Random political thought thread.

[Red Memories]

What about the mom and her life? There is no such thing as a late term abortion, that's a political, not medical, term. Baby is likely not going to survive due to massive defects. Labor is induced and mom needs to deliver a baby, that likely won't survive, on her own. Imagine how that in itself feels.

Baby is made comfortable then docs have a conversation about what measures the parent or parents want to take as far as life support or not. No one is murdering babies in labor and delivery on a whim - this comes from decades or Christian fanatical propaganda. But babies with disabilities do die. That's not the same as them being aborted. Maternal death rates are third world in many US states. But I rarely, if ever hear this being discussed so I would tell people to visit hospitals in Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Texas... and see for themselves. CA is the only state so far to work to lower maternal death rates.

How Abortion Law in New York Will Change, and How It Won’t | The New Yorker

I went through this with my sister in law did about a decade ago. I got to witness what this was like and I truly despise the right for making this horrible experience worse for women, wanting to control women's choices made with their doctor or legislating reproductive choice (outlaw abortion AND birth control) while doing nothing for families.

I hope that you do a bit more reading about issues such as border vetting (has existed for decades) and tuition (Bernie proposed state and public colleges and universities free for all. Elites get to keep their institutions and maybe pay for them themselves) because a lot if it is just right talking points verbatim.

One of Hilary's debate talking points was a woman being able to have an abortion at any stage of pregnancy and I did NOT like that talking point. To me what you described is an entirely different situation that I would not even correlate to abortion, but a very very difficult situation and I definitely hope that your sister in law is okay as well. I cannot imagine the pain she faced, let alone the negativity of...I don't know why anyone would actually call this an abortion in general. That is not abortion. Late-term abortion is when in China the women are forced into it due to a 1 child policy and the babies have their skulls crushed and their bodies thrown into the river. THAT is late term abortion, there was no intent at all to even care this child could have lived or been wanted.

Personally, I think I would like to hear a politician discuss less about abortion and more about our broken foster care system. More parents would likely feel less like abortion is necessary if they'd fix the system. As it stands, it appears that a child may end up better off dead to most who consider it with the rampant physical, emotional, and sexual abuse that occurs as well as overcrowding.

I agree Bernie had it the correct way. I was merely pointing out issues I had with much of Clinton's discussion.

I have heard discussion talking points of certain candidates this year being for less vetting and some outright open borders. And I'm not comfortable with that sort of agenda.

I appreciate you writing me nevertheless because I always get something out of this. I could go down a good old list of things I definitely do not agree with Republicans on. But I specifically remember the huge thing that made me still vote Clinton over Trump, is Trump actively supports stop-and-frisk. Which is a dominantly racist regime. Not okay. Plus his deregulation of the EPA. X.x

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

“The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum”

-Chomsky

 

[ceecee]

One of Hilary's debate talking points was a woman being able to have an abortion at any stage of pregnancy and I did NOT like that talking point. To me what you described is an entirely different situation that I would not even correlate to abortion, but a very very difficult situation and I definitely hope that your sister in law is okay as well. I cannot imagine the pain she faced, let alone the negativity of...I don't know why anyone would actually call this an abortion in general. That is not abortion. Late-term abortion is when in China the women are forced into it due to a 1 child policy and the babies have their skulls crushed and their bodies thrown into the river. THAT is late term abortion, there was no intent at all to even care this child could have lived or been wanted.

But Hillary Clinton has/had no bearing on legislation. She was never even a legislator, she was a senator. I truly have no idea where this rhetoric comes from. Women should have the right to end a pregnancy at any stage, she is right. What people seem to refuse to take into account is that no physician or hospital is going to murder full term babies. They simply aren't.

When a woman or couple are told their unborn baby is not going to survive very long, baby is born missing a large portion of their brain, skull, and scalp, like my niece did, there isn't a single person that should have a speck to do with the choice those parents and doctor are making. I find the idea of some clown, generally male, in Washington, making decisions in a case like this to be offensive beyond belief. Everyone should. My niece was born in the morning and died in the afternoon on her own. And trust me, it was the best thing that she didn't live longer, for her, my brother and my sister in law. Right wingers/conservatives/religious fundamentalists don't really care about women - they are replaceable and their reproduction is as well. The only hope for humane legislation here is through progressives - Dems and Republicans certainly had their chance and made it much much worse.

But this is why conservatism has effective propaganda - massive lies usually do the trick if they're repeated long enough. Amy Coney Barrett took her 7 unmasked children to a COVID super spreader event. Parent of the year sure but not someone interested in preserving life, unless it's unborn. Would love to hear a SCOTUS nominee talk about the lives already on this fucking burning earth.

 

[Coriolis]

But this is why conservatism has effective propaganda - massive lies usually do the trick if they're repeated long enough. Amy Coney Barrett took her 7 unmasked children to a COVID super spreader event. Parent of the year sure but not someone interested in preserving life, unless it's unborn. Would love to hear a SCOTUS nominee talk about the lives already on this fucking burning earth.

One of the biggest early propaganda gains was co-opting the term "pro-life". Sadly those in favor of reproductive rights let them get away with this. It is an oversight Kamala Harris could easily have corrected in last night's debate, when Pence started an answer by emphasizing his own so-called "pro-life" stance. Everyone is pro-life; the difference lies just in whose lives one is "pro". I have made this argument many times myself, noting that those who favor the life of an unborn baby often have little regard for "born" lives, e.g. kids killed in the crossfire of gang violence, or people who die because they cannot afford lifesaving medical treatments. This argument gains teeth in the current environment when we can add the many lives lost to COVID-19, and to violent police treatment of minorities.

Of course the obvious indicator that so-called "pro-life" groups have an agenda other than stopping abortion is that many of them oppose the most effective means of reaching that goal: effective and readily available birth control, also fact-based sex education for young people. If people get pregnant only when they actually want a baby, there is no need for abortion except in medical emergencies.

 

[Jaguar]

Spotted lives matter.

 

[Red Memories]

One of the biggest early propaganda gains was co-opting the term "pro-life". Sadly those in favor of reproductive rights let them get away with this. It is an oversight Kamala Harris could easily have corrected in last night's debate, when Pence started an answer by emphasizing his own so-called "pro-life" stance. Everyone is pro-life; the difference lies just in whose lives one is "pro". I have made this argument many times myself, noting that those who favor the life of an unborn baby often have little regard for "born" lives, e.g. kids killed in the crossfire of gang violence, or people who die because they cannot afford lifesaving medical treatments. This argument gains teeth in the current environment when we can add the many lives lost to COVID-19, and to violent police treatment of minorities.

Of course the obvious indicator that so-called "pro-life" groups have an agenda other than stopping abortion is that many of them oppose the most effective means of reaching that goal: effective and readily available birth control, also fact-based sex education for young people. If people get pregnant only when they actually want a baby, there is no need for abortion except in medical emergencies.

Kind of my point along with fixing the foster care system so in the chance of an unplanned situation, adoption seems like a better option. As it is now, I don't blame them for thinking abortion might be a better idea than their child being born only to live in an overcrowded foster home for 18 years facing verbal physical or sexual abuse with no repercussions and no way to be heard because they're just an unwanted foster kid to everyone's eyes.

 

[Coriolis]

Kind of my point along with fixing the foster care system so in the chance of an unplanned situation, adoption seems like a better option. As it is now, I don't blame them for thinking abortion might be a better idea than their child being born only to live in an overcrowded foster home for 18 years facing verbal physical or sexual abuse with no repercussions and no way to be heard because they're just an unwanted foster kid to everyone's eyes.

Babies, especially if relatively healthy, usually have no trouble being adopted. From what I read, the kids who end up in foster care are usually those whose parents kept them, but then proved unable to care for them properly due to substance abuse, untreated illness, incarceration, etc. When no relatives step up to take the kids in, they go to fostser care. Eventually some do get adopted, sometimes by a foster family.

 

[Lark]

I've got this theory that someone has put a lot of work into engineering democratic countries to create a choice between equally detestable parties so that the majority are just estranged from it all, resigned to whatever and the watch dogs of the over privileged become the default setting.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

I've got this theory that someone has put a lot of work into engineering democratic countries to create a choice between equally detestable parties so that the majority are just estranged from it all, resigned to whatever and the watch dogs of the over privileged become the default setting.

Yes, Hunter Thompson expressed this frustration about the American system as far back as 1972.

Perot, for all his faults, and Nader both tried to take this on and saw most of their credibility destroyed (Nader was once a highly respected consumer rights advocate but will now be forever treated as the spoiler of 2000, despite Gore being 100% responsible for his own loss). The logical next step is try to take over one of the parties from within, yet no candidate in the last 20 years has been able to mount a successful “third party” run within the 2 party system (Sanders tried twice)

 

[Lark]

Yes, Hunter Thompson expressed this frustration about the American system as far back as 1972.

Perot, for all his faults, and Nader both tried to take this on and saw most of their credibility destroyed (Nader was once a highly respected consumer rights advocate but will now be forever treated as the spoiler of 2000, despite Gore being 100% responsible for his own loss). The logical next step is try to take over one of the parties from within, yet no candidate in the last 20 years has been able to mount a successful “third party” run within the 2 party system (Sanders tried twice)

Yeah, the democrats exist to hand power to the GOP.

The policy of infiltration tactics is an old Trotskyite trick, it worked for the Christian Right, who are kind of a trojan for other forces these days, or perhaps always where.

 

[Virtual ghost]

World’s cartoonists on this week’s events

 

[FemMecha]

The words POTUS, FLOTUS, and SCOTUS are extremely annoying to me. IDK why, but I despise those words. Maybe it's the all caps and that they are incredibly ugly sounds.

 

[ceecee]

Jeff Sessions, John Kelly, William Barr and this entire administration belong in the Hague.

 

[Tellenbach]

We all know that the Dems will end the filibuster if they win the senate and the presidency and then proceed to pack the Supreme Court so they'll get a majority. Is this a good idea? All this means is that which ever party wins the presidency and senate will do the same thing ad infinitum, until there is a Constitutional amendment to stop this nonsense. Do we really want to see 500 people on the Supreme Court?

Why don't the Democrats try to win elections by persuasion and good policies instead of throwing tantrums when they lose and coming up with stupid crap like packing the Court?

 

[Totenkindly]

I don't think the conservative take on @realDonaldTrump paying no taxes should be: BECAUSE HE'S SMART!

I've paid nearly 50% of my income in taxes, year after year, and any system that allows billionaires to pay ZERO is unspeakable corrupt.

How about changing it, Democrats?

(I know elsewhere she decries this as support to Dems, it just made me LOL)

The words POTUS, FLOTUS, and SCOTUS are extremely annoying to me. IDK why, but I despise those words. Maybe it's the all caps and that they are incredibly ugly sounds.

I like how FLOTUS sounds... at least for this term.

 

[Lark]

Most of the defenders of law and order policies dont seem that good in actually behaving peaceably and lawfully themselves.

 

[Jaguar]

2020 Election Live Updates: Democratic Senate Candidate Challenging Lindsey Graham Raises a Record $57 Million
Jaime Harrison, the Democratic candidate for Senate in South Carolina, raised more money last quarter than any Senate candidate in history.

Impressive. Get that two-faced SOB out of the Senate.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

Why doesn’t the US have a proper Labour Party?

 

[Lark]

Why doesn’t the US have a proper Labour Party?

There was a farmers and labourers party a long time ago, I think it gets a mention in Peoples History of The United States. Or maybe it was Chomsky.

I'd say its because the ethnic divisions, like into virtual townships and territories or even states, organized crime and prohibition have prevented it happening.

Even the republicans and democrats has switched places on the political spectrum, relatively speaking, a few times, like the republics were the party of emancipation during the civil war, the southern democrats where champions of segregation, Nixon was seriously considering an earlier version of UBI before Watergate, it was a popular idea among people seeking to define "The American Way" as distinct from the USSR or UK or Central European states.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

There was a farmers and labourers party a long time ago, I think it gets a mention in Peoples History of The United States. Or maybe it was Chomsky.

I'd say its because the ethnic divisions, like into virtual townships and territories or even states, organized crime and prohibition have prevented it happening.

Even the republicans and democrats has switched places on the political spectrum, relatively speaking, a few times, like the republics were the party of emancipation during the civil war, the southern democrats where champions of segregation, Nixon was seriously considering an earlier version of UBI before Watergate, it was a popular idea among people seeking to define "The American Way" as distinct from the USSR or UK or Central European states.

Nixon was more along the line of modern dems and European centrists. I mean, he was still a shit, and inspired/influenced the imperial presidencies of the last few decades. Not to say he was the first imperial president. But he did enact or try to enact some policies that were progressive by current Republican standards.

People’s History is a great book, I’m using it as my son’s primary history text this year.