Women, "Play Nice" and the Danger Instinct

[Mole]

*Ducks behind bush to watch the big puddy-tat ferociously pounce on the leaves blowing past.*

Just practising.

Today the leaves, tomorrow Anja.

 

[Dwigie]

Very interesting thread. Actually I was the nastiest child according to my mother but it toned down. The problem with me is that I looked like a sixteen year old when I was in 7th grade, and always went home alone, didn't talk about things like this to my mother.
I've seen a man masturbate publicly at the age of 13.
I've been gropped by a man at the age 12, I was frozen by terror but just walked away...
People would oggle at me in pools all the time with no shame, following me around,disgusting.
Some men make strange comments and start following me from time to time but I quickly get the f out of there nowadays.The most memorable one said he wanted to get to know me and proceeded in stalking me in the subway car, I told him it was my stop, left the car and crawled back in a while later when everyone was coming out and in. Luckily he didn't catch me.
I've had way too many people trying to stalk me at a young age since I looked older than I was but didn't have the common sense or awareness necessary at 11-12. Plus the fact that the place I lived in was much safer did not help prepare me.
I don't acknowledge them nowadays but the "hollering" continues.I cover myself up neatly nowadays in order to stop these kind of unfortunate adventures. It's quite recurrent, I think it also has something to do with the fact that it is okay for men to just try and "hook up" ,get people's numbers off the street.
example:
"hey,oh shit girl...hmm..."*starts following for entire block"excuse me, excuse me? I'm trying to get to know you.(It may take time for them to give up depending on the "sanity")
but for some it's just a nasty look and down the deli I go hiding.

 

[LadyJaye]

"hey,oh shit girl...hmm..."*starts following for entire block"excuse me, excuse me? I'm trying to get to know you.(It may take time for them to give up depending on the "sanity")
but for some it's just a nasty look and down the deli I go hiding.

When I was in my early teens, that sort of behavior used to intimidate me into a form of powerless politeness. Being heckled by strangers always took me off- guard, because it was so blatant and offensive. But as I got older, I realized my best bet was to make an even bigger scene than they were creating, because essentially, they're trying to intimidate you into submission and silence, so they remain in power and you remain their victim. Not that I'm Wonder Woman or anything, but seriously, most men who try that mess on you are banking on you not reacting - they don't seriously believe that their atrocious behavior will actually result in them getting a date or a phone number out of you. It's designed to victimize. So I started returning their aggression, and most of them backed off.

 

[Dwigie]

When I was in my early teens, that sort of behavior used to intimidate me into a form of powerless politeness. Being heckled by strangers always took me off- guard, because it was so blatant and offensive. But as I got older, I realized my best bet was to make an even bigger scene than they were creating, because essentially, they're trying to intimidate you into submission and silence, so they remain in power and you remain their victim. Not that I'm Wonder Woman or anything, but seriously, most men who try that mess on you are banking on you not reacting - they don't seriously believe that their atrocious behavior will actually result in them getting a date or a phone number out of you. It's designed to victimize. So I started returning their aggression, and most of them backed off.

I hate that, such a waste of people's time. (I have a few who really believed so actually, it's true most of them don't but a few really really believe they will and literally stalk you.)

 

[LadyJaye]

I hate that, such a waste of people's time. (I have a few who really believed so actually, it's true most of them don't but a few really really believe they will and literally stalk you.)

Wow, that really concerns me for you. Do you have someone who can walk with you? Or perhaps a giant can of military grade mace?

 

[Jack Flak]

When I was in my early teens, that sort of behavior used to intimidate me into a form of powerless politeness. Being heckled by strangers always took me off- guard, because it was so blatant and offensive. But as I got older, I realized my best bet was to make an even bigger scene than they were creating, because essentially, they're trying to intimidate you into submission and silence, so they remain in power and you remain their victim. Not that I'm Wonder Woman or anything, but seriously, most men who try that mess on you are banking on you not reacting - they don't seriously believe that their atrocious behavior will actually result in them getting a date or a phone number out of you. It's designed to victimize. So I started returning their aggression, and most of them backed off.

Makes sense to me. Although I've known guys who do "act the fool" sometimes but are otherwise utterly respectful of females. It's probably more male bonding/humor in these cases, i.e. a carful of guys and one honks the horn--Often not the driver.

 

[Jack Flak]

Self-defense classes are something Sis and I have been discussing for some time.

They just put this back on the market: The Gerber Store - outdoor hunting and fishing knives and tools

 

[LadyJaye]

Makes sense to me. Although I've known guys who do "act the fool" sometimes but are otherwise utterly respectful of females. It's probably more male bonding/humor in these cases, i.e. a carful of guys and one honks the horn--Often not the driver.

Oh hey, I don't mind guys being silly and shouting fresh things at me. Most of the time , it's pretty funny, and fairly clear that they're just being playful. What enrages me is the menacing behavior.

 

[LadyJaye]

They just put this back on the market: The Gerber Store - outdoor hunting and fishing knives and tools

Pink and I have several Hibben throwing knives. They're very well made, but kinda expensive.

 

[disregard]

I wouldn't want a knife like that in my vicinity if someone was attacking me.

 

[LadyJaye]

I wouldn't want a knife like that in my vicinity if someone was attacking me.

Knives give me the creeps, personally. I see them as something that could be used against me.

 

[Jack Flak]

I wouldn't want a knife like that in my vicinity if someone was attacking me.

Well guns are called "the great equalizer," meaning that it doesn't matter if you're 100 pounds or 250. But if you know what you're doing with a knife like that, it could come close. Note: I'm not female, but I'd rather fight back and die than be helplessly assaulted at whim.

 

[disregard]

I would rather fight back too.. without the risk of being stabbed repeatedly.

 

[Domino]

I would rather fight back too.. without the risk of being stabbed repeatedly.

This is why I'm for the pocket pitbull. So what if it sprays foam and occasionally locks its jaws around your car keys? It more than makes up for those things by destroying your enemy one kneecap at a time.

Makes you wish switchblades were legal again.

 

[helen]

If you ask open ended questions, it gives the impression you might be interested in the reply.

But if you ask closed questions, it looks like you want to be controlling and manipulative.

And you have asked closed questions above.

Of course you don't have to ask questions at all, you can just say what you think - but that would make you vulnerable.

And to protect your vulnerability, you try to control me with closed questions.

And you hide your intention behind, "Just curious".

I find it hard to believe you are motivated by simple curiosity.

Curiosity, they say, killed the cat. Perhaps the cat's name is Victor.

But look to your left - I am not a cat, I am a panther.

Perhaps you have just made a mistake, if so, do tell me your feelings on the matter - I would be delighted to listen.

I was literally just curious. Sorry if it came across as confrontational or argumentative. Lately I've been suspicious of the way some people use MBTI, but it's vague and hard to put my finger on, so when I read what you had written I wondered if you were sensing something similar to what I was and if you could explain it.

I'm not really sure what you mean by open vs closed questions. I tried to ask specific questions rather than vague ones, because I am interested in obtaining answers to specific questions, not in issuing a vague invitation to ramble vaguely.

But this is all utterly unrelated to the OP. Sorry, Pink!

 

[Mole]

I was literally just curious. Sorry if it came across as confrontational or argumentative. Lately I've been suspicious of the way some people use MBTI, but it's vague and hard to put my finger on, so when I read what you had written I wondered if you were sensing something similar to what I was and if you could explain it.

I'm not really sure what you mean by open vs closed questions. I tried to ask specific questions rather than vague ones, because I am interested in obtaining answers to specific questions, not in issuing a vague invitation to ramble vaguely.

But this is all utterly unrelated to the OP. Sorry, Pink!

Thanks for your reply Helen.

You may well have been literally, "just curious", however the phase is a common phrase perhaps with metaphorical overtones. And it seemed to me that you were dismissing your feelings by saying that you were just curious in the same way housewives dismiss themselves by saying they are just housewives.

And I am quite happy for you to be confrontational and argumentative with me - it may be a way for you express and discover your feelings.

And it is interesting how we use MBTI. I would like us to deepen our understanding of how we use MBTI. Part of that is understanding the history of MBTI and how it relates to similar movements.

It is very interesting that you find it hard to put your finger on your suspicions. So perhaps you might like to handle your suspicions and show them to us.

Perhaps you might like to feel your suspicions, bring them into your conscious mind and share them with us.

Your suspicions do sound interesting.

 

[Cality]

I was tought all my childhood to distrust any strangers and how to recognise the signs for a dangerous person. I never had any issues like this because I flew before each time.
I think, that's one big cultural difference between french and americans : americans trust untill proven wrong, french distrust until proven wrong. The consequences are that american are welcoming and warm to strangers and french are reserved and not open at first (and therefore appear rude, even though it's not rudeness).

 

[Anja]

Do you still have sexual harrassment on the streets in France, Cality? Or has political correctness put a damper on that universal sport?

If so, how do you handle it?

I'm thinking about the sort of interactions I've had on the streets of Mexico and how it felt different to me than the same kind of thing here in the States.

 

[Cality]

What kind of harassment? I don't really feel harassed when I walk through the streets. Maybe I just pay attention to where I go and when it happens, it's usually young occupationsless guys who say "hey, you're pretty" as they say to any thing that looks a little feminine (or when homeless just bet for money).
When it ever happens, I just ignore them, even if they insist. I try to walk assured and not to look unsure or scared. I make my face look extremly cold and unfriendly. It works so far. Some of my friend say it's better to say hi in this case, because the guys are supposed to do less harm to you if you are polite. I never managed to. I am not harassed, maybe slightly more when I am in Paris... not too much though. Why? Have you or friends been harassed here in France? I was more harassed in Belgium.

 

[Uytuun]

I was more harassed in Belgium

Wallonia, Brussels or Flanders?

I have to say I feel quite safe here (Flanders) and most of the places I've gone to in Europe I've felt pretty safe as well, even when we were out with a bunch of girls in capitals or such. I don't know what your treshold is for safe, but I don't consider a guy whistling at me or a bunch of drunk guys trying to make conversation sexual harassment, at least not automatically. If they leave me alone when I indicate I'm not interested, then that's fine.

I'm not overly polite and will simply go away when a random guy tries to chat me up and I don't feel good about it, I've hit guys that touched me while dancing (sometimes even when they did so accidentally - that's a risk you take) or left/declined when they wanted to dance with me and I didn't (sounds like the normal thing to do, but it isn't). This is not a very common behaviour here, though, and it can get you funny looks. When I feel endangered, I don't hesitate to lash out like a cat.

agency

I easily trust people when I intuit them as being alright, though, and will follow them through foreign cities in the middle of the night.