Not living in the here and now?

[Jeffster]

The NF says plan for world peace... the NT here says imagine every single way life could go wrong, then feel a sense of urgency to know the right way to avoid it knowing the domino effect of your choices, and plan to make the right decision tomorrow so that ten years from now you won't be regretting your actions.

Imagine future for several weeks, research heavily for several weeks, contingency plan daily, re-evaluating everything in your plan with every single new piece of information. This is only for one facet of your life. There are probably a half-dozen major plans in your head all at different stages of this pattern. You must juggle these all in your head. This requires concentration on thoughts, and it by necessity needs daydreaming to see what could come up that needs to be dealt with.


Ignore things like the fact that you forgot to shower today or that your environment is a disaster zone. Be in focused crisis-aversion mode (without deep stress, only the fixation that comes with it) 90% of your time. The other ten is spent thinking of how to try to get out of conversations that are boring, or actually enjoying conversations, or dealing with your reality.

Holy crap, you do all of that all the time or just on special occasions?

I definitely daydream about the possibilities of things, like imagining a football game that's going to happen this Saturday and the different scenarios that could happen in that. I can't sustain it for very long, though. The external world breaks in and disrupts my concentration and then it's hard to go back to where i was. I think my NT older brother could probably imagine the entire game from start to finish if nobody physically busted him out of it. If he cared about football, that is. I think he's done it with video games, though. And when we were kids, he created an entire alternate world in his head where he had a house and a wife and kids, and he would "go" there on a regular basis when he had taken care of his real-world obligations for that day. I kinda envied his ability to do that because it felt like I was missing out on something.

Until the last few months, when I really started reading a lot about personality types and temperaments, I never appreciated my natural living in the here and now. I never saw it as an ability or preference, it was just reality. I probably thought of it more as holding me back. I'm only recently appreciating it more, and appreciating myself more in the process.

 

[nottaprettygal]

The NF says plan for world peace... the NT here says imagine every single way life could go wrong, then feel a sense of urgency to know the right way to avoid it knowing the domino effect of your choices, and plan to make the right decision tomorrow so that ten years from now you won't be regretting your actions.

Ironically, the extensive planning and such described above can lead me to engage in more sensor-ish activities that have me living in the moment. Sometimes juggling lots of major issues can result in a great deal of stress (usually when I can't resolve something or figure out what my next move is). Too much stress=sensor time. I'll eat, drink, and *cough* *cough* more just to escape the thoughts in my head.

It's odd, I suppose. Some people go into their heads to escape from reality. But for me, when my head is too "messed up" I have to escape to reality.

 

[Leysing]

It's sometimes frustrating when I go out jogging or biking on a beautiful day in order to enjoy the scenery and the weather and then, while stepping inside again, I realize that I haven't seen anything and I have just been totally lost in my thoughts.

 

[cafe]

For me, I guess it's like having bifocals on all the time. One view looks into the present and the other looks into the future. The future is where my eyes are naturally drawn, but I'm always looking back and forth between the two, running the natural progression of the present into the days, months, years, and decades ahead.

It does, no doubt, distract from the enjoyment of the present, but I think it also makes it easier to make for myself the life I want and saves me a lot of pain.

Or maybe it's trifocals. The past is always lurking in the background, which is, I suspect, why I need to protect myself from painful experiences. They linger for a very long time and I'm not sure some of them ever really heal.

 

[sarah]

Being an enneagram 4 and an ISFP I'm constantly alternating between being really disconected from my external world and being in my head and being totally immersed in my external world.

You too, eh? Heh! I know exactly what you're referring to...

Sarah, who is also an enneagram type 4 and ISFP

 

[sarah]

Until the last few months, when I really started reading a lot about personality types and temperaments, I never appreciated my natural living in the here and now. I never saw it as an ability or preference, it was just reality. I probably thought of it more as holding me back. I'm only recently appreciating it more, and appreciating myself more in the process.

Yeah, I can relate to that. Until recently, I really didn't attribute that here-and-now orientation as being anything amazing, even though I'd frequently wonder why some people didn't pick up on things that were right in front of them. (and why people don't just jump in there and DO stuff related to what's going on in front of them rather than just complaining, or observing critically, or making up rules to organize it into categories...)

It's actually helped me appreciate myself a lot better. When I was a teenager I spent a lot of time and emotional energy trying to to be like my INFJ mother on the surface, while secretly having my own opinions and interests, and even friendships with people she knew nothing about. I just felt that there was no way I could discuss anything I thought was important with her, unless she thought it was important too. It sounds silly, but I really thought that was the ony way she could love me. Nowadays, I believe that Mom would still have loved me had I just done whatever I felt like and been more forthright with her, although she would probably have worried about some of my more immature impulses...

Sarah
ISFP

 

[prplchknz]

I never thought of not living in the here and now or didn't think what I did wasn't. But I find that zone out or start imaging other scenerios all the time. As a child I was quiet and thought to lack social skills, which was probably true, but I was happily in my own world. Imaging the future and what it be like to live somewhere else. I also had such a strong imagination as a child I could convince myself something was true, very good and very dangerous.

[I posted, happy Jeffster?]

 

[colmena]

If the stimulus is good enough, I'll try to enjoy it. Otherwise, my thoughts are more interesting to me. Otherwise again, I'm simply escaping them for the fear that they will damage me.

If I'm listening to the sea, or just a good bit of silence, then that's what I'm doing. Nothing more. Nothing less.

 

["?"]

I've been fascinated since I started reading this personality stuff and the part about how SPs live in the here and now, but the other temperaments don't. And I'm like "what How can you not live in the here and now?"

I really can't imagine what it's like, because I've just always been me. So, what's it like to not live in the here and now? Maybe I can start to understand, and even if not, then it could still be an interesting topic.

Very interesting inquiry Jeff, however I guess I am on a rant this week about SPs in general being stereotyped when it comes to Se. In particularly if Se is the secondary function, it may not be as accessible for ISPs without some conscious effort.

As a Ti type (and from what I understand about all types in developing their auxiliary), living in the moment is relative to how well the Se is developed. I think that some claiming to prefer intuition may develop their Se enough that they could live in the moment equally as well, if not better than again an ISP that does not have a developed Se. I recall reading somewhere years ago that introverted types will use their auxiliary in a defensive mode generally, thus ITJs have to consciously develop Te, INPs and Ne… etc. But on the point of the latter mentioned, living in the moment is relative since Ne and Se can only be used actively in the moment. The only difference is concrete vs. abstract, taking advantage of immediate opportunities vs. seeing possibilities etc.

 

[Sunshine]

You too, eh? Heh! I know exactly what you're referring to...

Sarah, who is also an enneagram type 4 and ISFP

WHAT?? NO WAY!! SWEEEEET!
Ahem. I mean it's nice to have other ISFP 4s around.

So you're in your head a lot too then?
Most other ISFPs I talk to can't really relate to that.

Hey my mother is an INFJ too. This is weird. *Twilight zone theme song music plays*

 

[Usehername]

It's odd, I suppose. Some people go into their heads to escape from reality. But for me, when my head is too "messed up" I have to escape to reality.

Me. Too.


....


It only just occurred to me as I read your post this is odd.

 

[Domino]

I envy SPs. I'm never present. I'm always projected back or forward. It's a struggle to be NOW.

 

[Jeffster]

[I posted, happy Jeffster?]

Yes.

 

[Lateralus]

I envy SPs. I'm never present. I'm always projected back or forward. It's a struggle to be NOW.

Even my conversations with imaginary people aren't in the here-and-now.

 

[SolitaryPenguin]

The two examples I live with on a day to day basis are my son and my girlfriend.

My son - possible ENFP (tough to tell, he's only 6) This kid cannot exist in the current moment. He is constantly asking what we are going to be doing next, and no matter how exciting that thing is when we get there, he wants to know what's after that.

My girlfriend - INFJ She has the worst case of the "what ifs" I have ever seen. She plans for every possible contingency and outcome no matter how improbable it might be, never even really seeing the present moment.

I try not to badger them with my "live in the now" attitude, but it definitely gets tough sometimes. Fortunately for me I am not a huge risk taker or I could get into a lot of trouble. Consequences have always been of little consequence to me.

 

[Tallulah]

My girlfriend - INFJ She has the worst case of the "what ifs" I have ever seen. She plans for every possible contingency and outcome no matter how improbable it might be, never even really seeing the present moment.

Sometime I think the "what ifs" are anxiety-related, too. I'm very P, but if I have a bit of anxiety about something, I will imagine every single, horrible thing that could go wrong and try to anticipate a response to it.

 

[Jeffster]

Very interesting inquiry Jeff, however I guess I am on a rant this week about SPs in general being stereotyped when it comes to Se. In particularly if Se is the secondary function, it may not be as accessible for ISPs without some conscious effort.

As a Ti type (and from what I understand about all types in developing their auxiliary), living in the moment is relative to how well the Se is developed. I think that some claiming to prefer intuition may develop their Se enough that they could live in the moment equally as well, if not better than again an ISP that does not have a developed Se. I recall reading somewhere years ago that introverted types will use their auxiliary in a defensive mode generally, thus ITJs have to consciously develop Te, INPs and Ne… etc. But on the point of the latter mentioned, living in the moment is relative since Ne and Se can only be used actively in the moment. The only difference is concrete vs. abstract, taking advantage of immediate opportunities vs. seeing possibilities etc.

Thanks for your contribution, and I think you're right. This probably explains why I was more of a "dreamer" as a kid, as that Se hadn't developed fully. I still felt much more "here and now" than my older brother, but I was definitely more oblivious to things around me than I am now when I was focused on my own creations rather than real-life obligations.

I envy SPs. I'm never present. I'm always projected back or forward. It's a struggle to be NOW.

Eh, I don't entirely buy that. You post a lot of times quickly in response to someone else, bantering back and forth with people. You seem to have a better ability to live in the moment than you give yourself credit for.

My girlfriend - INFJ She has the worst case of the "what ifs" I have ever seen. She plans for every possible contingency and outcome no matter how improbable it might be, never even really seeing the present moment.

I try not to badger them with my "live in the now" attitude, but it definitely gets tough sometimes. Fortunately for me I am not a huge risk taker or I could get into a lot of trouble. Consequences have always been of little consequence to me.

Heh. My INFJ co-worker is a "What if" Monster too! I think she has stopped being as much that way with me because I kept shooting her hypotheticals down so often, haha.

Meanwhile, my son seems to be the opposite of yours. He has even more trouble than me thinking about anything in the future, completely consumed with what he is doing NOW.

 

[Quinlan]

I can definitely relate to this, sometimes I feel guilty about it. Like I'm the Cricket chilling out and playing, while the Ant toils away storing food for the winter and one day it's going to bite me on the arse and I will need to depend on someone who planned ahead much better.

The way I think is you can't change the past, it's done so why live there? and the future is unwritten, your best laid plans could easily backfire by the unpredictability of life. So living in the moment feels right, I can change and control what I'm doing right now with predictable results. If you are always looking at tomorrow then you'll never notice how great today is.

 

[kelric]

I also tend to spend a lot of time in fantasyland. All the things I'd love to be able to do that would help if I'd spend time in the here and now, such as acting and playing guitar, etc., I can just imagine that I'm already good at it. And then reality is always disappointing, and it seems like I'll never reach the goals I've already seen myself reaching. My inner world is always my escape, and it's too easy to retreat there where everything is the way I like it.

My thoughts run pretty close to what Tallulah mentioned. There's a lot of imagining myself in varying (usually exciting or non-normal interesting) situations or circumstances - and building stories or envisioning expertise at things that I'm really pretty new at. I often pick stuff up pretty fast, but seldom stick with them long enough to actually achieve the skills that I've imagined myself with, so it's often more fun to daydream. I'm primarily preoccupied most of the time - it's different when I'm with people chatting, etc., but I spend most time alone, and even in a group I tend to fade into the background and space out.

I've tried to do more "here and now" type things lately, but I find myself falling into mental-autopilot when I try. When I go hiking, for example, it'll go from an "enjoy nature" thing to a combination of daydreaming and challenging myself to see how quickly I can complete the hike.

Sometime I think the "what ifs" are anxiety-related, too. I'm very P, but if I have a bit of anxiety about something, I will imagine every single, horrible thing that could go wrong and try to anticipate a response to it.

Too true . I'm particularly bad at this at work, or when I get down about something. I'll get all tied up in trying to anticipate *everything* that I can conceive - which usually turns into a fairly big (and quite stressful) waste of time.

 

[Jack Flak]

Eh, I don't entirely buy that. You post a lot of times quickly in response to someone else, bantering back and forth with people. You seem to have a better ability to live in the moment than you give yourself credit for.

Being that PP's post and mine were similar: I don't think you quite get it, just as I don't quite get what it is to be a Sensor. You can read about it, but you can't know.

Part of the reason I can come up with something to say so quickly is because my mind is everywhere at once.