I don't know if I should still be in this thread, since I consider myself phobic now, but now that you bring up phobic sixes...
I think some differences I see is P6 vs CP6, is the CP6 has *more* of a reliance on self, rather than the over-reliance on external standards dictated by others.
So, this is why I think they get mistaken for 8's, who go inward to protect vulnerability/rejection. 8's trust their abilities. CP6's trust themselves(ish).
But it's a baseline trust. It's a self-preservational trust rather than one built on confidence in their abilities. (Unlike 8's)* Uh. "At least I know I have my own back" comes to mind.
I think the difference in a CP6, is they never really trust themselves but they know they aren't ones enemy. Lol. So, there's a safety in the CP6 own sense of trust in themselves but as opposed to 8's* 6's abilities are always in question because it is measured by others standards, or outside influence, rather than our own. It's why we second guess SO much because we are always watching for changing variables. Or are aware of HOW something will change.
I think, and correct me here, that P6's seem way calmer in the world than CP6's - provided they can prepare or can access outside support systems to "have their backs" they won't feel out of control. Since the world is set up this way, P6's have many an outlet to "trust in" and won't seem so volitile as a CP6 does.
A lot of this will overlap to some extent, but I see P6 more outwardly oriented/less self oriented than CP6's. Hmm. What do you see tho?
I really like the whole post, but especially the bolded part.It can be a bit unnerving to almost never take anything for granted and to be on the lookout for change at any moment. You are never working on solid ground! Especially in relationships, I don't know if I ever quite stop double checking things. I think my awareness of negative trends in an otherwise positive relationship can be very useful though, because I am very quick to bring the problem up and work through it with the person before the relationship changes for the worse. But some people might also find it a bit of a downer, or take the constant troubleshooting personally.
I also think sixes make great comedians/satirists/social critics for this reason, because they don't take their environment for granted and seize upon inconsistencies and worrying trends.
As to the phobic vs. counterphobic question, I am not sure. I would say I tend to make lots of allies, but aside from a few people in my life, I don't find I rely on them overly. Even though other people are probably very trustworthy, my reliance upon them is pretty similar to video games where you have to quickly hop from platform to platform before they collapse. It's better than no platform, but I don't take its stability for granted. I see people as trustworthy moment to moment, but I know nothing is certain and that everything changes. That being said, I always try to be very reliable for others, because I know how valuable it is to me.
I like the counterphobic strategy of taking things into your own hands, but a lot of the ways they carry that out strikes me as misguided. It just doesn't seems strategically prudent to upset potential allies with reactive or even aggressive behaviour. People don't like to feel tested and provoked, so if you are going to test and provoke people, at least do it in an indirect or diplomatic way (jokes help).
Don't get me wrong, my mind is running away with itself just like yours, I have imaginary falling outs with my friends every now and then, but I am aware that I am being crazy, so I at least try to pretend like I am not freaking out (at first). Why tip your hand until its time to play the card? My go-to strategy to deal with unfamiliar or threatening people is to be puppy dog friendly, combined with self-deprecation. So in a way it's a sort of counterphobic approach of the problem, because I will say very bold things to intimidating people, but it's meant to charm and disarm them. I suppose it is an attempt to win them over to my side, but it is also sort of a show of strength (you don't scare me, look how at ease I am!)
In terms of my phobic coping I think I still rely mostly on myself: In the workplace, I usually pretend to be more socially naive than I actually am, so ambitious people won't be threatened by me. There is a position at my work a bunch of people fought over, and in the end none of them kept the job more than 6 months, because they all undermined and sabotaged each other. Meanwhile I just stayed friends with everyone and encouraged them to go for the position. And now that the field is clear a year or two later (with all the candidates demoted, fired, or transferred away) silly old Forever_Jung was offered the promotion without even applying for it!
It worked out better than I could have hoped for, but honestly, a lot of things end up working out like that for me.
It's sort of like in "I Claudius" by Robert Graves, where Claudius exaggerates his stammer and his limp, and he ends up outliving all the poisoners and schemers who took him for a feeble dunce.
I think that's sort of how phobic sixes handle things. You makes friends not enemies, and you always have this abiding awareness that the tallest blade of grass is the one that gets chopped down. You would rather take a backseat, then wear the bullseye on your chest. You want to appear likable and non-threatening, as opposed to strong and independent and "above" help from others.
[MENTION=7040]Forever_Jung[/MENTION]
What do you recommend a 7 or 9 do in these situations to reassure the 6 that despite being easygoing, a capable and mindful attitude IS still present? What would be effective to say?
I suppose you could just say that despite being easygoing, you aren't taking things lightly. I probably won't believe you though, because you are laughing at me for being worried. I shouldn't be so hard on the types.
Come to think of it, it's not that I don't think they are at all capable, they just lack vigilance. I am the sort of person who is constantly anticipating what will happen next: how will things play out, what are the possible threats, how will that person react if x, y or z happens, etc. So I am solving problems (or at least mentally making sure I know where the fire exits are) before they come to a head. These types may take the problems seriously when they come up, but to me, just carelessly letting threats sneak up on you IS the problem. It doesn't matter how capable and serious you are when the threat arrives, if you have been outflanked by enemy forces, you are screwed! Sure I may solve a bunch of extra problems that only exist in my head, but it makes me feel better to be internally prepared for any possible occurrence. If I had been in charge of Rome during the Punic wars, we would have prepared for Hannibal crossing the alps!
^My posts here are somewhat old (and embarrassing). As I recently said elsewhere around here somewhere, I've come to see CP6 reactivity more like people/trust-OCD. I don't think it's coming from a place of being 'right'/righteous conviction so much as just
needing to know.
It's possible I'm still wrong and in another year I'll be embarrassed again by this post, but
.
Yes, this is much better! I quite like this.
Even when I am "taking someone down a peg", it's almost for the sake of transparency. I am actually not terribly interested in what's "right" in the usual sense. I always think I am being very helpful when I tell people why Mother Theresa wasn't so great, or how John Lennon beat his wife, so he's probably not an ideal role model. But apparently people don't like it when you criticize their heroes. I personally wouldn't want to believe in something false or build my house on a shaky foundation. I just want to know!
The worst thing you can give me is a blank slate. I learned to provoke people (humour is the safest way) just to be able to reliably get feedback so I can relax a little. I can deal with anything, just let me know so I can get my footing.
Resting bitch face people, and placid introverts arouse my suspicions, what are they THINKING!?
I try to be indirect about it, so as to not cause social problems, but I am constantly checking with people to make sure "we are okay". Even with very reliable relationships like with my father, I sometimes wonder whether he has finally changed his mind about me. I VERY MUCH enjoy the company of ISJ's for this reason, and actually IJ's in general. They tend to be very cautious and slow to react
