The "Cuties" Thread

[Red Memories]

[MENTION=9811]Coriolis[/MENTION] you may refer any extra posts referencing the situation here.

A break off was suggested and I'm merely taking it.

I'll suggest anyone who was previously involved tagged here as well.
[MENTION=195]Jaguar[/MENTION] [MENTION=37565]Dareyth[/MENTION] [MENTION=4050]ceecee[/MENTION] [MENTION=5159]Lexicon[/MENTION] [MENTION=10251]Red Herring[/MENTION] [MENTION=30038]The Cat[/MENTION]

Obviously we had some previous discourse in the thread but here's some standard Q's for anyone who wants to hop in as well. If you also want to answer these go for it. They're discussion helpers.

1. How did you come to notice Cuties existence?

2. Did you watch/plan to watch the movie to see what you fully think?

3. If you did watch the movie, do you think it is better or worse than originally thought and why?

4. How do you feel about the use of real child actors in situations which could emotionally harm them? What would you have in place to protect them from the harm they may incur from being part of such a production if you are okay with it?

5. Where does a line cross from artistic exploration to actual child exploitation?

6. Do you feel Cuties met the burden of its message? Why or why not?

7. If you are foreign, I have noticed some suggest their view of the movie is quite different. I'd love for an international dialogue of how other countries view this situation.

8. Do you feel we should do more about the exploitation of children through internet mediums and fame in general?

9. When does one become mature enough to make a choice to do such actions without the same psychological damage?

10. How does this movies promotion possibly play into how it was perceived after the fact?

11. Could any artistic medium really capture the strong reality of the psychological negatives young women face today?

12. How do you feel about children and internet fame in a general sense here?

13. Could the hypersexualization issue in America be part of the reason America appears to be the most angry about the film?

14. How can we better protect young girls in an online world?

15. How do you feel about the MAPs (Minor-Attracted persons) sexuality movement and how could this also affect our ability to protect those young children online?

16. Do you think there are any partisan bills which could be introduced to try and fix some of these issues? Should it merely be left to parents?

I think these are some fair questions for anyone to answer. Have at it. I'll be back as you know.

 

[Coriolis]

[MENTION=9811]Coriolis[/MENTION] you may refer any extra posts referencing the situation here.

A break off was suggested and I'm merely taking it.

I'll suggest anyone who was previously involved tagged here as well.

Thanks for starting a new thread. Posts still appear in the order originally posted, so I added an explanatory note to Dareyth's post which is now the OP.

This topic is as sensitive as it is controversial, so be on your best behavior, folks. I know this is in Politics and not Support/Advice, but some people are triggered by the topic, and/or have personal experiences related to what is depicted in the video. Blustering around like the proverbial bull in a china shop does a disservice to the topic, and to those interested in a rational and respectful sharing of views.

Carry on.

 

[Jaguar]

This isn't a discussion thread about Cuties. It's a discussion thread about a QANON conspiracy theory.

 

[Luminous]

Also, I think it's kind of ironic when the depiction and criticism of the sexualization of pre-teens is criticized for sexualizing children by people who apparently sexualize these girls themselves because otherwise they would not be so uncomfortable with a relatively realistic depiction of what girls go through during that awkward transition age (also a reason I like the character Tina in Bob's Burgers - she might be unlikeable but is something you rarely see on tv, a realistic depiction of pre-teen to early teen girls in all their insecurity and awkwardness)

I haven't seen Cuties (or many episodes of Bob's Burgers), but I feel I must say that you're making an assumption here as to why someone would find it uncomfortable which does sound accusatory in a way. In my personal experience, puberty wasn't just merely awkward. It was uncomfortable, humiliating, forcing social ideas of sexuality on to my personal, private experience. I wanted to hide and not be seen. I can't imagine how much worse those feelings would have been if I had been the victim of sexual abuse, and I can see how those feelings would make someone more than uncomfortable with this movie because it harkens back to their own negative experiences.

 

[Maou]

1. How did you come to notice Cuties existence?

A transexual youtuber who discusses issues within the transcommunity, and specifically predators withing the community who prey on young trans people. Then later everywhere as the controversy picked up.

2. Did you watch/plan to watch the movie to see what you fully think?

No, this falls in with a lot of things I already dislike. If you want to say its cultural, them I am proud of America for standing up against the clear lack of morality, disguised as a positive message. I do not agree with younger age of consents either, or any portrayal of sexual objectification in media. This especially includes music. I am against pushing sexuality onto children, and unrealistic standards of beauty. Also, I don't need to watch something in its entirety to know if I will like it. This is a direct parallel to sexuality ironically.

3. If you did watch the movie, do you think it is better or worse than originally thought and why?

N/A

4. How do you feel about the use of real child actors in situations which could emotionally harm them? What would you have in place to protect them from the harm they may incur from being part of such a production if you are okay with it?

This is what I had the most issues with. The director poorly executed and shot the film, regardless of good intentions. The message is vague at best from what I have seen. It's also overtly sexualized in some shots, and I ask what were they intending? There is a difference between sending a message, and literally just doing what you say you are against. Pedophiles would love this movie.

5. Where does a line cross from artistic exploration to actual child exploitation?

Close ups of the children's asses, breasts does not send the message that "this is bad". There are 100s of other ways to portray objectification is bad, this movie isn't a good one.

6. Do you feel Cuties met the burden of its message? Why or why not?

No, its just a very poorly made film.

7. If you are foreign, I have noticed some suggest their view of the movie is quite different. I'd love for an international dialogue of how other countries view this situation.

N/A

8. Do you feel we should do more about the exploitation of children through internet mediums and fame in general?

Yes, the internet has fucked up people in general. Hollywood ks also fucked up. Fame is fucked up.

9. When does one become mature enough to make a choice to do such actions without the same psychological damage?

The human brain isn't even fully developed till age 25, and the early years are the most vulnerable. Hell, even "legal" adults can be just as vulnerable up to a certain age. 15 is around puberty, but they have not adjusted to it. I think 18 is a better year, as it gives them time to adjust.

10. How does this movies promotion possibly play into how it was perceived after the fact?

It's what spread the initial controversy, but the content itself set people off. I've seen many people claim giving it the benefit of the doubt, then being disgusted with it. This isn't some partisan issue. Its moral outrage that anyone could consider this movie a good thing.

11. Could any artistic medium really capture the strong reality of the psychological negatives young women face today?

It is very possible.

12. How do you feel about children and internet fame in a general sense here?

Like many things, it has its ups and downs. But like all fame related things, there is a whole lot of darkness behind the scenes. It is not safe for kids.

13. Could the hypersexualization issue in America be part of the reason America appears to be the most angry about the film?

Yes

14. How can we better protect young girls in an online world?

Better parenting. Most parents are too neglectful.

15. How do you feel about the MAPs (Minor-Attracted persons) sexuality movement and how could this also affect our ability to protect those young children online?

A loophole using leftists identity politics that most people on the right saw coming years ago. This is a major concern, and shouldn't be tolerated. Social media needs to have strong enforcement about preventing these movements from existing.

16. Do you think there are any partisan bills which could be introduced to try and fix some of these issues? Should it merely be left to parents?

"Public" websites should be more easily held accountable for what they allow to be posted in terms of minor created content. There is also the public stigma that you cannot speak out about or criticize certain groups online, even constructively. That needs to end. People should feel comfortable with disagreement. It is the only way we can improve our communities. Otherwise we are allowing safe spaces where these pedophiles can hide in plain site. People shouldn't feel like they will get death threats for calling out predators.

I am furious about this because Ibwas sexually abused by a pedophile when I was 7. Not because of some stupid fucking Qanon conspiracy.

 

[Jaguar]

1. How did you come to notice Cuties existence?

People losing their mind over it and using it for a political agenda.

It is, annoyingly, important to state plainly that “Cuties” does not portray child abuse, it does not glorify or countenance pedophilia in any way, and it does not “sexualize” its characters — which is, to put it plainly, a favorite description of people so disturbed by their own reaction to a piece of art that they have to quickly plant the blame for that reaction on the artist before anyone notices. Doucouré’s movie is about platonic relationships between women and girls; there is no sexuality to be had anywhere in this movie, which makes the outrage over it seem all the more extraterrestrial.

Within hours of that first trailer for “Cuties,” the pedophile-obsessed American right, driven by QAnon, had a new target.

Criticism of Netflix's 'Cuties' isn't about the movie. It's a cynical ploy in the culture war.

 

[Red Memories]

This isn't a discussion thread about Cuties. It's a discussion thread about a QANON conspiracy theory.

I encourage you to possibly answer the actual questions if you so desire, because my issue has nothing to do with QAnon. I do not consider myself a follower of that agenda, whatever it may be. Growing up my gen makes fun of those conspiracy theories, not believe them. I encourage you to interact with the broad discussion here, if nothing else, on the bigger topics at hand outside of the movie. If you do not want to partake in a fruitful discussion where we may all find something positive to learn from it, then it may be a good idea to step back. Accusing everyone who sees something different here to be a QAnon conspiracist doesn't do the topic justice whatsoever - because that isn't what the topic is about.

 

[Jaguar]

I encourage you to possibly answer the actual questions if you so desire, because my issue has nothing to do with QAnon. I do not consider myself a follower of that agenda, whatever it may be. Growing up my gen makes fun of those conspiracy theories, not believe them. I encourage you to interact with the broad discussion here, if nothing else, on the bigger topics at hand outside of the movie. If you do not want to partake in a fruitful discussion where we may all find something positive to learn from it, then it may be a good idea to step back. Accusing everyone who sees something different here to be a QAnon conspiracist doesn't do the topic justice whatsoever - because that isn't what the topic is about.

I have nothing to say to you. I'll speak to whoever I please.

 

[anticlimatic]

Why the fuck are people trying to paint anti-pedophilia as a right wing position? Objectifying children goes beyond politics, it is disgusting and a crime.

It's because of BLM and COVID. Right wing people, consciously or unconsciously, looked at how "activated" the left was over both of those issues, and thought such "activation" would be better spent elsewhere. Specifically, on predators of children rather than systemic racism or people who don't wear masks. Either that, or they just had the same kind of pent up anger that left wing people had after being locked down and miserable, and wanted their own "thing" to rail against. On one hand, I agree that child trafficking is a more significant issue than imaginary systemic racism and people who don't wear masks, but on the other- yeah, none of this should be political, and everyone is more or less in agreement. On all fronts. People be fighting for no reason as far as I can tell.

 

[Jaguar]

How Netflix's 'Cuties' Is Fueling Far-Right Obsession With Pedophelia - Rolling Stone
The fight against sex trafficking has become politicized, and the misplaced outrage could be protecting actual child predators

Netflix Cuties controversy explained: Why conservatives are obsessed with the movie.

 

[Maou]

Oh yeah, totally base my entire world view on opinion peices instead of thinking for myself. All it takes for me to recognize something as amazing is for it to check all the woke boxes for me. Totally googled and checked the most woke sites to tell me what to think. Ever watch Contrapoints Bigots? Cuties was made by a BLACK female FEMINIST! Yasss queeeeeen slay! Stunning and brave portrayal of female empowerment. I am literally shaking.

 

[Jaguar]

What is MAP?

 

[The Cat]

What is MAP?

Remember when Cartman joined NAMBLA?

 

[Maou]

What is MAP?

Starts around 1:30 after intro talk.

 

[Jaguar]

Pretty Baby is a 1978 American historical drama film directed by Louis Malle, and starring Brooke Shields, Keith Carradine, and Susan Sarandon. The screenplay was written by Polly Platt. The plot focuses on a 12-year-old prostitute in the red-light district of New Orleans at the turn of the 20th century.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

It's because of BLM and COVID. Right wing people, consciously or unconsciously, looked at how "activated" the left was over both of those issues, and thought such "activation" would be better spent elsewhere

Yes, this stupid Netflix movie (which I never would have heard of if it weren't for what's looking like irrational hysteria) is way more important than a pandemic that's killing tens of thousands of people. You've made an excellent case for why the right-wing is full of rational people with their priorities in order.

Is this dumbass movie the thing I now have to hear about constantly for the next month?

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Do you folks realize that because of your meltdown and making this the "topic" of the week, way more people are going to watch this movie than would have seen it otherwise? It's the same thing the media does with Trump, but at least they're getting money from it.

 

[chickpea]

the dance scene is disturbing to watch, but it's also showing something that's extremely common in real life so i'm not understanding the focused outrage on this particular movie. children's dance recitals are full of over-sexualized dance moves, heavy makeup and skimpy outfits on girls way younger than 11. and i'm sure if a pedophile is out looking for objectified young girls to watch, they'll go on tiktok and not skip through a full length movie.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

the dance scene is disturbing to watch, but it's also showing something that's extremely common in real life so i'm not understanding the focused outrage on this particular movie. children's dance recitals are full of over-sexualized dance moves, heavy makeup and skimpy outfits on girls way younger than 11. and i'm sure if a pedophile is out looking for objectified young girls to watch, they'll go on tiktok and not skip through a full length movie.

Or maybe they could find on something 4chan.

 

[chickpea]

Or maybe they could find something on 4chan.

yeah 4chan must have changed quite a lot in the last decade or so because i seem to remember it being full of child porn? now every member is an anti-pedophilia crusader? did all the pedos go to the spinoffs or what?