfit. I am not a particular fan of other red candidates but I would take basically any of them over Trump's chaos.

Btw Bush Jr lead the democratic coalition into Afghanistan. But how that ended is another matter, but he did that.

As long as you have twenty candidates duking it out among themselves it won't come to anything. I've seen this movie more than once. It would need to be a battle between two, which would require someone to intervene to convince everyone else to walk away. I don't know who that someone is in this instance.

He did. Then there was Iraq and how the lead-up to that went. We went and did the liberty cabbage thing again, only this time we weren't even at war.

Plus I know that all of them will not care too much about climate change. However most of them will at least try not to crash various global efforts to talk about the issue. It is not much but that is at least something. Of course that it will be better that democrats win 2024 but I still see a certain gray zone between them and Trump.

I see a difference in that I see Trump being motivated by going after the people who went after him. That's a lot more erratic and terrifying in its own way. He's not just going to get in there and tweet and then an entire news cycle is devoted to how shocking the tweet was. I don't think either outcome is good, ultimately.

I don't think either outcome produces anything good for climate change, unfortunately. Climate change can be compared to Covid-19 when it comes to how they think about it. It doesn't matter what the politicians actually believe; they important thing is that they know where the bread is buttered.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

In theory I like the idea of them Eco-tech is fascinating. Aquaculture, biome structures. My big concerns with this, are gonna be who gets to live in paradise and who has to be stuck outside of it. And is it just gonna turn into Autodale?

​

Well, maybe everyone gets to live in paradise. But the reality where that is conceivable is farther off than the actual tech.

As for Autodale, whose to say we won't turn into a dystopia where individuality is punished anyway. Perhaps something like Chinese social credits but with a free-market spin, which will make it "good" even though it amounts to the same thing. I can see some evolution of "X" or "threads" to utilize some mass mob mentality to force collective compliance into a series of social "molds".

By the way, McMurdo Station seems the closest thing to an arcology that exists.

 

[SensEye]

If they don't serve any real time the whole indictment thing will actually backfire massively. I really hope that Dems know what they are doing.

I'm highly skeptical Trump or any of his cabal will do any real time. Obviously, if he (or any republican) wins the next election it will all go away. Either the investigations/indictments/prosecutions will be cancelled or pardons galore. As an aside, the whole presidential pardon power is nuts. It makes no rational sense other than the founding fathers were protecting their own. There is no other reason to invest this office with such power other than cronyism.

I even think if Trump loses the general, Biden will pardon him (if he can be sure Trump won't run again.) Not sure about this, but politicians like to take care of their own. They all probably have skeletons in their closets and never being held to account is a key foundation of the whole political institution. Otherwise, politicians might have to behave morally and ethically. I don't think that notion is palatable to any of them. They like to lie/cheat/steal and if they get caught, maybe they don't get elected. But that's the only penalty they expect to pay. No accountability for malfeasance outside of at the ballet box. I suspect this is a bi-partisan sentiment.

 

[The Cat]

 

[Virtual ghost]

As long as you have twenty candidates duking it out among themselves it won't come to anything. I've seen this movie more than once. It would need to be a battle between two, which would require someone to intervene to convince everyone else to walk away. I don't know who that someone is in this instance.

He did. Then there was Iraq and how the lead-up to that went. We went and did the liberty cabbage thing again, only this time we weren't even at war.

This is exactly why I said that the primaries look as if these people are basically trying to find out who should be the one that will go one on one with Trump. Especially since I suspect that they will do the same as Democrats did to Bernie in 2020. Once voting starts everyone will quit and embrace this one person. Plus for now it is probably better that the race floor is full. Since other candidates can take plenty of media space or focus fire on Trump from all sides. It really seems that the party is trying to get rid of him and that presumes that there is some kind of a game plan.


I said Afghanistan since that was a genuine international mission. While Iraq was more of a private show of US.
But Bush isn't really good example for anything, he is already half Trump on most issues.

I see a difference in that I see Trump being motivated by going after the people who went after him. That's a lot more erratic and terrifying in its own way. He's not just going to get in there and tweet and then an entire news cycle is devoted to how shocking the tweet was. I don't think either outcome is good, ultimately.

I don't think either outcome produces anything good for climate change, unfortunately. Climate change can be compared to Covid-19 when it comes to how they think about it. It doesn't matter what the politicians actually believe; they important thing is that they know where the bread is buttered.

The problem is that all other candidates don't have a unified opinion on the topic. Some are somewhat better than the others on the issue. However Trump as the main representative of the most anti-intellectual wing of the party is probably the worst on the issue.

My whole argument is that I still see the difference between bad and very bad. While certain shades of the color still matter to me. In others I can still see some random elements with which I can "work with", while with Trump I don't see even that. With others I can have "agree to disagree" position. While with Trump it is pure "He has to go, period".

 

[Virtual ghost]

I'm highly skeptical Trump or any of his cabal will do any real time. Obviously, if he (or any republican) wins the next election it will all go away. Either the investigations/indictments/prosecutions will be cancelled or pardons galore. As an aside, the whole presidential pardon power is nuts. It makes no rational sense other than the founding fathers were protecting their own. There is no other reason to invest this office with such power other than cronyism.

I even think if Trump loses the general, Biden will pardon him (if he can be sure Trump won't run again.) Not sure about this, but politicians like to take care of their own. They all probably have skeletons in their closets and never being held to account is a key foundation of the whole political institution. Otherwise, politicians might have to behave morally and ethically. I don't think that notion is palatable to any of them. They like to lie/cheat/steal and if they get caught, maybe they don't get elected. But that's the only penalty they expect to pay. No accountability for malfeasance outside of at the ballet box. I suspect this is a bi-partisan sentiment.

I wouldn't be so sure or openly defeatist about all of this. Especially since now they have finally hit him with truly serious charges. Jan 6. isn't some tax fraud or porn star nonsense. Organization of what if basically a coup is very serious charge.

Plus there is no way that Biden will pardon Trump. If anything that would signal that the whole system is fake and just because of that there is no way he would do it. Even if I have very serious doubts that he has such intentions. The dislike here is genuine.

 

[The Cat]

Using military terms for his strategy points. State sanctioned propaganda being approved for use in schools. His state guard is being given military training. Coincidences happen every day. But I don't trust coincidences. I rather Suspect Moff Tankin of harboring less than honest intentions in his plans for the future.​

 

[SensEye]

I wouldn't be so sure or openly defeatist about all of this. Especially since now they have finally hit him with truly serious charges. Jan 6. isn't some tax fraud or porn star nonsense. Organization of what if basically a coup is very serious charge.

I hope you are right. I would love to be proven to be too cynical. But I am going to have to see it to believe it.

I mean, you are right, these are serious charges. Very serious. Too bad it took 3.5 years to finally get around to bringing them. And they probably won't get to trail until after the election (so maybe never). And the accused has a 50/50 chance at becoming president again despite being obviously guilty.

Oops, my cynicism is creeping in again....

 

[The Cat]

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

This is exactly why I said that the primaries look as if these people are basically trying to find out who should be the one that will go one on one with Trump. Especially since I suspect that they will do the same as Democrats did to Bernie in 2020. Once voting starts everyone will quit and embrace this one person. Plus for now it is probably better that the race floor is full. Since other candidates can take plenty of media space or focus fire on Trump from all sides. It really seems that the party is trying to get rid of him and that presumes that there is some kind of a game plan.


I said Afghanistan since that was a genuine international mission. While Iraq was more of a private show of US.
But Bush isn't really good example for anything, he is already half Trump on most issues.

I appreciate that. I think he's part of the evolutionary path and Trump is another iteration that's more intense in many ways. When Trump was in office it seemed like there was an strong attempt to rehabilitate Bush and it drove me crazy. I felt like I was living in a different reality than these people.

I was trying to remember this Chris Rock quote and dug it up. It dates back to 2015:

"As bad as George W. Bush was, he revolutionized the presidency. He was the first president who only served the people that voted for him. He ran the country like a cable network; he only catered to his subscribers. Obama's main fault is not realizing that's kind of what people want. That whole trying-to-make-everybody-happy thing is done. People who voted for him want him to do what Bush did. And whoever's the next president will do what Bush did."

People are still making assertions that have these unspoken implications that Trump has brought something new to the Republican party that didn't exist before. It gets under my skin.

The problem is that all other candidates don't have a unified opinion on the topic. Some are somewhat better than the others on the issue. However Trump as the main representative of the most anti-intellectual wing of the party is probably the worst on the issue.

My whole argument is that I still see the difference between bad and very bad. While certain shades of the color still matter to me. In others I can still see some random elements with which I can "work with", while with Trump I don't see even that. With others I can have "agree to disagree" position. While with Trump it is pure "He has to go, period".

Who are some of the ones you like the best?

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

This is exactly why I said that the primaries look as if these people are basically trying to find out who should be the one that will go one on one with Trump. Especially since I suspect that they will do the same as Democrats did to Bernie in 2020. Once voting starts everyone will quit and embrace this one person. Plus for now it is probably better that the race floor is full. Since other candidates can take plenty of media space or focus fire on Trump from all sides. It really seems that the party is trying to get rid of him and that presumes that there is some kind of a game plan.

The problem is that the Republicans don't have an Obama figure (the closest thing is Trump). There's nobody who has the pull, who everybody feels compelled to entertain, who can go and have phone calls or meetings and convince them to quit the race.

 

[Virtual ghost]

I appreciate that. I think he's part of the evolutionary path and Trump is another iteration that's more intense in many ways. When Trump was in office it seemed like there was an strong attempt to rehabilitate Bush and it drove me crazy. I felt like I was living in a different reality than these people.

I was trying to remember this Chris Rock quote and dug it up. It dates back to 2015:

"As bad as George W. Bush was, he revolutionized the presidency. He was the first president who only served the people that voted for him. He ran the country like a cable network; he only catered to his subscribers. Obama's main fault is not realizing that's kind of what people want. That whole trying-to-make-everybody-happy thing is done. People who voted for him want him to do what Bush did. And whoever's the next president will do what Bush did."

People are still making assertions that have these unspoken implications that Trump has brought something new to the Republican party that didn't exist before. It gets under my skin.


Who are some of the ones you like the best?

Trump has brought some new things to the table. However those things are mostly in rhetoric and foreign policy that stuff can be easy to miss since the changes are much more visible from the outside. While from within the difference probably isn't that big.


As for "like the best" question: I have no clear favorite but in general I prefer those that aren't overbearing or openly religious in every detail.

In other words as I said before I don't consider the GOP to be the right wing party. For me that is just some kind of conglomerate of Libertarians, very religious people, lobbyists and gun owners. What for me isn't that much of right wing. For me right wing means social stability/functionality and keeping things together in hard times (while making efficient flows of money). What is where most of the named groups fail in practical sense and this is because their ideas in the end are leading to disorder and inability to stay globally competitive. Therefore if you work against that you simply can't pass as right wing. This is why I keep my eyes on the candidates on the right that may have enough of a brain to realize this problem and thus introduce right wing policies of 21th century into USA. Which would boost order and organization since the technology simply requires it. What is a certain must if you want to stay functional and competitive these days. For example my local far right here in Europe fully supports socialized healthcare since that has the same status as police (and no one sane is against it). Not to mention that they formed their own environmentalist division in order to attract voters on common sense basis (and they don't want that left has the monopoly on the topic). While in US stuff like that are basically unthinkable. Which is exactly kinda why US is falling behind other developed nations. Your left isn't stellar but your right is basically just pure nonsense. What basically means that you are a country with crippled leg and the costs of that are huge. In other words Democrats can work pretty well but that still can't fix the hole made by the crippled leg. Especially since that leg is governing the entire countryside and a fair amount of suburbs (and that wouldn't change anytime soon). This is why I am looking at the US right, since that is where the problem is. Democrats can win some areas but that just isn't enough. The GOP simply needs some serious software upgrades.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Some thoughts on what is going in Wisconsin.

 

[The Cat]

 

[The Cat]

 

[ceecee]

So if one reads the specifics of the case against Matthew DePerno, the voting machines were from three counties - one of which I lived in and worked at the polls for the 2020 election. Not in the district I lived in as that is illegal for obvious reasons, but in the county. I don't have even the smallest amount of sympathy for any of these deranged fucks or their supporters who are even worse. Don't especially buy that they believed whatever lies they were told - the county clerk, also Trump and GOP supporter, told them to take the machines. All of this is illegal, no matter what they were told. As the person running to be the AG if Michigan, you would think that would go without them having to be told it was a crime.

 

[The Cat]

So if one reads the specifics of the case against Matthew DePerno, the voting machines were from three counties - one of which I lived in and worked at the polls for the 2020 election. Not in the district I lived in as that is illegal for obvious reasons, but in the county. I don't have even the smallest amount of sympathy for any of these deranged fucks or their supporters who are even worse. Don't especially buy that they believed whatever lies they were told - the county clerk, also Trump and GOP supporter, told them to take the machines. All of this is illegal, no matter what they were told. As the person running to be the AG if Michigan, you would think that would go without them having to be told it was a crime.

This is why Moe was always angry with Larry and Shemp and later Curly. Thinking has fallen out of fashion and alas that means Jack boots are coming in season.

 

[Totenkindly]

And... here we go, courtesy of Missouri... This is pretty classic bullshit here in terms of the situation and how things existed (at best) before any protective laws existed for trans folks.

There was a bathroom typo in one of the articles but the actual filing (which appears in the article via Scribd) clears it up. Essentially a transkid having expressed at 6-7 years old and now living full-time for 2+ years without issues, came to a new high school fully transitioned, but school knew her birth status.

The school said she was forbidden to use the girls bathroom (it was "against the law"?) and told she must use either the one non-gendered bathroom or the boys bathroom. She tried to use the non-gendered bathroom but it's not near her classes and is heavily used by a variety of students, so she was getting criticized by multiple teachers for not using the regular bathrooms. When she decided to use the girl's bathrooms regardless, she received multiple disciplinary actions over a month or two until she got suspended. When she came back, she did attempt to use the boy's bathroom, and someone suggested in the bathroom that he oughta rape her.

Fell into a terrible depression since the school didn't do shit (well, actually they were piling on), she was now being socially ridiculed by some classmates, and finally pulled out for virtual learning while also falling into depression and attempting suicide. She started the next school year there due to lack of resource but family moved out a few months later.

This is a really familiar story for many years, not just for transitioned young people at schools/colleges but even for adults in the workplace. Thanks much to all those troglodytes out there seeking to score cheap political points.

Transgender student was denied use of girls’ restroom at Platte County High School, lawsuit states

The lawsuit alleges discrimination based on a student’s transgender status, sex designated at birth and her clinical diagnosis of gender dysphoria.

www.kctv5.com