[ENTP] ENTP Enneagram survey

[Stephano]

I recently did a survey in the ENTP-Facebook group and it came out most of us are 7w8s.
Surprisingly there was only one type 3 who voted (That guy actually voted 3w6 which is of course not possible, but I guess he got the 3 from a test so I count it though).

Here are the full results:

7w8 - 17 votes
7w6 - 5 votes
8w7 - 4 votes
5w4 - 1 vote
6w5 - 1 vote
6w7 - 1 vote
8w9 - 1 vote
3 ....- 1 vote


I also looked up a poll on TypoC which came to these results:

7w6 - 11 votes
7w8 - 9 votes
7wX - 1 vote
5 ....- 3 votes
6 ....- 3 votes
8 ....- 3 votes
3w4 - 2 votes
3wX - 2 votes
9 ....- 2 (1) votes (Kasper, Fluxkom)

The other votes are obviously jokes. 1 and 4, rly?
Fluxkom's profile says he's 7w6 so you can count it as one vote. (Link: http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/enneagram/24692-entp-enneagrams.html)

The thing with the second poll is that a higher percentage voted 7w6 than 7w8. This is the main difference to the Facebook-group and it shows that a lot more data is necessary to make a meaningful analysis.

 

[Aha]

There are a lot of 5 and 8 on the PerC forum

I am 8w9 7w8 4w3 sx/so. Tests will show 8, 3, 7, 5, 4 in this order, but I will only trust my own typing after reading about every enneagram, wings, stackings, tritypes.

I conclude that 90% of people are at least a little bit mistyped in enneagram

 

[Society]

There are a lot of 5 and 8 on the PerC forum

I am 8w9 7w8 4w3 sx/so. Tests will show 8, 3, 7, 5, 4 in this order, but I will only trust my own typing after reading about every enneagram, wings, stackings, tritypes.

I conclude that 90% of people are at least a little bit mistyped in enneagram

i'm wondering, is that exclusively from a break down of the gut/head/heart centers? do you find the descriptions of the messenger accurate?


i admit that i initially thought tritype was a cheap patchwork trying to compensate for the failing of enneagram theory, but the descriptions ended up a lot more descriptive and accurate then many other typology formats. combine the breakdown of heart/gut/head with the understanding of enneagram as neurosis rather then behavior... typology as a fuckup-remix works better then anything else.

as for me

wrong spoiler

 

[Aha]

i'm wondering, is that exclusively from a break down of the gut/head/heart centers? do you find the descriptions of the messenger accurate?

The description if absolutely accurate for me. The only tritype description that I can associate myself without a doubt.
I was always certain about 8 and 7 elements. Especially 8, because all motivations, holy ide. I thought my third one is 3. But it seems that I score high on this one because of overlap of "assertion" questions on tests. If anything, 5w4 description fits me great too, except that I am no introvert. But then I looked closer to the theory of enneagram - to the enneagram figure:

That one connected everything within my tritype
Healthy 8 will show some traits of 2. Stressed - 5
Healthy 7 will show some traits of 5. Stressed - 1
Healthy 4 will show some traits of 1. Stressed - 2
So, people of this enneagram in both healthy and unhealthy stated will show many 5ish, 2ish and 1ish traits.

i admit that i initially thought tritype was a cheap patchwork trying to compensate for the failing of enneagram theory, but the descriptions ended up a lot more descriptive and accurate then many other typology formats. combine the breakdown of heart/gut/head with the understanding of enneagram as neurosis rather then behavior... typology as a fuckup-remix works better then anything else.

There is nothing scientific about this theory for sure. Or almost nothing. Even so, I can see many ways how it is useful. Because, even knowing level of development your cognitive functions, there will be different people of the same JCF. Adding those 3 letters with instinct stacking will give you exactly what this person is. His behavior is now much more predictable. As for understanding yourself - it is not better than JCF. I see it more like to show people what are your motivations and fears are.
I view the whole system as effect of development of JCF. You will know the level of development of functions of a certain person judging by his enneagram. For example, very Ne-Fe ENTP will show more 9ish and 4ish traits. Maybe even some 2 and 6

as for me

wrong spoiler

 

[Aha]

i'm wondering, is that exclusively from a break down of the gut/head/heart centers? do you find the descriptions of the messenger accurate?

The description is absolutely accurate for me. The only tritype description that I can associate myself without a doubt.
I was always certain about 8 and 7 elements. Especially 8, because all motivations, holy ide. I thought my third one is 3. But it seems that I score high on this one because of overlap of "assertion" questions on tests. If anything, 5w4 description fits me great too, except that I am no introvert. But then I looked closer to the theory of enneagram - to the enneagram figure:

That one connected everything within my tritype
Healthy 8 will show some traits of 2. Stressed - 5
Healthy 7 will show some traits of 5. Stressed - 1
Healthy 4 will show some traits of 1. Stressed - 2
So, people of this enneagram in both healthy and unhealthy stated will show many 5ish, 2ish and 1ish traits.

i admit that i initially thought tritype was a cheap patchwork trying to compensate for the failing of enneagram theory, but the descriptions ended up a lot more descriptive and accurate then many other typology formats. combine the breakdown of heart/gut/head with the understanding of enneagram as neurosis rather then behavior... typology as a fuckup-remix works better then anything else.

There is nothing scientific about this theory for sure. Or almost nothing. Even so, I can see many ways how it is useful. Because, even knowing level of development your cognitive functions, there will be different people of the same JCF. Adding those 3 letters with instinct stacking will give you exactly what this person is. His behavior is now much more predictable. As for understanding yourself - it is not better than JCF. I see it more like to show people what are your motivations and fears are.
I view the whole system as effect of development of JCF. You will know the level of development of functions of a certain person judging by his enneagram. For example, very Ne-Fe ENTP will show more 9ish and 4ish traits. Maybe even some 2 and 6

as for me

wrong spoiler

 

[LanaBanana]

I'm not entirely sure I'm an ENTP, but my enneagram is 3w2, it that helps.

 

[Society]

The description is absolutely accurate for me. The only tritype description that I can associate myself without a doubt.
I was always certain about 8 and 7 elements. Especially 8, because all motivations, holy ide. I thought my third one is 3. But it seems that I score high on this one because of overlap of "assertion" questions on tests. If anything, 5w4 description fits me great too, except that I am no introvert. But then I looked closer to the theory of enneagram - to the enneagram figure:

That one connected everything within my tritype
Healthy 8 will show some traits of 2. Stressed - 5
Healthy 7 will show some traits of 5. Stressed - 1
Healthy 4 will show some traits of 1. Stressed - 2
So, people of this enneagram in both healthy and unhealthy stated will show many 5ish, 2ish and 1ish traits.

so for the 7-8-4 messenger combo:
the integration for the head is the disintegration for the gut.
the integration for the heart is the disintegration for the head.

you could argue that a good portion of the making of any tritype is a way of dealing and resolving the issues that stem from the enneagrams themselves and the shared integration/disintegration points - the solutions to one side's internal conflicts are the crutch of another side. i am curious to what extent you could extend this to tritype personalities as a whole.

i don't know to what extent would JCF development work alongside enneagram growth - it certainly helps, but it could also have counter productive affects to overcome. SiFe development would help bring the 2 out of an 8, and better balance between Ne and Ti can bring the 5 out of the 7, but there's also some overlap between enneagram 1 and Si.

lol, i was moving the attention to the spoiler in my sig, but for future reference if i decide to change it:

MBTI: eNtP
Socionics: ILE
Big 5: SCUEI
Alignment: Chaotic-Neutral
Race: Half-Giant (Half-Gnome)
Class: LampShade Hanger
Enneagram: 7w6 4w5 8w9 sx/so
Ninja Turtle: Donatello

alternatives:
it's being commonly suggested (mostly by people who feel i asserted myself aggressively towards them) that i am a 7w8 or at least 7wd...

personally i identify a lot more with the 7w6 (i even entertained the possibility of counterphobic 6w7), and find that a lot of the areas in which i didn't fit the generic 7 descriptions are actually the 7w8 triats. being able to view the head fix and gut fix separately resolves the apparent conflict - i do externalize aggression (8 gut fix) and when i do use it to establish myself (more in an 8w9 "imperialistic" way then a 8w7 "hagmonist" way), but it's usually a last resort, and the slighest hint of 2 seems to be a manifestation of the 8s growth point as well (so far only parenting seems to bring that out of me). 9w8 has also being suggested for the gut fix, but trying to argue that i am conflict-avoidant seems one hell of a stretch.
the 4 fix was a lot obvious to me then either the head fix or the gut fix, but while core 4s deal with existentialism through jealousy and fantasizing on attainable meanings, while i deal with it with experimentation and self discovery, which makes a lot more sense when you combine the 4 heart fix with the 7 head fix. 4w3 vs 4w5 is still on debate, but if one could imagine an extroverted version of a 4w5, it would work a lot better for me then a 4w3 (and the 7 brings plenty of extrovertness into play).

 

[Society]

I'm not entirely sure I'm an ENTP, but my enneagram is 3w2, it that helps.

בדרך כלל אנשים שמשתמשים בהיגיון-חיצוני דומיננטי סומכים על ההחלטות שלהם בעיניים עצומות. את כתבת שאת אוהבת להשאיר את ההחלטות שלך ברגע האחרון - מה שמראה שאת מעדיפה להשאיר את העיניים פתוחים וגמישים לשינוי, מה שלא מתאים להיגיון-חיצוני דומיננטי בכלל.

just my 2 cents

 

[Aha]

so for the 7-8-4 messenger combo:
the integration for the head is the disintegration for the gut.
the integration for the heart is the disintegration for the head.

you could argue that a good portion of the making of any tritype is a way of dealing and resolving the issues that stem from the enneagrams themselves and the shared integration/disintegration points - the solutions to one side's internal conflicts are the crutch of another side. i am curious to what extent you could extend this to tritype personalities as a whole.

i don't know to what extent would JCF development work alongside enneagram growth - it certainly helps, but it could also have counter productive affects to overcome. SiFe development would help bring the 2 out of an 8, and better balance between Ne and Ti can bring the 5 out of the 7, but there's also some overlap between enneagram 1 and Si.

Absolutely.
Fe is a sword of two sides: 8 and 2. In Fe-doms it is clearly seen. As it is just our third function it may influence as a w2 to w3 or an integration of 8. Or even like 9
Stereotypically:
Ne-Ti - 7w8
Ti-Ne - 5w4

I think that stronger Fe presence will flip it to 8

alternatives:
it's being commonly suggested (mostly by people who feel i asserted myself aggressively towards them) that i am a 7w8 or at least 7wd...

personally i identify a lot more with the 7w6 (i even entertained the possibility of counterphobic 6w7), and find that a lot of the areas in which i didn't fit the generic 7 descriptions are actually the 7w8 triats. being able to view the head fix and gut fix separately resolves the apparent conflict - i do externalize aggression (8 gut fix) and when i do use it to establish myself (more in an 8w9 "imperialistic" way then a 8w7 "hagmonist" way), but it's usually a last resort, and the slighest hint of 2 seems to be a manifestation of the 8s growth point as well (so far only parenting seems to bring that out of me). 9w8 has also being suggested for the gut fix, but trying to argue that i am conflict-avoidant seems one hell of a stretch.
the 4 fix was a lot obvious to me then either the head fix or the gut fix, but while core 4s deal with existentialism through jealousy and fantasizing on attainable meanings, while i deal with it with experimentation and self discovery, which makes a lot more sense when you combine the 4 heart fix with the 7 head fix. 4w3 vs 4w5 is still on debate, but if one could imagine an extroverted version of a 4w5, it would work a lot better for me then a 4w3 (and the 7 brings plenty of extrovertness into play).

6 is the type I do not associate myself at all. Actually, in my thinking, it is an absolute antonym of 4. So I barely even considered 7w6.
As for description - they did not include extroverted intuitives in "the theory". They describe 7w8 and 8w7 as superb materialistic. But there is no such a thing as a materialistic intuitive.
Almost every ENTP are 78something in their ego fixations and holy ideas

4w3 vs 4w5. Heh. That is the hardest. I did struggle between those because it is not my major element and my first two types are extroverted. I chose 4w3 because I like to show off my uniqueness. w5 does not do such thing. But description of w5 is a better fit because I am really like an alien to other people around me. And again, I like it and not afraid to show it to people. As for what I can't associate myself with absolutely is envy
Lets just consider that our intuitive 7 is a substitute for 5

8w9 for me was the easiest because 8 just fits me perfectly on all levels and 9 adds daydreaming fixation and holy idea of love. I am not as ruthless as 8w7 but at the same time I can be even more aggressive and terrible if turned on. I literally feel x10 more powerful in this mode and I warn people to not cross the line. Power is the key word.

 

[Chad of the OttomanEmpire]

The source I like to consult is What Type Am I? by Renee Baron. She's worked extensively with both the enneagram and the MBTI and has printed the only correlations I currently trust. She correlates ENTPs the following way:

Most common: 7
Somewhat common: 3, 8
Less common: 6
Least common, all other types.

I'm inclined to take her word over the results of online surveys, where, as has been pointed out, many people initially mistype. Still, the data you've gathered indicates roughly the same as Baron's studies.

EDIT: I am not 7-fixed, btw. You don't "have to" be 7-fixed to be an ENTP. Your core type is simply likely to be one of the four listed above; all other variables are open to the individual in question.

 

[tinkerbell]

Never done an e test before I'm an 8w7 which seems to fit entp. Although I think the questions were skewed to harder perspectives than I would typically be in life. I do follow rules and authority if I respect it and follow the logic

 

[entropie]

How about an entp sex life survey, way more exiciting and I can handle the masses

 

[tinkerbell]

creativity is in their jeans