What is your Personal Experience or Understanding of Inferior Ne?

[Dreamer]

I'm curious how people would describe it because I hear often that it is described as a moment of stress, as many can jump to their inferior function when other methods over dealing with a situation have been exhausted, but that within this moment of inner turmoil, the mind goes crazy with negative what-if? scenarios to act almost as evidence for their anxiety. To act as fuel behind their leading Si when under stress.

But, worry and spinning into hundreds of what-if thoughts isn't something I would think is limited to an Ne inferior person under stress. Is there a particular flavor to it that differs from other forms of this?

This question came to mind, because as those closer to me know, there are certainly times I can feel overwhelmed and spin in circles, mentally, and at least superficially, it would appear these two scenarios are the same, between an Ne inferior and an Ne dom under stress, but, there IS a difference, a nuance between the two, that I can't quite put my finger on at the moment.

 

[Forever_Jung]

I don't experience inferior Ne, but I think my friend is an ISTJ, and she does describe a lot of her inner life to me, so I could try to pass it on.

If she goes "off book", or does something new, she tends to want a lot of structure/prep/planning in place to ensure things don't go wonky. Without that, she starts to let herself get carried away by worst-case thinking. Even at the age of 19, she was a fierce proponent of things like "renter's insurance".

She can also be very suspicious when new things, new ideas, new people are "sprung on her", but usually strong logic can persuade her they might not be so bad.

If she is in a situation that disrupts her routines, she acts as though she has been thrown into utter chaos, and extrapolates wildly on the disruption.

It's sort of like she thinks: if I change my way of doing things, maybe everything is arbitrary and the world is chaos. ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE and NOTHING MATTERS! If you suggest she just lets it go, she spins off into a rant reminiscent of Annie from Community:

 

[OrangeAppled]

With my ISFJ e6 mom, I see it as catastrophizing. She tends to project negative outcomes and much of her imagination is focused on noticing every possible thing that could go wrong OR she is overly positive and falls prey to wishful thinking. She often uses wishful thinking to procrastinate, a kind of "well it will be fine so I won't bother doing anything". Unlike Ne types, her projections of what could be is used to procrastinate and put off action, to maintain status quo, whereas Ne types often use it to jump into action and spur change of some time.

Any person might do these things to a degree, but her sense of possibility is totally out of proportion so that Ne definitely colors her mentality, but in that unconscious, distorted way. The unrealistic/idealistic quality that people ascribe to Ne-dom is exaggerated when it occurs with her. Actual NPs often appear clever because they have a genuine nose for possibility or hidden meaning, and so it appears they do/uncover/see things which previously didn't seem possible to others. When they discuss these things, they may seem unrealistic & people might roll their eyes, but then their ideas may actually pan out. I observe that real Ne-dom are more frequently regarded as clever rather than too pie-in-the-sky.

With Si-dom, however, they often worry a lot or anticipate stuff that really does never happen or never will happen because it's based on internal fears or desires that get projected, not a developed intuitive sense of how the external world is developing or its intangible forces. My mom actually finds many NPs cynical because they dismiss her concerns or ideas a lot. They either find her paranoid or naively simplistic about how things could develop or what is an underlying dynamic, etc.

 

[Forever_Jung]

My mom actually finds many NPs cynical because they dismiss her concerns or ideas a lot. They either find her paranoid or naively simplistic about how things could develop or what is an underlying dynamic, etc.

I totally forgot about the naive side of the coin, that's on point. I don't see the naive thing AS MUCH in ISTJ's (I would say ISTJ's are a bit naive that relationships will work out, mistaking homeostasis/time together for love), but now that I'm thinking of my ISFJ grandmother, I definitely notice she tends to take an almost creepily rosy/simple view, or she worries way too much (she's an e9 as well).

It's weird sometimes, seeing my dreamer of an ENTP uncle, grounding my earthy ISFJ grandmother, trying to persuade her that there is a problem. Normally she has to explain to him why his newest e-commerce scheme is crazy.

 

[OrangeAppled]

I totally forgot about the naive side of the coin, that's on point. I don't see the naive thing AS MUCH in ISTJ's (I would say ISTJ's are a bit naive that relationships will work out, mistaking homeostasis/time together for love), but now that I'm thinking of my ISFJ grandmother, I definitely notice she tends to take an almost creepily rosy/simple view, or she worries way too much (she's an e9 as well).

It's weird sometimes, seeing my dreamer of an ENTP uncle, grounding my earthy ISFJ grandmother, trying to persuade her that there is a problem. Normally she has to explain to him why his newest e-commerce scheme is crazy.

Ah this is quite true. ISFJs and ISTJs are often naive/paranoid about different things, often revealing their shadow character; i.e. the typical strengths of the ENFP will be an area of naiveté or paranoid skepticism for an ISTJ.

 

[Forever_Jung]

Ah this is quite true. ISFJs and ISTJs are often naive/paranoid about different things, often revealing their shadow character; i.e. the typical strengths of the ENFP will be an area of naiveté or paranoid skepticism for an ISTJ.

That's an interesting thought, because my aforementioned ISTJ friend is sort of acting out like a shadow ENFP right now.

Her partner of 10 years who she was committed to completely, expressed some minor doubts about the future. And once he got her to focus on the potential negative outcomes of their relationship, she spiraled, and now wants to break up.

Now she is in on the overly simplistic side of her shadow, and is sure the break-up will work out and that she should go and play the field. And this guy, who had only wanted to express a moment of uncertainty, is in shock that someone who has been a pillar of consistency his entire adult life, is suddenly acting so flaky.

 

[entropie]

I only know superior Ne

 

[Dreamer]

I only know superior Ne

Therefore you must see inferior Ne all around you and know it very well then

 

[Dreamer]

I don't experience inferior Ne, but I think my friend is an ISTJ, and she does describe a lot of her inner life to me, so I could try to pass it on.

If she goes "off book", or does something new, she tends to want a lot of structure/prep/planning in place to ensure things don't go wonky. Without that, she starts to let herself get carried away by worst-case thinking. Even at the age of 19, she was a fierce proponent of things like "renter's insurance".

She can also be very suspicious when new things, new ideas, new people are "sprung on her", but usually strong logic can persuade her they might not be so bad.

If she is in a situation that disrupts her routines, she acts as though she has been thrown into utter chaos, and extrapolates wildly on the disruption.

It's sort of like she thinks: if I change my way of doing things, maybe everything is arbitrary and the world is chaos. ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE and NOTHING MATTERS! If you suggest she just lets it go, she spins off into a rant reminiscent of Annie from Community:

The bolded really does make a lot of sense to me. Like, there is this perception of the world around them and it’s constructed by this sense of reality that can be seen as unshakable in many ways I would imagine. Finding yourself off kilter, even momentarily, I imagine, would be very unsettling indeed. I guess then, it’d be in this time an Si dom would tap into Ne to try and find answers to make sense of what is going wrong.

With me, more than anything, I find I can feel overwhelmed when time begins to be a factor I must contend with and work with. When I try to bring my ideas out into the world, reality must be applied to them, and within this reality, time is greeting me at the door. If I don’t stay on top of things, plan out my work schedule or time I need to study or whatnot, then that feeling that my thoughts may not be as real as they felt to me when they were kept inside, can start to feel very overwhelming. I find time, to be at the core, or feeling like there just isn’t enough to accomplish everything I wish to, in the short and long term, that can leave me spinning in circles and need that reality check from a friend.

Thinking now, everyone has this construct of reality, and sure, shaking that up would be jarring. But WHAT that reality is constructed on and WHAT sorts of things offer the potential to shake up that presumed solidity, I’m guessing, is where the type differences may show themselves

 

[entropie]

Therefore you must see inferior Ne all around you and know it very well then

So you mean: a man who has nothing to eath, must see food everywhere around him? You are not only wise, but also very soft !

 

[Dreamer]

With my ISFJ e6 mom, I see it as catastrophizing. She tends to project negative outcomes and much of her imagination is focused on noticing every possible thing that could go wrong OR she is overly positive and falls prey to wishful thinking. She often uses wishful thinking to procrastinate, a kind of "well it will be fine so I won't bother doing anything". Unlike Ne types, her projections of what could be is used to procrastinate and put off action, to maintain status quo, whereas Ne types often use it to jump into action and spur change of some time.

Any person might do these things to a degree, but her sense of possibility is totally out of proportion so that Ne definitely colors her mentality, but in that unconscious, distorted way. The unrealistic/idealistic quality that people ascribe to Ne-dom is exaggerated when it occurs with her. Actual NPs often appear clever because they have a genuine nose for possibility or hidden meaning, and so it appears they do/uncover/see things which previously didn't seem possible to others. When they discuss these things, they may seem unrealistic & people might roll their eyes, but then their ideas may actually pan out. I observe that real Ne-dom are more frequently regarded as clever rather than too pie-in-the-sky.

This sort of idealization is very interesting to me! I wouldn’t assume a person couldn’t idealize situations to a degree, but the case you describe certainly reminds me of my ISFJ e2 mom. The sorts of things I find she tends to idealize is over people and when she feels they haven’t reciprocated her hospitality or generosity. She doesn’t need much, but just a sign of appreciation that her efforts haven’t gone unnoticed. When they have though, she will hold out hope that things may change with that person. It takes countless times until my mom may realize the situation isn’t going to improve. I certainly idealize people as well, and tend to hold almost anyone in some positive light by default (hmm...wow, this is exactly like my mom here. It will take countless disappointments before I see someone as other than good), but regarding actions, or other, more quantifiable measures like my mom looks out for, are things I don’t find myself idealizing. I do find it interesting how my mom and I can be similar in our processes in a generalized way, but the focus, and how we differ in our Ne use is quite different. (Sorry for the choppy text above, I just noticed that parallel between me and my mom and thought that was the coolest thing )