Can you have unusual Enneagram/MBTI combinations?

[Athenian200]

Interesting idea from here:

The Enneagram and the MBTI&reg: Scoring

The main thing that perplexes me is this... most would tend to choose an enneagram type that fits their MBTI type (or vice-versa), and if they choose one that doesn't, people will tell them it's a mistype or mark it off as individual traits.

So what I'm asking is, could a person have somewhat/seemingly conflicting enneagram and MBTI scores? If so, how would this manifest?

Some examples I've thought of (or borrowed) to give an example of such unusual combinations:

Judging 7's

Perceiving 3's

Feeling 5's

Thinking 4's

Finally, do you think that any one type may be more disposed to having a particular enneagram/MBTI conflict than another, even if that type usually has a more normal enneagram type?

Of course, it could all be due to misunderstanding of both systems, and that trait conflicts can't really exist in such a manner. Which do you think it is?

 

[white]

Interesting idea from here:

The Enneagram and the MBTI&reg: Scoring

The main thing that perplexes me is this... most would tend to choose an enneagram type that fits their MBTI type (or vice-versa), and if they choose one that doesn't, people will tell them it's a mistype or mark it off as individual traits.

So what I'm asking is, could a person have somewhat/seemingly conflicting enneagram and MBTI scores? If so, how would this manifest?

Some examples I've thought of (or borrowed) to give an example of such unusual combinations:

Judging 7's

Perceiving 3's

Feeling 5's

Thinking 4's

Finally, do you think that any one type may be more disposed to having a particular enneagram/MBTI conflict than another, even if that type usually has a more normal enneagram type?

Of course, it could all be due to misunderstanding of both systems, and that trait conflicts can't really exist in such a manner. Which do you think it is?

Good thread Athenian, following on Ezra's typing one.

I'm not certain how the Enneagram dovetails with the MBTI. I did the test twice and came out with roughly balanced scores, but highest in the shame triad, lowest in the anger. Ezra typed me as 3w4. I'm still not sure how this fits with the ENTP as you've observed. I can't really find a fit on the Enneagram that I'm comfortable with actually. Would be interested to hear more. .

 

[wildcat]

Interesting idea from here:

The Enneagram and the MBTI&reg: Scoring

The main thing that perplexes me is this... most would tend to choose an enneagram type that fits their MBTI type (or vice-versa), and if they choose one that doesn't, people will tell them it's a mistype or mark it off as individual traits.

So what I'm asking is, could a person have somewhat/seemingly conflicting enneagram and MBTI scores? If so, how would this manifest?

Some examples I've thought of (or borrowed) to give an example of such unusual combinations:

Judging 7's

Perceiving 3's

Feeling 5's

Thinking 4's

Finally, do you think that any one type may be more disposed to having a particular enneagram/MBTI conflict than another, even if that type usually has a more normal enneagram type?

Of course, it could all be due to misunderstanding of both systems, and that trait conflicts can't really exist in such a manner. Which do you think it is?

The individuals whose E shows an unusual pattern should do the MBTI CP test.
The cognate aberration is evident there as well.

It is as it should be.

Edit.
The MBTI is not about the 16 types.
The 16 types is about the MBTI.

 

[Ezra]

Judging 7's

Perceiving 3's

Feeling 5's

Thinking 4's

You may be surprised, but the middle two - Perceiving 3s and Feeling 5s - are actually quite common. However, Thinking 4s and Judging 7s are certainly uncommon.

I think, basically, that each type's behaviour (even their atypical behaviour e.g. an intellectual, philosophical 8) is linked with certain ways of being over others, and while some are rare but still go down well e.g. a Feeling 8 or an ISTP 3, some are just "no" i.e. if you found one, you'd either be a genius or mistaken, more likely the latter.

I've always thought the chart at the bottom of this page was the best resource for MBTT/Enneagram correlations. But even some of those surprise me a lot. It seems that 7s as ESTJs aren't "Least Common" but "Less Common". It seems like Judging 7s do actually exist in MBTT.

 

[Ezra]

I'm not certain how the Enneagram dovetails with the MBTI. I did the test twice and came out with roughly balanced scores, but highest in the shame triad, lowest in the anger. Ezra typed me as 3w4. I'm still not sure how this fits with the ENTP as you've observed.

I didn't type you as a 3w4; I said that this is a possibility. We'll look more into it if you want. I actually wanted to say 4, because you scored so balanced, so I assumed you had identity issues, which is a major issue for the Shame triad, but since 4s are very rarely if ever NTs, I decided on the next more likely one - 3w4. 3 is the only type in the Shame triad that remotely fits the NT temperament (and even this is not the most likely). On top of this, you scored highest in that triad.

A question for you: how sure are you of your being a Thinker over a Feeler? Honestly?

I can't really find a fit on the Enneagram that I'm comfortable with actually.

You're not the first. There are quite a few at the16types who feel the same way; they think their socionics type fits much better than their Etype. (However, there are a few people who feel the opposite way, even though they came to socionics first.) Personally, I feel that my Etype settles much more easily with me than my MBTT type. I also think it's easier to find your MBTT type if you know your Etype rather than vice versa.

The MBTI is not about the 16 types.
The 16 types is about the MBTI.

That's bullshit. That would mean that socionics is not about Jung's eight functions or even the sixteen variations that arise from said functions, but about Myers-Briggs, which is blatent crap, because MBTT is obviously based on what Jung says, and Myers or Briggs or anyone from their institute would readily admit this.

 

[Ezra]

Anyway, back to the original question. Yes, I think these occur. I think that correlations are only rough guidelines as to likelihood, which is why Baron and Wagele (who produced the bottom chart on the page I posted) have a system from "Least Common" to "Most Common", as opposed to "You Will Never Find One" to "All xs are ys".

 

[Totenkindly]

A question for you: how sure are you of your being a Thinker over a Feeler? Honestly?

fwiw, she comes across to me online as an emotive ENTP... i.e., not the sort of hardcore T that can drive people nutty, she actually has some warmth that often can be more representative of F.

(Compare her to Niffer and she does come off as T to Niffer's F, but it's a kinder and gentler T than someone like Nocapszy, for example. It could also just be indicative of having a much stronger Ne than Ti. Ne is softer observably and can thus emulate F to a degree.)

I never would have thought "Three" for her, enneagram-wise.

Obviously all of these opinions are prone to adjustment with the introduction of additional info!

 

[Ezra]

Well, ENTP 3s aren't common. Like I said, it was an estimation based on her results. I just used the evidence in front of me. Perhaps she's a 6. This wouldn't be unlikely; ENTP 6s are pretty common (not as common as xNTJ 6s, but common). It would also account for her balanced results (indecisiveness). Perhaps even 9. They are brilliant at being able to identify with every Etypes to some extent.

So, aelan, how do you feel about 6 or 9?

 

[Totenkindly]

So, aelan, how do you feel about 6 or 9?

I'm interested in hearing more about her preferences for Nine, if I had to pick. Six seems a shot in the dark.

 

[Ezra]

Scratch that. ENTP 9 is like ESTJ 4. Doesn't happen.

 

[white]

Eh damn! Sorry for derailing your thread Athenian

I've shifted my answer to Ezra's thread, but didn't realise the Jolly Holly and the Helper were rattling off here.

 

[miss fortune]

I think she's an ENTP! (after all, I'm an ESTP who gets acused of Fdom sometimes! )

umm.. yeah... that would be a majority of my contribution... I'm an estp 7w8, so not unusual at all! I'm NOT special! I don't know any exceptions to the norm enneagram/mbti wise, but I wouldn't rule it out- I beleive that there's exceptions to everything!

 

[INTJMom]

I think I'm a thinking 4.

I also have a high 1 factor.

 

[Magic Poriferan]

***did not read any replies***

Of course you can have unusual combinations. I'm one myself.
The test results always come out that way, and the description seems most accurate, so why disagree?
I do believe that some Enneagram and MBTI combinations are more likely, and I'd be shocked if there wasn't any correlation.
Some do seem highly doubtful, as I have a hard time imagining a type Seven ISFJ. I simply don't know how someone could honestly have the personality to consistently get that result.
This is because some parts of the two systems overlap and some don't.
So there is no direct translation, but there are averages.

For the record, my mother is an F and a Five.
I'm a P and a One.
These things happen.

 

[Athenian200]

***did not read any replies***

Of course you can have unusual combinations. I'm one myself.
The test results always come out that way, and the description seems most accurate, so why disagree?
I do believe that some Enneagram and MBTI combinations are more likely, and I'd be shocked if there wasn't any correlation.
Some do seem highly doubtful, as I have a hard time imagining a type Seven ISFJ. I simply don't know how someone could honestly have the personality to consistently get that result.
This is because some parts of the two systems overlap and some don't.
So there is no direct translation, but there are averages.

For the record, my mother is an F and a Five.
I'm a P and a One.
These things happen.

Yes, I do think some of them are outlandish enough to be implausible if not impossible.

Have you seen certain unusual traits or conflicts resulting from a person being a Feeling Five or a Perceiving One? What type is your mother?

 

[Magic Poriferan]

My mother is an INFP, which is the Feeling type most likely to be a Five.
Her Feelings are definitely under-expressed compared to most Feelers, and most of the time, her F-ness comes through in her philosophy more than her expression.
She pretty shamelessly puts objectivity and rationale aside.
I think the result of someone who is a Feeling Five is a person that, honestly, has very little grounding in reality. It's a world entirely comprised of theory, following rules defined more by feelings than logic.
Imagine what that's like.
I don't think she's ever gotten different results, so there isn't much dispute about her type.

As for me?
I have a hard time thinking of inner-conflicts I might possess.
That might be a problem, actually.

 

[TaylorS]

Once in a while I'll score as a 4w5 on an Enneagram test, I usually test 5w4.

 

[Athenian200]

As for me?
I have a hard time thinking of inner-conflicts I might possess.
That might be a problem, actually.

Why would it be a problem? But do you never feel conflicted between your P tendency to simply adjust to the situation, and your 1 ideals of trying to be perfect or create perfection?

Once in a while I'll score as a 4w5 on an Enneagram test, I usually test 5w4.

That's odd... I'm a 4w5. Or at least I think I am based on what I've read on the matter so far, I don't know how to be certain.

 

["?"]

I have seen some on the enneagram institute board which claim to be a MBTI type uncharacteristic of an E-TYPE. Yet interestingly enough, it is MBTI followers who generally attempt to correlate the two systems. Many (if not most) enneagram followers see the systems as being separate since they measure completely different things. MBTI measures cognition solely. Enneagram takes into account emotions and environmental upbringing.

 

[Athenian200]

I have seen some on the enneagram institute board which claim to be a MBTI type uncharacteristic of an E-TYPE. Yet interestingly enough, it is MBTI followers who generally attempt to correlate the two systems. Many (if not most) enneagram followers see the systems as being separate since they measure completely different things. MBTI measures cognition solely. Enneagram takes into account emotions and environmental upbringing.

I was thinking that perhaps they measured different things. But what is the difference between cognition and emotions/environment? It does seem like there might be one, but I'm not good at drawing distinctions.