Transcending Myers and Briggs

[Mole]

Is it possible or desirable to transcend MBTI ?

It is not desirable to transcend MBTI because MBTI is a form of social control.

We are born without control of even our splincter and we learn control slowly and painfully over the next 22 years, at which age our brains are fully developed.

So MBTI is desirable for those who have not yet learnt full control - to take MBTI from them would be cruel.

But for those who have learnt control, it is possible and desirable to transcend MBTI.

And it becomes easy to transcend MBTI simply by looking at its history.

Katharine Cook Briggs and her daughter Isabel Briggs Meyers created the MBTI to facilitate the movement of women into the industrial workforce in order to wage war, in fact World War II.

And interestingly they based the MBTI entirely on the book, "Psychological Types", by Carl Gustave Jung.

Carl Jung was an enthusiastic supporter of the NAZI Party.

And when the President of the Psychoanalytic Association resigned as a matter of conscience at the reification of Jews, Slavs and Negros, Carl Jung volunteered to be the President of the Association to help the Nazis carry out their program of reification.

And Carl Jung helped them by writing the book, "Personality Types", to complement the Somatic Types of the Nazis. And the Somatic Types of the Nazis were Jews, Slavs, Negros, Asians and Aryans.

And it is from this book that Mrs Briggs and her daughter copied to make the MBTI.

The purpose of Somatic Types was to reify livling people as was the purpose of Carl Jungs, "Personality Types".

And to reify means to objectify - to turn living people into objects - because killing a living person is difficult but liquidating and object is much easier.

And so those who have failed to learn control, who have failed to gain their independence, rely on MBTI as a psychological crutch.

MBTI reifies them and prevents them from realising themselves as free, living people.

So for those unable or unwilling to gain their independence, MBTI acts as an authoritarian substitute.

And the only price you pay for MBTI is your moral courage and of course your dignity.

Victor.

 

[Mole]

The Truth Value of MBTI

I might mention that the MBTI has the same truth value as Astrology but when they ask my star sign, I know they are trying to pick me up.

Victor.

 

[6sticks]

Funny, it only took me 21 years to control my "splincter".

 

[sassafrassquatch]

 

[SillySapienne]

^Bad kitty


......................................................................Good kitty!!!!!!!

 

[Totenkindly]

That's just what I would expect a paranoid ISTP/ISTJ to say.

 

[SolitaryPenguin]

but when they ask my star sign, I know they are trying to pick me up.

This is about where I called BS.

 

[Mole]

Becoming Absurd

You might say there are three stages.

The first is the stage of the child and might be called chaotic.

And the child needs authority figures such as parents to teach the child control and self modulation.

And so the second stage is authority.

But authority finally starts to constrict the adolescent.

So the third stage is freedom and independence.

But freedom and independence is scary so we look around for substitute authority figures.

This is called authoritarianism.

And our fear of freedom is so great it doesn't matter who we choose as authority figures.

So here we choose Carl Jung and his disciples Mrs Briggs and her daughter.

Anyone will do no matter how disreputable - because we need anyone, anything, that will help us modulate our fear.

And so our fear makes us absurd.

Victor.

 

[Totenkindly]

BlueWing? Is that you ...just terse?

 

[nightning]

Carl Jung was an enthusiastic supporter of the NAZI Party.

And when the President of the Psychoanalytic Association resigned as a matter of conscience at the reification of Jews, Slavs and Negros, Carl Jung volunteered to be the President of the Association to help the Nazis carry out their program of reification.

And Carl Jung helped them by writing the book, "Personality Types", to complement the Somatic Types of the Nazis. And the Somatic Types of the Nazis were Jews, Slavs, Negros, Asians and Aryans.

And it is from this book that Mrs Briggs and her daughter copied to make the MBTI.

The purpose of Somatic Types was to reify livling people as was the purpose of Carl Jungs, "Personality Types".

And to reify means to objectify - to turn living people into objects - because killing a living person is difficult but liquidating and object is much easier.

Little interesting facts that I did not know before. Thank you.

And so those who have failed to learn control, who have failed to gain their independence, rely on MBTI as a psychological crutch.

MBTI reifies them and prevents them from realising themselves as free, living people.

So for those unable or unwilling to gain their independence, MBTI acts as an authoritarian substitute.
Victor.

Are you assuming to read the minds of Myers and Briggs? Just because the link can be made doesn't mean it is for real. Random relationships do happen by chance. I'm saying here that I allow the possibility of both, but the origins of MBTI doesn't matter much to me. A related example... modern psychology is based on Freud's work... if you ask most psychologist, they'll tell you that most of his theories are BS, but they've taken from him the concept of talk therapy. Same deal here. I believe that MBTI is nothing more than theories, used to describe general tedencies and nothing more. As long as your intent is to use it as a tool and not a crutch, there's no problems with it. It's the same as with any other tools really... calculators, automated devices what have you.

It's a thought stimulating argument...

 

[SillySapienne]

BlueWing? Is that you ...just terse?

hahahahahahahahaaaa

 

[JAVO]

FranG! Long time no see! :hi:

 

[Mole]

This is about where I called BS.

Any psychometrician will tell you MBTI is Invalid and Unreliable, entirely separate from its evil origins.

And any Astronomer will tell you that Astrology contains no truth value.

Victor.

 

[Mole]

Little interesting facts that I did not know before. Thank you.


Are you assuming to read the minds of Myers and Briggs? Just because the link can be made doesn't mean it is for real. Random relationships do happen by chance. I'm saying here that I allow the possibility of both, but the origins of MBTI doesn't matter much to me. A related example... modern psychology is based on Freud's work... if you ask most psychologist, they'll tell you that most of his theories are BS, but they've taken from him the concept of talk therapy. Same deal here. I believe that MBTI is nothing more than theories, used to describe general tedencies and nothing more. As long as your intent is to use it as a tool and not a crutch, there's no problems with it. It's the same as with any other tools really... calculators, automated devices what have you.

It's a thought stimulating argument...

Mrs Briggs and her daughter had no education is psychometrics at all so no wonder they created a taxonomy that is Invalid and Unreliable.

The Shoah is about as close as Western Society has come to absolute evil and Mrs Briggs and her daughter copied from the book, "Personality Types", that was written to prosecute the Shoah.

"Personality Types", was written for an evil purpose and MBTI is a copy.

Victor.

 

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

What the hell is going on here? What's all this talk about evil? Sorry, but it sounds really strange to label a theory as evil, even with the "justification" you provided.

Prosecute the Shoah? Explain please?

Also, can we have some references to all this Jung-Antisemitic talk? It sounds wrong on its face, considering how Jung was fond of his teacher Freud, a Jew whose books were burned by the Nazis. This sounds like a ton of BS, Victor. Not to mention all the Nazi references are really just ad hominems.

Edahn.

 

[Mole]

What the hell is going on here? What's all this talk about evil? Sorry, but it sounds really strange to label a theory as evil, even with the "justification" you provided.

Prosecute the Shoah? Explain please?

Also, can we have some references to all this Jung-Antisemitic talk? It sounds wrong on its face, considering how Jung was fond of his teacher Freud, a Jew whose books were burned by the Nazis. This sounds like a ton of BS, Victor. Not to mention all the Nazi references are really just ad hominems.

Edahn.

Don't take my word for it - you can check the facts in Wikipedia.

I do understand that Jung is a popular guru and my pointing out that he was an enthusiastic and active supporter of the Nazis goes against the grain.

And I do understand that the flag you fly under here is MBTI and my pointing out that not only is it Invalid and Unreliable but copied from a Nazi supporter, goes against the grain.

But let the chips fall where they may.

Victor.

 

[ThatsWhatHeSaid]

Don't take my word for it - you can check the facts in Wikipedia.

I do understand that Jung is a popular guru and my pointing out that he was an enthusiastic and active supporter of the Nazis goes against the grain.

And I do understand that the flag you fly under here is MBTI and my pointing out that not only is it Invalid and Unreliable but copied from a Nazi supporter, goes against the grain.

But let the chips fall where they may.

Victor.

Actually, I criticize MBTI all the time on similar, but other grounds. But my reaction wasn't aimed at your choice to criticism a psychological theory, but rather the way you seem to be going about it.

If you have Wikipedia links, it'd be nice if you provided them, since this is "your" thread. Either way, tho.

Edit: Edahn.

 

[SillySapienne]

Why do you care so much, do you feel personally deceived/hurt by the MBTI?

 

[Mole]

Actually, I criticize MBTI all the time on similar, but other grounds. But my reaction wasn't aimed at your choice to criticism a psychological theory, but rather the way you seem to be going about it.

If you have Wikipedia links, it'd be nice if you provided them, since this is "your" thread. Either way, tho.

Edit: Edahn.

I am primarily interested in thinking perhaps not unlike yourself. So I am primarily interested, on my first day, in thinking about the meaning of the site.

I might say I am not interested in winning an argument.

And I do take seriously your comment that your reaction is aimed at my way of going about it. (I would call it, my style).

Style is a good measure of the man because style is unconscious. Style reveals our disposition - style reveals our character - and while content is under our control, style is not under our direct control - so is a far better measure of our true self.

And with some perspicacy, you are reacting to my style.

So your reaction is very valuable to me as I cannot directly see my own style - I can only see my style through your eyes - and you seem to be discomforted with my style - you may not like my style.

This leaves me at somewhat at a loose end as I can only see my style through your eyes and I am not sure what your reaction means.

Victor.

 

[SillySapienne]

Less lines, more links.