[Traditional Enneagram] What does it really mean to be a 2?

[fetus]

I always thought type 2 was the least interesting part of my personality. No offense to anyone else who identify strongly with their type 2. Being a type 2 completely contradicts my personality. I have the title as a researcher according the tri-type.

Oh, I take offense. I am heartbroken. I'll need to work through this for the rest of my life. Truly, I am crushed. Woe is me.

Just to add supported anecdote from my E2 friends in real life:

The focus is to sell oneself, doesn't matter what that self actually is. I have a friend that will ALWAYS put a positive spin on any aspect of herself to avoid admitting that she has a flaw. And if she does admit that she has a flaw, then she brushes it away so it's not noticeable to her and then gets annoyed with the other person for stating out her flaws and think that the person doesn't love them (and then she paints the whistleblower as the flawed one...). No matter what, she has to see herself in a positive light. At the end of the day, almost no one truly sees her as a helpful person. They see her as extremely self-centered despite her complaining about what a good "friend" she is. She can actually say REALLY degrading things about other people.

...keep in mind that I am sure this friend of mine is extremely unhealthy, so it's not this bad with all E2s.

2w1 people, I've noticed, are slightly different. I've noticed that my 2w1 friend will admit her flaws, apologize for mistakes and not try to spin it into a positive light. It's much easier to hang out with her and joke around with her about her flaws (the flaws are not that big of a deal with my 2w1; the only real issue is that she puts her interests/health last ....wait, I guess that is a big deal haha). Whereas my 2w3 friend is a pain. You can't even suggest that she may have hurt your feelings/literally anything negative about her without her hinting that she'll think less of you for it

I'm sorry you've had such a bad time with this person. Personally, I love my flaws, often too much. I'm all about self-acceptance, and I feel no compulsion to make everything positive. Negativity is real and something to be acknowledged, accepted, or even appreciated.

 

[Captain_Invincible]

This whole topic right here proves that I am not a 2.

 

[thoughtlost]

I'm sorry you've had such a bad time with this person. Personally, I love my flaws, often too much. I'm all about self-acceptance, and I feel no compulsion to make everything positive. Negativity is real and something to be acknowledged, accepted, or even appreciated.

No worries, no need to apologize. I just like ranting about 2s because they are my favorite peeps haha. Even the mean E2 is great ...in her own convoluted way =P

And I appreciate your positive outlook on negativity haha =P

Actually, I should clarify what I mean when I say that they are my favorite type.
It's just that they have so much emotional energy that you don't really get to see in other types.
4s keep it hidden for only themselves usually (so I don't notice it) and 6s are just an annoying mess *cough* -_-"
I guess 7s & 8s can be intense in a way that appeals to me ...potentially, but I haven't met them yet *cue music*.

 

[fetus]

No worries, no need to apologize. I just like ranting about 2s because they are my favorite peeps haha. Even the mean E2 is great ...in her own convoluted way =P

And I appreciate your positive outlook on negativity haha =P

Actually, I should clarify what I mean when I say that they are my favorite type.
It's just that they have so much emotional energy that you don't really get to see in other types.
4s keep it hidden for only themselves usually (so I don't notice it) and 6s are just an annoying mess *cough* -_-"
I guess 7s & 8s can be intense in a way that appeals to me ...potentially, but I haven't met them yet *cue music*.

Nines tend to be agreeable, too. I have a strong 9 fix, and it influences me to be calm and accepting. I don't agree at all to the meddlesome, busybody 2 aspect, probably because my 9 gives me a calmer, more passive side. I respect people's space and am not that pushy.

Just clarifying, so it is possible to have some introverted 2w3s? Or INFP 2w3s?

 

[cascadeco]

Nines tend to be agreeable, too. I have a strong 9 fix, and it influences me to be calm and accepting. I don't agree at all to the meddlesome, busybody 2 aspect, probably because my 9 gives me a calmer, more passive side. I respect people's space and am not that pushy.

Just clarifying, so it is possible to have some introverted 2w3s? Or INFP 2w3s?

The 9 might be part of it, but also too, the less balanced 2's are probably what stick in people's minds the most. Actually that goes for almost all of the e-types. So with 2, I think insecurity might lead to busybody aspect, it's the whole trying to earn people's love and affection by taking charge and doing things, to point of control, though maybe they aren't fully aware of that because they are just viewing it as them helping and who wouldn't want help? Something like that. But I do think it ties to insecurity, when it gets to an extreme. Because after all there's nothing wrong with helping and extending oneself.

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

The 9 might be part of it, but also too, the less balanced 2's are probably what stick in people's minds the most. Actually that goes for almost all of the e-types. So with 2, I think insecurity might lead to busybody aspect, it's the whole trying to earn people's love and affection by taking charge and doing things, to point of control, though maybe they aren't fully aware of that because they are just viewing it as them helping and who wouldn't want help? Something like that. But I do think it ties to insecurity, when it gets to an extreme. Because after all there's nothing wrong with helping and extending oneself.

Hmm. I think busybody aspect is more aligned with jealous girls who are threatened somehow, irrespective of e type.

 

[fetus]

Are there any 2's on this forum who would like to add to the conversation?

 

[HongDou]

[MENTION=4398]Giggly[/MENTION]

 

[HongDou]

I was trying to think of more and damn...this forum is really short on 2s

 

[Forever]

I was trying to think of more and damn...this forum is really short on 2s

They're all helping others right now.

 

[fetus]

I was trying to think of more and damn...this forum is really short on 2s

I'm here! I was a confused 2w3 all along.

This new typing feels so freeing actually, especially since I can understand it beyond the self-neglecting hostess stereotype. I guess Enneagram is more about motivations--for me, to be loved, wanted, and "belonged" (I couldn't think of another word that cuts to the true emotional essence).

Also, I'm more okay with not being a 4w3 because I can explain all that behavior with strong Fi (undoubtedly, sorry haha), not confusing behavior with core motivation. This sort of makes me more set in the other typology systems. I see how I display Fe behavior (with a tritype like 2w3/9w1/6w7, come on) without actually being Fe-valuing...

It all makes sense now--like a click. I think that when you feel that click in your heart, you know it's right. I suppose I must begin to be living proof of a non-stereotypical 2, dismantling these wayward misconceptions post by post! Thanks everyone for your input.

 

[thoughtlost]

Nines tend to be agreeable, too. I have a strong 9 fix, and it influences me to be calm and accepting. I don't agree at all to the meddlesome, busybody 2 aspect, probably because my 9 gives me a calmer, more passive side. I respect people's space and am not that pushy.

Just clarifying, so it is possible to have some introverted 2w3s? Or INFP 2w3s?

Oh, sorry for being slow to reply!

My 2 friend is completely not meddlesome!! I wish she was more meddlesome haha. She is pretty chill/introverted. She does the stereotypical stuff like send people gifts and thank you cards and stuff, but she tends to over-extend herself because people LITERALLY DO ask too much from her and she feels 1000% obligated to be there for people and feels horrible when she cannot. I thought she was a 9, but when you get to know her, her drive is more 2. Still, I am sure it's possible to be as chill as her as a 2.


What made me think of 9 is because she is not as "promoting" as a 2. She really doesn't like to talk about herself at all nor does she compare herself to others or anything.

However, if a person is 2w3 they would be more "self-promoting" maybe they wouldn't be meddlesome, but they could be more self-involved than a 2w1.

Just keep in mind that twos aren't necessarily solely defined by being meddlesome. 6s, and 1s can be more meddlesome than 2s. 2s main focus is on achieving lovability. So you're right, the stereotype of 2s thinking that they have be a servant isn't right for all 2s.

 

[ceecee]

Oh, sorry for being slow to reply!

My 2 friend is completely not meddlesome!! I wish she was more meddlesome haha. She is pretty chill/introverted. She does the stereotypical stuff like send people gifts and thank you cards and stuff, but she tends to over-extend herself because people LITERALLY DO ask too much from her and she feels 1000% obligated to be there for people and feels horrible when she cannot. I thought she was a 9, but when you get to know her, her drive is more 2. Still, I am sure it's possible to be as chill as her as a 2.

I think this is far more a female thing than anything else. Saying no is definitely a skill that can be developed but the longer in life it goes on, the harder it will be to accomplish. Enneagram can play a role in the tendency, but this is a social expectation that can be changed.

 

[thoughtlost]

[MENTION=4050]ceecee[/MENTION]

True. I take that into consideration when I "type" people (I put type in quotations because I am bad at typing people generally and try not to do it because I always get it wrong). I know that any female can display such characteristics.

Being defensive here, but I didn't run with that and automatically assume that she was a 2. So I don't look at that and automatically type every female as a 2.

The point was to say that definition of 2 isn't supposed to be "meddlesome and letting always yes to others." It misidentifies people. As I said, many other enneagram types have this issue too (at that time, though, I only mentioned 6, 1 but of course 9 have that issue and I am sure that even an 8 can have that issue ...I type my sister as an 8 and she can always spot ways to help people).

I know I should leave it be and not get riled up, however, I am not happy with the idea that type 2 is synonymous with meddlesome (I was worried that [MENTION=24479]themightyfetus[/MENTION] as alluding to that). That was the goal of the post.

I know, also, that I am being defensive/annoying.

 

[ceecee]

[MENTION=4050]ceecee[/MENTION]

True. I take that into consideration when I "type" people (I put type in quotations because I am bad at typing people generally and try not to do it because I always get it wrong). I know that any female can display such characteristics.

Being defensive here, but I didn't run with that and automatically assume that she was a 2. So I don't look at that and automatically type every female as a 2.

The point was to say that definition of 2 isn't supposed to be "meddlesome and letting always yes to others." It misidentifies people. As I said, many other enneagram types have this issue too (at that time, though, I only mentioned 6, 1 but of course 9 have that issue and I am sure that even an 8 can have that issue ...I type my sister as an 8 and she can always spot ways to help people).

I know I should leave it be and not get riled up, however, I am not happy with the idea that type 2 is synonymous with meddlesome (I was worried that [MENTION=24479]themightyfetus[/MENTION] as alluding to that). That was the goal of the post.

I know, also, that I am being defensive/annoying.

I don't think you're being annoying. I was stating my thoughts on it. Of course 8's can want to help people, any type does. I think 2's are gossipy, more than meddlesome, at least the couple I know. They back down very quickly when confronted so I don't find that to be an issue. I wasn't aiming my post at fetus or anyone, for that matter. It's just something I've observed, over a long time. But if someone says - I don't want to be labeled a helper or a housewife or sacrifice myself for others' happiness in spite of my type or enneagram....fine. Don't be those things.

 

[Giggly]

I don't know what it means.

I don't think I'm gossipy or meddlesome though, and I won't do things that I don't want to do.

 

[Yama]

I don't know what it means.

I don't think I'm gossipy or meddlesome though, and I won't do things that I don't want to do.

W-WAIT... Wait... are you the legendary Giggly?!?!?

*shuffles feet nervously and forces self to calm down* Hello. I always thought it would be cool to meet you, based on old posts I've seen of yours.

*dips out of thread because I honestly had nothing else to add to the topic*

 

[Chrysanthe]

W-WAIT... Wait... are you the legendary Giggly?!?!?

*shuffles feet nervously and forces self to calm down* Hello. I always thought it would be cool to meet you, based on old posts I've seen of yours.

*dips out of thread because I honestly had nothing else to add to the topic*

Indeed, it is her. The only time I ever had been blessed with her presence had been in a.... thread about human centipedes.

Not the most saintly way to meet the Ephemeral ISFJ.

 

[Giggly]

W-WAIT... Wait... are you the legendary Giggly?!?!?

*shuffles feet nervously and forces self to calm down* Hello. I always thought it would be cool to meet you, based on old posts I've seen of yours.

*dips out of thread because I honestly had nothing else to add to the topic*

It is me. I see that you are ISFJ too. Because there are so few of us here, if you stick around and post long enough, you will become a legendary ISFJ too!

Indeed, it is her. The only time I ever had been blessed with her presence had been in a.... thread about human centipedes.

Not the most saintly way to meet the Ephemeral ISFJ.

I remember that thread. It was awesome. We were all in line licking each others butts.

 

[Forever]

@Giggly
Notice me senpai.