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Thought on medical-assisted suicide?

Beorn

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Yep, they oughta just buck up, pull themselves up by their bootstraps, think happy thoughts for god's sake.

You are being ignorant.

I bet most of the disabled people I know are 10 times as happy as you and produce 10 times more happiness in those around them then you do.

Moreover, you're public policy desires put their happy lives at risk.

edit: Meh, in hindsight getting into measurements of happiness was probably a poor idea. I got flustered.
 

CrystalViolet

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You are being ignorant.

I bet most of the disabled people I know are 10 times as happy as you and produce 10 times more happiness in those around them then you do.

Moreover, you're public policy desires put their happy lives at risk.

edit: Meh, in hindsight getting into measurements of happiness was probably a poor idea. I got flustered.

I think Tilty was being sarcastic.
 

Such Irony

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I am enjoying the comments people have made so far.

My take on it is that I'm all for medically-assisted suicide for the terminally ill for the reasons previously stated. I'd also choose medically-assisted suicide if I was in a vegetative state with little to no hope of getting out of that state. Its also a burden for the family and the doctors to try to keep me alive.

I read about locked-in syndrome, where one is esentially paralyzed completely except for possibly the eyes. Not only can't you move but you can't talk either. How do you communicate your pain or your desires. You could be extremely miserable and you couldn't express it. To me a life like that would be worse than death.


I'm generally opposed to suicide just because someone is unhappy with the current state of things. I've read many times about people who've attempted suicide and failed and later on went to live a very satisfying life. Sometimes in the midst of a deep depression, things can seem completely hopeless but with therapy and certain medications and just letting time heal wounds, things will often start looking up again.
 

Bamboo

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Nice, but isn't this thread mainly talking about those who can't, or are face with the likely hood they won't be able too in the near future.

The OP:

I'm in the process of writing a paper, and purely for the purposes of my own morbid curiosity --

What are your thoughts on euthanasia?
Suicide in general?

Religious reasons? Moral/ethical reasons?

I covered the bolded elements. Suicide in general primarily.

But I'll give credit where credit is due...studies have shown this does aid in the treatment of mild to moderate depression. Helping others gives people a sense of well being, but generally these people aren't sitting on thier arses doing nothing anyway.

I really wouldn't know whether they are sitting on their asses or not.

But it would be good if they got out and did something that made them feel good. And if that helps with mild and moderate, it'll help with severe. Won't cure it, but hey, could it hurt?

If not, I refer you back to my first statement:

If you wanna be dead, go for it.

For the most part, that's their call. Some people decide to be beggars. Some people move to Maui. Some people kill themselves. I have my opinions on all of them, but I'm strongly hesitant to tell you what to do.

Funny, it's a serious thing this whole death thing, but I'm alive right now and don't plan on changing that situation, so I don't give it much thought beyond any of this. I suppose I could get existential, but that's old territory.
 
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What are your thoughts on euthanasia?
Suicide in general?
Religious reasons? Moral/ethical reasons?
There isn't a logical or even a sufficient reason to prevent someone from ending their own misery, with the help of another or without it.
 

Lark

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Well, I dont like any suicide, I feel like I belong to another age in which taking your own life was considered something horrifying.

That said I dont see any way to really prevent someone if they have made their mind up, I think that making it a binding duty on the part of others to prevent this, professionals or family, is unfair, they can do their best but it will still play out the same way.

I also worry when I hear about debate around this about the Drs or nurses who may have to carry out these procedures, in the UK opinion polls have consistently found that while the public may feel its acceptable or a good idea that the medical professionals who would be called upon to perform the service are opposed to it. Its bound to take its toll killing people, especially if your professional motivation is keeping people alive and caring for them.
 

CrystalViolet

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Well, I dont like any suicide, I feel like I belong to another age in which taking your own life was considered something horrifying.

That said I dont see any way to really prevent someone if they have made their mind up, I think that making it a binding duty on the part of others to prevent this, professionals or family, is unfair, they can do their best but it will still play out the same way.

I also worry when I hear about debate around this about the Drs or nurses who may have to carry out these procedures, in the UK opinion polls have consistently found that while the public may feel its acceptable or a good idea that the medical professionals who would be called upon to perform the service are opposed to it. Its bound to take its toll killing people, especially if your professional motivation is keeping people alive and caring for them.
It's about liability and where to draw the line too. Most doctors and nurses have no qualms about assiting a teriminal cancer victim in pallitive care. They are going to die no matter what. Relieving pain and making them comfortable is all they hope to do.
It's the other possibilities that could arise that are more worrying. Families pressuring a family member into agreeing or early alziehmers patients...
or families sueing for wrongful death. It's opening a pandora's box.
Health care workers deal with enough, they shouldn't have to deal with that too. (Not to mention the loons, they'd have to deal with protesting against euthanasia.) It's not a task or desicion that should rest in thier hands.
 

CrystalViolet

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The OP:
I covered the bolded elements. Suicide in general primarily.
I really wouldn't know whether they are sitting on their asses or not.
But it would be good if they got out and did something that made them feel good. And if that helps with mild and moderate, it'll help with severe. Won't cure it, but hey, could it hurt?

For the most part, that's their call. Some people decide to be beggars. Some people move to Maui. Some people kill themselves. I have my opinions on all of them, but I'm strongly hesitant to tell you what to do.

Funny, it's a serious thing this whole death thing, but I'm alive right now and don't plan on changing that situation, so I don't give it much thought beyond any of this. I suppose I could get existential, but that's old territory.
You are entitled to your opinion, of course.
 

Lark

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It's about liability and where to draw the line too. Most doctors and nurses have no qualms about assiting a teriminal cancer victim in pallitive care. They are going to die no matter what. Relieving pain and making them comfortable is all they hope to do.
It's the other possibilities that could arise that are more worrying. Families pressuring a family member into agreeing or early alziehmers patients...
or families sueing for wrongful death. It's opening a pandora's box.
Health care workers deal with enough, they shouldn't have to deal with that too. (Not to mention the loons, they'd have to deal with protesting against euthanasia.) It's not a task or desicion that should rest in thier hands.

I'm not sure that's all it is, although the issue of liability and medical practice is a big deal, that could be a thread all in itself.

I remember getting operations done when I was younger and it was a straight procedure, the doctor spoke with my parents and in some ways with me but there was nothing like the amount of consultations and meetings I had when I had my most recent surgery in a private hospital which was picking up work from the NHS. It was all about establishing expectations and hopes for the procedure and likely outcomes.

That said it was a procedure to do with my knee and while I was totally pleased with my outcome there where others who wherent, they where more sporty so perhaps did have greater problems than me but then again knee problems can disqualify you from working and entitle you to benefits so it could be something like that.

No, I was thinking along the lines of actually causing someones death, it can be very sanitised and I think this is part of the reason that there have been in the UK two or three cases of serial killing medical professionals, one nurse killing babies, another GP killing the elderly, but I wouldnt ask something to do something I would be unwilling to do myself. Its part of the reason I'm not happy about medicalised killings being introduced as a policy.
 

CrystalViolet

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I'm not sure that's all it is, although the issue of liability and medical practice is a big deal, that could be a thread all in itself.

I remember getting operations done when I was younger and it was a straight procedure, the doctor spoke with my parents and in some ways with me but there was nothing like the amount of consultations and meetings I had when I had my most recent surgery in a private hospital which was picking up work from the NHS. It was all about establishing expectations and hopes for the procedure and likely outcomes.

That said it was a procedure to do with my knee and while I was totally pleased with my outcome there where others who wherent, they where more sporty so perhaps did have greater problems than me but then again knee problems can disqualify you from working and entitle you to benefits so it could be something like that.

No, I was thinking along the lines of actually causing someones death, it can be very sanitised and I think this is part of the reason that there have been in the UK two or three cases of serial killing medical professionals, one nurse killing babies, another GP killing the elderly, but I wouldnt ask something to do something I would be unwilling to do myself. Its part of the reason I'm not happy about medicalised killings being introduced as a policy.

Yes, the serial killer health proffessionals make every one in the industry step back from medical euthansia. You just don't want to be associated with that.

The problem I have with it, is that it's a slippery slope once introduced as policy.

As health professional myself, I can full well understand not wanting to have a bar of it. It's not my desicion as to wether you live or die, nor should it be.

But you are right, no-one should ask some one to do some thing they wouldn't do themselves.

If a loved one asked me, I'd do it.(not as a health professional though, this is personal) Damn the consequences, but only if there was no hope. I just hope they would do the same.
And no, I don't expect doctors and nurses to do it for me. I can't deny some one wanting to die at home.

BTW I respect your point of view. This isn't some thing you enforce on the whole populas. Just as I wouldn't ask a loved who against euthansia to assist me.
 

Lark

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BTW I respect your point of view. This isn't some thing you enforce on the whole populas. Just as I wouldn't ask a loved who against euthansia to assist me.

Yeah, well, that's the important point.

You wouldnt want nurses and doctors to desert the profession or come in for potential pressure, intimidation or terror like some abortionists do already.

There was a sci fi book which was spoofed in Futurama which featured "suicide boothes" in which no one was involved in the killing, the whole thing was mechanised.

I sort of imagine that this was the idea of some ubermenschish style writer who thought the best thing for society would be for the infirm or ill to just remove themselves.
 

Beorn

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I have a follow up question for those of you who support euthanasia:

What is the source of the "right to die" and what is it based on.
 

Mole

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Christians and Muslims

If we are part of the Body of Christ, no one has the right to harm the Body of Christ.

On the other hand, if we are Submissive Muslims, we are commanded to martyrdom and Jihad and the killing of Jews, Dhimmi and Infidels. And so we have the suicide bombers, all good Submissive Muslims.
 

Beargryllz

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I can certainly see many conditions where death is preferable to existence, and for those experiencing such conditions, I see no valid reason why I or anyone else should have the right to interfere with the wishes of the individual. In some extreme cases where slavery is involved or if the individual is in some way "not free" to make this decision, then I could see why you want to interfere and prevent the loss of property or means of production, but I can't see this factoring into the discussion in this era.
 
F

figsfiggyfigs

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If we are part of the Body of Christ, no one has the right to harm the Body of Christ.

On the other hand, if we are Submissive Muslims, we are commanded to martyrdom and Jihad and the killing of Jews, Dhimmi and Infidels. And so we have the suicide bombers, all good Submissive Muslims.

Wtf. :huh:

wtf does that have to do with medically assisted suicide?

Do you hate Muslims or something?

People are people, whether they are the "body of Christ" or not. God gave us free will, intending to harm it is in our power, and in our right.
Whether it's moral or not is subjective to the person, and their belief system.

(btw people, I'm not saying go kill yourselves ):newwink:
 

Mole

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Something and Concrete Walls

Do you hate Muslims or something?

I think it's 'or something'.

And that something is low, reinforced, concrete walls around Government buildings in Canberra, the Capital of Australia.

And the reinforced, concrete walls are not to stop Anglican suicide bombers in explosive laden trucks, but to stop Muslim suicide bombers in explosive laden trucks.

And yet Muslim imams in Australia still keep preaching hatred of women and violence towards infidels.

And no wonder because the literal word of Allah, the Koran, commands Muslims to Jihad and Martyrdom.

The Australian Imams and the Muslim suicide bombers are only carrying out their religious duty. Meanwhile we live behind concrete walls.
 
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