Jealousy and Envy

[violaine]

I have never been envious. I am always happy for someone when they have something good happening in their life.

I have only ever been jealous when I have good reason. i.e. When the person I am with is too flirtatious or has cheated on me. In that situation I find it very difficult to keep a lid on feeling jealous. I feel miserable when I'm like that, it takes a lot out of me. It doesn't inspire passion in me either if someone tries to make me jealous, it slowly kills my feelings for them.

 

[Ghost of the dead horse]

I'm rarely envious or jealous, but having been in a bad situation with my job, I got envious of a young woman (perhaps 17), a salesperson in a shop.

Her job seemed easy to do, stress free, not a worry with her life. Perhaps some, but insignificant. I just thought, no skills needed, just a fun attitude, and there you go. Felt depressed afterwards.

I'm envious of my successful ex boss too, who got his business started at a young age due to help from his rich father.

Jealousy, I'll give that a thought.

No, none of that in years. Say, 20.

 

[Mole]

They told us, "Make love not war".

They told us love was free and we should make free love.

But the serpent in the garden is jealousy.

 

[Ghost of the dead horse]

Seeing I've answered this last year and remembered a moment of jealousy, I must be generally quick to forget

 

[heart]

They told us, "Make love not war".

They told us love was free and we should make free love.

But the serpent in the garden is jealousy.

That and herpes.

 

[Oso Mocoso]

That and herpes.

Thank you, heart, for going there.

 

[cascadeco]

I can certainly be jealous. I don't typically verbalize it or show it; usually just a passing feeling.

Much of it is related to insecurities I have in myself - mostly physical - so I can be quite jealous at times of those who have characteristics that I find quite lacking in myself.

And like most, I can be jealous in romantic settings.

 

[SillySapienne]

I can certainly be jealous. I don't typically verbalize it or show it; usually just a passing feeling.

Much of it is related to insecurities I have in myself - mostly physical - so I can be quite jealous at times of those who have characteristics that I find quite lacking in myself.

Question: So do you find yourself feeling fleeting feelings of jealousy whenever some woman you deem to be highly, physically attractive, or more attractive than yourself crosses your optical path?

I am more than quite sure this is normal, but I still have trouble understanding it, so if you would, could you explain this a bit more in detail?

I, for example, would say, that regarding my physical appearance, I am quite cognizant of my nicer features as well as my more "problem areas", though I do think, that, overall, I am quite physically attractive, and I rarely, if ever, mentally dwell on my problem areas. Thank god!

Note: My sister once gave me the best piece of advice, that being, never dwell too long in front of a mirror, you'll just end up picking yourself apart.

Also, I never, ever, EVER, weigh myself. I have no idea how much I weigh, nor do I care, just as long as I feel good about myself and still fit into my clothes, I've accepted that being a woman means that my weight is going to fluctuate a bit sometimes, oh well. I don't think I need a scale to tell me definitively that I've gained a pound or two, when I probably know I have and, that, as mentioned before, this kind of fluctuation is normal.

But, I do know this much, my family members, as well as all of my close friends have each told me at some point in our relationships that I am an anomaly/freak when it comes to jealousy, in that compared to most folks, I do not experience jealousy much, if at all, and they are right. Excluding romantic jealousy, I pretty much never, ever experience jealousy.

I see physically beautiful women on a daily basis, women/girls who are objectively ten times prettier than I, and I just look at them with a sense of aesthetic appreciation, like I would to a beautiful wild-grown lupine.

They're just real purrdy, you know?

 

[norepinephrine]

Excluding romantic jealousy, I pretty much never, ever experience jealousy.

I see physically beautiful women on a daily basis, women/girls who are objectively ten times prettier than I, and I just look at them with a sense of aesthetic appreciation, like I would to a beautiful wild-grown lupine.

They're just real purrdy, you know?

Yes, I do know. Working on a campus, I would have to be insane if I allowed the physical beauty of co-eds phase me. And I enjoy mentally commenting on whatever feature draws my attention.

The only ones I don't care for (and they are few) are those who look as though they are parading their looks for attention. Though even they may have reasons for doing so of which I am unaware.

So long as I can draw a longer than casual glance from a male I pass on the sidewalk, I am perfectly content.

After that passes, well... I still have my wits.

When those are gone - well, I doubt I'll much care either way.

 

[Erudur]

More insidiously, I have a very intense feeling of guilt whenever I've been joking around with a male friend or something, and move away, and then realise this INTJ I have a thing with was near. I don't know if it's because I'm hyper-vigilant about inciting jealousy, or that I sub-consciously try to induce jealousy, and then feel guilty about my motives. I don't know if joking around with someone else normally causes jealousy but I don't seem to have that relaxed mutual entertaining thing going on with the INTJ (with us it's more like mutual snarky comments), so yeah.

This was a really interesting thread. I'm glad it resurfaced. I am intrigued by this potential Fi correlation to a lower propensity for jealousy. I think I'm a higher Fi developed INTJ, and I don't think I experience jealousy much. When someone else seems to have the affections of somebody I'm attracted to, I think it creates in me more of an ache of longing than jealousy. Like erinavery said (though she seemed to be referencing stuff/attributes rather than romantic feelings), I don't really feel like I have any more right to someone's affections than the other person. I also don't let those feelings diminish my own feeling of self-worth.

"I have a thing with" -- Sounds very undefined! I don't want to project, but if your INTJ is like me, he probably notices, but doesn't want to be jealous, so he doesn't respond with jealousy.

Another interesting example of NFP and NTJ compatibility.

 

[norepinephrine]

When someone else seems to have the affections of somebody I'm attracted to, I think it creates in me more of an ache of longing than jealousy.

That struck a cord with me. As in, I don't want to take away what you have, I just want that as well.

It doesn't always have to be a zero-sum game.

 

[pockets]

This was a really interesting thread. I'm glad it resurfaced. I am intrigued by this potential Fi correlation to a lower propensity for jealousy. I think I'm a higher Fi developed INTJ, and I don't think I experience jealousy much.

Do you think so? It could be. I find myself being able to distance myself from ugly emotions like this and to not be consumed by them the older I get, and the more I learn about myself, incidentally through MBTI too. I'm rather surprised how knowing what Fi is (vs other functions) helps me wield Fi well.

When someone else seems to have the affections of somebody I'm attracted to, I think it creates in me more of an ache of longing than jealousy.

I don't understand how that is different from jealousy. Perhaps jealousy to me is a catch-all phrase for many shades of longing.

 

[Ardea]

I don't really understand both concepts... but I've seen how ugly they can get.

If you want something... then work for it. Maybe you'll end up with something better.

 

[cascadeco]

Question: So do you find yourself feeling fleeting feelings of jealousy whenever some woman you deem to be highly, physically attractive, or more attractive than yourself crosses your optical path?
I see physically beautiful women on a daily basis, women/girls who are objectively ten times prettier than I, and I just look at them with a sense of aesthetic appreciation, like I would to a beautiful wild-grown lupine.

They're just real purrdy, you know?

I think it's a combo of both for me. I can aesthetically appreciate, but regarding features of myself that I desperately wish were different from what they are, I can experience the fleeting feeling of jealousy as well, and I am often comparing and contrasting myself to other women. I know this does little good, but what can I say. And the funny thing is (or maybe not so funny..I suppose it's normal) that I find beauty, or elements of beauty, in pretty much everyone - there are very, very few that I find truly ugly or unattractive - but I can't seem to do the same for myself.

I think it's safe to say I've always been a little OCD about my appearance, and since about junior high age (18-19 yrs ago?) I've had hangups. The reason I go so far as to say OCD is because as a teenager I would focus on one thing I hated about myself, and that's all I could focus on. Then I'd eventually come to terms with that, i.e. acceptance, then I'd eventually settle onto something else. Just a progression, really. I recognize within myself that it is unhealthy, but I can't seem to break the chain. I will add that it comes and goes....but I suspect the reason I tend to obsess over the physical stuff rather than personality stuff is that the physical stuff is basically out of my control - nothing I can do about it. Whereas I am a believer that personality stuff can be molded/adjusted/consciously 'evolved' to a certain extent. And materialistic stuff, or jobs, or anything like that - also, much is in my control, and I am accountable for much/all of that. But back to appearance - combine this lack of control with it (I'm not speaking of weight - just features in general) with my silly habit of forecasting decades into the future, and I can just envision the aging process unfolding as well. I'm now starting to observe the aging process in myself, and I still need to internally come to terms with that and achieve a level of peace with that. What can I say...hmm. It's one of my major inner demons, and something I hate that I fixate on, and am embarrassed to admit, but there you have it. What can I say? I've always wished I were beautiful. And, I probably have an [overly?] inflated impression of how important looks can be in all types of interactions in day-to-day life -- from the obvious, romantic, to other dynamics.

*End raw post that I'm very self-conscious of writing*

 

[Mole]

And although the serpent of jealousy bites,

Jealousy is also proof of love.

 

[Nadir]

To be honest I think it's natural to feel pangs of jealousy and envy. The person-dependant part is choosing to blow it out of proportion and altering one's behaivour in a way as to be motivated by the now-amplified feeling. A simple example, I'll feel a brief jolt of jealousy and envy (using the two interchangably here) when I see that some people, friends or not, got A+ from an exam, whereas I had to contend with a B or something. I find this natural (at least for me) because I could say I have a passively competitive streak (passively because I'm really lazy and don't put in much of an effort, but that's another topic). However, this doesn't mean I make plans to undermine these people, or that I treat them badly/coldly, or that I adore/hate their achievements or even intelligence. That part is entirely up to me, and I choose not to partake in that particular pattern of behaivour because I know it to be unhelpful and destructive. But I'll always feel that jolt, it comes to me naturally and I don't think it's a bad thing.

Same thing with friends of mine who have boy/girlfriends. For me there's no point in denying that I do in fact feel wistful, very briefly when I see them together, (having no such partner myself) but this doesn't mean I dislike them for it, or that I go home and slit my wrists. That's just pointless.

 

[disregard]

And although the serpent of jealousy bites,

Jealousy is also proof of love.

No, jealousy is proof of the existence of the Ego.

It can be summoned when even the vaguest attachment is threatened.

 

[Mole]

No, jealousy is proof of the existence of the Ego.

It can be summoned when even the vaguest attachment is threatened.

I wouldn't want to disregard you but when a beautiful woman is jealous of me, I feel the sharpness of her bite but on consideration I realise she can't help herself because she is in the throes of love.

 

[substitute]

Entitlement. That's where it seems to always come from in me when I ferret the bugger out. False feelings of entitlement to something that someone else got more of/instead of me.

 

[Synapse]

The value system is different, my TJ family want and desire and think in terms of possession and value given through accumulation and work towards a target on a spectrum compared to others and I've seen the face of jealousy often and sometimes associate it with greed, wanting too much. While the FP side tends to want and desire very little more than the wellbeing of others and works towards that goal rather than the haves or haves not from life. The analogy I use with my parent is he will only be happy if he can measure my success in a weight of gold otherwise I confound him with my values. I can imagine, and I've said as much that I'd want very little in the way of assets only enough to sustain me and give the rest away where as my brother would just as rather take the entire lot, its like whenever I get something that's better than his he gets jealous and takes it.