Star Wars 9

[The Cat]

...oh......WAIT a minute

that whole line kinda wtf's the whole jedi in those movies...

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

I thought the rule of two wasn't a hard rule but one the sith lords bent or played fast and loose with quite frequently. I mean Palpy had Inquisitors who were basically junior sith lords, one of whom I'm sure would've taken Vader's spot in the event Vader died. Then in EU there's a mention that Maul was Palpy's secret apprentice whilst Palpy was still serving Plagueis, though that's not been confirmed onscreen. Not too mention Tyrannus was training Ventriss and later Savage. Also Vader was secretly training Starkiller to be his own sith apprentice. And I'm pretty sure he wanted Luke to become his apprentice as well.

I think rule of two is something Bane created to help consolidate his power and limit sith order infighting, but it was never meant to be followed super-strictly.

I don't know about intentions, but it would be correct to say that it was never followed super strictly. Plaugeis's master Tenebrous also had a secret apprentice, at least in Legends. So it's not even just Palpatine playing fast loose and it, but something other Sith before him had done.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

I'm more curious about their personalities and plotlines, if it mirrors anything like this last trilogy.

Well, Jacen became a Sith Lord, so that's sort of similar. Also he killed Luke's wife, Mara Jade.

I believe Luke's Jedi order wasn't as strict about the "no attachments" thing, although at least in part that's because stuff was written about it before the prequels. But there's also pre-prequel stuff that shows Old Republic Jedi having families. Maybe that's why in my mind I tend to see the issues with the Jedi in the prequels more as something unique to that specific era rather than the entire history of the Jedi order.

Although it should be noted that none of that is canon anymore, but it's not like there's a wealth of canon material about the Jedi before TPM, anyway.

 

[The Cat]

It's still a stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid, stupid plan...

 

[Totenkindly]

I just watched Serenity.

I gave it less stars than ROS but I think I enjoyed it more.

 

[The Cat]

I just watched Serenity.

I gave it less stars than ROS but I think I enjoyed it more.

Serenity is heartbreaking for better reasons.

 

[Totenkindly]

Serenity is heartbreaking for better reasons.

Are we talking about the same Serenity (2019)?

I mean, it is kind of heartbreaking if one just focuses on the intent of the film. Execution is another.

 

[The Cat]

Are we talking about the same Serenity (2019)?

No.

 

[Totenkindly]

Star Wars: Rise of Skywalker Editor Gets Honest on Rushed Production | IndieWire

 

[Totenkindly]

My kid sent me these:

Here's what I've been told from a source that worked on TROS. : saltierthancrait
Some Clarifications About My TROS Post and a Statement From My Source. : saltierthancrait

If you have been wondering what's up with the "JJ Cut" meme, this series of reddit dumps explains why one exists (three hours) and how Disney interfered with the film during production and as released, it sounds like they completely messed with the film, jiggered all the editing to hell, and excised 40 minutes of content and recut things to make no sense. IOW, it sounds pretty much like what rolled out.

The credibility factor for me is simply that I had trouble recognizing this as an Abrams film because of how amateur the story and cut was. Abrams has flaws we have discussed in this thread, but I have never seen him put together a poorly edited and frankly incoherent film like this one. Even his other film I hate (STID) pissed me off not because it was incoherent but because it was a cheap copy of ST2 and deadened the impact of that film. He typically does not make incoherent films, he can just enact a disappointing vision depending on his writing team. Also, we know the editing was done in a completely amateur/rushed fashion, during shooting, from the other article I posted based on comments by the actual editor who has done other films for Abrams. The vision described in these reddit posts and Abrams' disappointments with the released product sound more like what I would expect. It's really obvious how different even TFA is from TROS in terms of professional quality, TFA's sin was in trying to recreate ANH but it was still very coherent and with proper editing and arcing.

It looks like The Mouse might have fucked us all over.

And screw KK if she is the one who insisted on Reylo. Even the implementation was terrible.

I'm also wondering how much of TLJ pushback resulted in Disney becoming psychotically controlling on this release and completely shitting all over their own film rather than trusting Abrams.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

My kid sent me these:

Here's what I've been told from a source that worked on TROS. : saltierthancrait
Some Clarifications About My TROS Post and a Statement From My Source. : saltierthancrait

If you have been wondering what's up with the "JJ Cut" meme, this series of reddit dumps explains why one exists (three hours) and how Disney interfered with the film during production and as released, it sounds like they completely messed with the film, jiggered all the editing to hell, and excised 40 minutes of content and recut things to make no sense. IOW, it sounds pretty much like what rolled out.

The credibility factor for me is simply that I had trouble recognizing this as an Abrams film because of how amateur the story and cut was. Abrams has flaws we have discussed in this thread, but I have never seen him put together a poorly edited and frankly incoherent film like this one. Even his other film I hate (STID) pissed me off not because it was incoherent but because it was a cheap copy of ST2 and deadened the impact of that film. He typically does not make incoherent films, he can just enact a disappointing vision depending on his writing team. Also, we know the editing was done in a completely amateur/rushed fashion, during shooting, from the other article I posted based on comments by the actual editor who has done other films for Abrams. The vision described in these reddit posts and Abrams' disappointments with the released product sound more like what I would expect. It's really obvious how different even TFA is from TROS in terms of professional quality, TFA's sin was in trying to recreate ANH but it was still very coherent and with proper editing and arcing.

It looks like The Mouse might have fucked us all over.

And screw KK if she is the one who insisted on Reylo. Even the implementation was terrible.

I'm also wondering how much of TLJ pushback resulted in Disney becoming psychotically controlling on this release and completely shitting all over their own film rather than trusting Abrams.

Wow...that is really damning, and it may have been because they didn't want J.J to do Superman? I've defended the way they've handled Star Wars in the past, but if this is the case, fuck them.

I know some people have been saying that Oscar Isaac did not look too thrilled in interviews. That post provides further context for that which makes sense.

Also, the stuff about ghosts is funny. Reminds me of a South Park episode I just saw that had Mickey Mouse going to China and Randy killing a honey-addicted Pooh at Mickey's bidding.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

Maybe they'll release an extended director's cut at some point. I think they owe it to the audience.

 

[The Cat]

Maybe they'll release an extended director's cut at some point. I think they owe it to the audience.

Disney is psychoticaly ravenous with their "vault" their profit margins would have to be really affected for them to shell out a "we made a mistake" cut I'm more cynical about Disney than most though so grain of salt.

 

[Totenkindly]

Disney is psychoticaly ravenous with their "vault" their profit margins would have to be really affected for them to shell out a "we made a mistake" cut I'm more cynical about Disney than most though so grain of salt.

Naw, I'm kinda in agreement with you. They never want to admit they screwed up. And they're the company that would actually take their product off shelves in the past for periods of time to generate later demand. They haven't even released 4K versions of the other films aside from THe Last Jedi yet, I think.

So I'd love to see the three hour "director's cut" but they would only do it if they (1) could significantly make more money (but people are gonna buy the crappy theatrical cut anyway, idiots), and (2) they could do it in a way that wouldn't ultimately look bad. And if the cut ends up being a stellar improvement in coherency, that would make them look really bad. they like to double-dip so they'll probably release in Bluray and 4K, then save it for some special "boxed set" nonsense to sell their $500 crates.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

Disney is psychoticaly ravenous with their "vault" their profit margins would have to be really affected for them to shell out a "we made a mistake" cut I'm more cynical about Disney than most though so grain of salt.

They don't have to market it as such, they can just call it the extended cut, sort of like we've seen with a lot of previous fantasy and sci-fi films like The Lord of the rings trilogy extended DVDs/Blu Rays. All they need to say is that it was too long a cut to release for theatrical audiences. Besides, you know they'd make a shit load of money off such a cut released as a "special edition" or however they want to label it. Oliver Stone has released like a zillion cuts of Alexander, almost enough to rival all of the various cuts of Blade Runner.


Christ, this is the same company that put out multiple versions of the Tron Legacy soundtrack and on top of that made like half of the score available as extra tracks you had to purchase after already buying the CD of the soundtrack album, when all of the commercially released music could have fit onto one CD in the first place. They have proven in the past they don't mind releasing blatant cash grab products as long as people are willing to shell out money.

So sure, I don't see why it would be a problem to first release a theatrical cut on Blu, then later put out extended cuts of the new trilogy. I'd consider buying extended cuts if they were actually going to be improvements on the theatrical versions.

 

[Totenkindly]

Well, the Lord of the Rings films didn't get panned on RT -- they got in the 90's for each release. So it wasn't like "we fucked up, here's the actual film we should have shown you."

Even the Hobbit films got in the red twice, and they were always planning to do the extended cut releases as a package set so it didn't really matter that the last film didn't break 60%.

I don't even think the LotR films are out on 4K yet, I think they just have their bluray trilogy expanded sets.

If ROS had been good, it would be a no -brainer. But seriously, they're not gonna trot an extended version out very quickly if it would make them look like shit for rushing out a theatrical release because they would not be able to justify their choices. They'll wait and like I said maybe try to sneak it into a boxed set at first to force people to double-dip.

I am currently rewatching GotG 4K and man, this is how to make an "action" space film that actually has character arcs and meaning. It's not really that complicated. I still don't understand WTF they thought ROS was acceptable.

 

[The Cat]

They don't have to market it as such, they can just call it the extended cut, sort of like we've seen with a lot of previous fantasy and sci-fi films like The Lord of the rings trilogy extended DVDs/Blu Rays. All they need to say is that it was too long a cut to release for theatrical audiences. Besides, you know they'd make a shit load of money off such a cut released as a "special edition" or however they want to label it. Oliver Stone has released like a zillion cuts of Alexander, almost enough to rival all of the various cuts of Blade Runner.


Christ, this is the same company that put out multiple versions of the Tron Legacy soundtrack and on top of that made like half of the score available as extra tracks you had to purchase after already buying the CD of the soundtrack album, when all of the commercially released music could have fit onto one CD in the first place. They have proven in the past they don't mind releasing blatant cash grab products as long as people are willing to shell out money.

So sure, I don't see why it would be a problem to first release a theatrical cut on Blu, then later put out extended cuts of the new trilogy. I'd consider buying extended cuts if they were actually going to be improvements on the theatrical versions.

This is a company for whom branding means more than R&D to Weyland yutani.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

This is a company for whom branding means more than R&D to Weyland yutani.

For a company that cares so much about branding, releasing a subpar cut of a film into theatres to fuck over the director and chopping up soundtracks so consumers have to not only buy the CD but go and purchase the rest of it as "bonus tracks" from multiple different streaming services certainly doesn't help their brand look better.

 

[The Cat]

For a company that cares so much about branding, releasing a subpar cut of a film into theatres to fuck over the director and chopping up soundtracks so consumers have to not only buy the CD but go and purchase the rest of it as "bonus tracks" from multiple different streaming services certainly doesn't help their brand look better.

That's not even the worse things they do.