House of the Dragon

[Totenkindly]

Watched the opener for kicks the day after it aired, despite being somewhat indifferent.

Decent acting. A lot of it feels like "GoT Lite" ("oh, this again?")

Dragons were treated rather nonchalantly which is nice.

Lots of geographical callbacks, most of them inadvertently tinged with absurdity and/or tragedy unfortunately if you have watched all of GoT. "Oh, that's where the Hound and Mountain [you know what happened]." "Oh that's where Tommen [you know what happened]." "Oh, that's the court we saw a lot of where Tyrion and Cersei argued all the time." "Oh, there's where Jaime and Cersei [you know what happened]." And so on.

Also a lot of family name callbacks, with a lot of houses we already know, along with long-running family names. At least I didn't hear a Dickon in there.

The time span for comparison is around 170 years or something, which is fairly close to about how long it's been since the American Civil War occurred.

But otherwise it all seems to be the SoS. I'm glad they got Paddy Considine to bring some pathos to King Viserys Targaryen, because he's kind of got the jaw-dropper "bad husband" move in this episode.

I barely recognized Sonoya Mizuno here because she's actually talking a lot -- I typically have seen her in Alex Garland projects where she doesn't talk at all or has very soft-spoken/stilted communication.

Matt Smith chews up the scenery with particular relish.

Milly Alcock and Emily Carey are decent -- but they'll get replaced later in the season by their adult counterparts.

Typical violence and sex percentage as expected.

I guess the big thing here is that at least GRRM wrote the end of the story this time, so there shouldn't be any confusion or "less than" in getting there.

However, there's a problem in that we know where it all goes anyway. There's one comment by Viserys about a future prediction and what is needed, and you just want to LoL because you see he's kind of wrong (and/or right in an unintended way) because of how badly GoT bobbled its endgame. It just ends up feeling like they're all played for chumps and nothing they do much matters anyway.

Other than that, same production quality, cinematography, etc. One scene triggered me to whisper "Dracarys" ahead of time and it was semi-rewarding. Otherwise? Eh. Kind of like, if you've got time and miss Westeros, it's pretty much more of the same without D&D there to fumble the ball, I guess.

 

[Totenkindly]

Matt Smith was really great in Episode 2, he is adding nuance to what might have been a one-note character. Milly Alcock as well. But I don't know what accent Sonoya Mizuno was trying to emulate (it sounded mostly French); it was rather all over the place.

The dragons are treated rather nonchalantly and showcased when it makes sense.

Prerequisite GoT level grossness, with the crab eater guy.

They're a bit shameless with the music, using GoT theme to open the show but with a different style of opening. I think it looks more like watery BBQ sauce than blood, but whatever.

 

[The Cat]

Matt Smith was really great in Episode 2, he is adding nuance to what might have been a one-note character. Milly Alcock as well. But I don't know what accent Sonoya Mizuno was trying to emulate (it sounded mostly French); it was rather all over the place.

The dragons are treated rather nonchalantly and showcased when it makes sense.

Prerequisite GoT level grossness, with the crab eater guy.

They're a bit shameless with the music, using GoT theme to open the show but with a different style of opening. I think it looks more like watery BBQ sauce than blood, but whatever.

Fire and Sauce.

 

[ceecee]

Matt Smith was really great in Episode 2, he is adding nuance to what might have been a one-note character. Milly Alcock as well. But I don't know what accent Sonoya Mizuno was trying to emulate (it sounded mostly French); it was rather all over the place.

The dragons are treated rather nonchalantly and showcased when it makes sense.

Prerequisite GoT level grossness, with the crab eater guy.

They're a bit shameless with the music, using GoT theme to open the show but with a different style of opening. I think it looks more like watery BBQ sauce than blood, but whatever.

I think the entire reason for using the GoT theme in this episode but not Ep1 is so Twitter could overload on this gif.

Matt Smith, always excellent although I still see Prince Phillip/The Crown occasionally but that's just me and it will dissipate as I watch more of this. I really enjoyed him in Ep2 - petulant, bitchy, but in the end he knew when he should back off.

Sonoya Mizuno - I also wondered about her accent but no matter, she knows what's going on.

It wouldn't be a GoT show without next level disgusting (crabs) plus some child incest for good measure. People should understand this kind of thing was done all the time throughout history for dynastic purposes but they won't. This episode was only slightly less bloody than the last. So this week will likely have a huge body count.

I think I dislike Otto more than anyone at the moment.

I'm also kind of mystified at how many people don't remember what the "Free Cities" were. I was talking to a friend yesterday and she was like - What are the Free Cities? I was like - The Iron Bank? Of Braavos? The Faceless Man? Oy.

 

[Totenkindly]

Free Forgotten Cities for the win, rofl...!

This probably shouldn't make me laugh, but too much like middle/high school

 

[SearchingforPeace]

I enjoyed ep 3. I really enjoy Matt Smith in his role. Everyone else seems well cast as well. Really liking this so far.

 

[Totenkindly]

I enjoyed ep 3. I really enjoy Matt Smith in his role. Everyone else seems well cast as well. Really liking this so far.

snap, I forgot e3 came out tonight lol. That's great that Smith is still rocking it.

Edit: watched on Monday. That was spectacular. Daemon/Smith is MVP, and then Rhaenyra... both shone. It's a shame about the time jump soon, Milly Alcock is great.

 

[ceecee]

One thing I enjoyed during GoT was the Twitter discourse. Fortunately, HoTD is no different.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1564479956167835649

This was the closest to a Game of Thrones episode as I've seen so far.

Aegon II has arrived to destroy the world and everything in it. Even as a toddler he's horrible.

Rhaenyra is as pissed as she should be but her scenes in this epi were fantastic. Especially with Ser Criston Cole. Jason Lannister's marriage proposal is gross but, even grosser is Otto's suggestion to Viserys that Aegon should be betrothed to Rhaenyra.

Viserys is drunk in most of the episode. And missing a couple fingers as we see later on. Obviously this succession thing/ getting Rhaenyra married off is occupying most of his time.

Lord Lyonel Strong gives Viserys much better advice which, of course, he doesn't take.

Considering Matt Smith never spoke a word of dialogue in the whole episode but stole the show, should shush anyone thinking the guy isn't right for the role. It's crazy, over the top violence with Daemon taking on the entire Crabfeeder's army (with the help of Seasmoke and Laenor Velaryon) then walking out of the cave dragging half of the Crabfeeder, what more could anyone ask for?

 

[SearchingforPeace]

Watched episode 3 again. So much said without words throughout the episode. Rhaenyra scenes were great. Daemon going to battle was great. His anger at his brother's message was well done.

Just so much better than season 8. They really got this off to a great start.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

I just finished the pilot and I agree with people who said it was like the good parts of Game of Thrones. The level of background detail and the richness of character were more like seasons 1-4 than seasons 5-8. I felt like I was watching interesting characters rather than pieces being mechanically jerked around for the next plot beat which is the biggest problem with those seasons.

I liked the cameo by House Baratheon at the tourney (and of course they show up again with House Stark). It seemed like House Baratheon was a little rebellious even then. That level of detail and richness of wondering what they've been scheming from one small appearance is something that's really cool about Martin's writing.

 

[Totenkindly]

just finished last night's episode.

so question about Daemon & Rhaenyra

Did they or didn't they, in the brothel?
When I watched it, I got the impression they started rough foreplay but Daemon bailed before anything actually started... whereupon Rhaenyra went back and seduced Knight Cutestuff.

Some of the reviews are in conflict, and of course some of the characters were slanting or outright lying about the truth, so it got a little confusing.

There is kind of a lot to unpack there, plus still trying to envision how all these pieces are stacking up. Things are being moved around the board, alliances made and broken, people slighted or reinforced. At some point it will all crystalize and we'll see what we're up against.

I found the sex sequencing really interesting in terms of the editing and music and comparison/contrast between a few different encounters. It felt very plot and character driven, not simply superfluous.

That last two minutes was right out of Numbers 5:19-24.

 

[ceecee]

just finished last night's episode.

so question about Daemon & Rhaenyra

Did they or didn't they, in the brothel?
When I watched it, I got the impression they started rough foreplay but Daemon bailed before anything actually started... whereupon Rhaenyra went back and seduced Knight Cutestuff.

Some of the reviews are in conflict, and of course some of the characters were slanting or outright lying about the truth, so it got a little confusing.

There is kind of a lot to unpack there, plus still trying to envision how all these pieces are stacking up. Things are being moved around the board, alliances made and broken, people slighted or reinforced. At some point it will all crystalize and we'll see what we're up against.

I found the sex sequencing really interesting in terms of the editing and music and comparison/contrast between a few different encounters. It felt very plot and character driven, not simply superfluous.

That last two minutes was right out of Numbers 5:19-24.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1569141067345285120

So, Daemon and Rhaenyra go out on the town in King's Landing. Heavy making out and Daemon bails on her. Really unlike him but I think he knows his position is precarious however, simply abandoning her there where anything could happen to her is very much on brand for his chaotic self. Rhaenyra, otoh, was like - I'm getting some dick one way or another tonight - the scene was tastefully done and almost sweet.

Do I feel bad for Alicecent? Yes. Do I know that's probably going to be short lived? Yes. But having a rotting old man fucking a teenager is never not gross or bad.

Otto getting fired - apparently in the book, he had been removed and reinstated several times by other kings so I don't think this is going to last long. I loved the scene where Daemon is sleeping off his hangover and Mysaria is getting the snitch payoff. Makes sense if she is eventually to become the master of whispers.

After Episode 3, maybe this episode felt a little disappointing but I liked it and it's teeing up something at the wedding. Also loved that Plan B tea.

 

[SearchingforPeace]

I think they shot it to show Daemon was not her first, as he really isn't as bad as his brother thinks so as to take advantage of his drunk niece half his age in a dirty brothel.

That allowed Rhaenyra to go take charge of knight.

The actress for Rhaenyra was 21 during filming, while the actress for Alicent was 18. In the show they are close in age, so Rhaenyra is 18 by this episode. In the book Alicent is several years older than Rhaenyra.

The next episode trailer Rhaenyra's wedding to the Sea Snake's son and it hints things are going to be getting very very messy. It will likely be the last with the current actresses for the girls.

 

[Totenkindly]

Yes, I think Olivia Cooke and Emma D'arcy are billed in episode 6. I know the book (which I didn't read) had them more separate in age (more like older/younger sister), whereas the show cast them pretty close enough to be peers.

The sequence with Rhaenyra and Criston was done very well, it felt very relaxed, playful, intimate in a good way. I like each of their demeanor's. I was a bit on edge for Criston, I think aside from the act itself he would have been in worse trouble for abandoning his post (so to speak) as a member of the King's Guard. It wasn't really fair to compromise him in such a way, but... we know how Targaryens are. I'm glad at least at this point that Daemon "took the fall" for anything that was out of line, because he at least is the king's brother and has leeway, whereas Criston came from nothing and he would have been lucky to just go back to that if discovered.

I'm still not sure from the show how complicit Alicent was in marrying Viserys. I mean, obviously she was aware of what she was doing, but I feel more from the portrayal that she did it out of loyalty to her family and because of her father's wishes (she was compliant in a way that Rhaenyra is naturally NOT) and now feels rather trapped, as much as ascending to become Queen can become a trap. She has power because of her husband, but she's also in a cage she chose to enter and as much as she and R get into arguments, internally she does seem to feel like just something being used -- a mother, a sex partner, maybe the queen, but who is she really and what did she ever want for herself? I don't feel like I have a good grasp of her as a person, because she's never been allowed to voice what she wants and maybe she doesn't even know.

 

[SearchingforPeace]

Yes, I think Olivia Cooke and Emma D'arcy are billed in episode 6. I know the book (which I didn't read) had them more separate in age (more like older/younger sister), whereas the show cast them pretty close enough to be peers.

The sequence with Rhaenyra and Criston was done very well, it felt very relaxed, playful, intimate in a good way. I like each of their demeanor's. I was a bit on edge for Criston, I think aside from the act itself he would have been in worse trouble for abandoning his post (so to speak) as a member of the King's Guard. It wasn't really fair to compromise him in such a way, but... we know how Targaryens are. I'm glad at least at this point that Daemon "took the fall" for anything that was out of line, because he at least is the king's brother and has leeway, whereas Criston came from nothing and he would have been lucky to just go back to that if discovered.

I'm still not sure from the show how complicit Alicent was in marrying Viserys. I mean, obviously she was aware of what she was doing, but I feel more from the portrayal that she did it out of loyalty to her family and because of her father's wishes (she was compliant in a way that Rhaenyra is naturally NOT) and now feels rather trapped, as much as ascending to become Queen can become a trap. She has power because of her husband, but she's also in a cage she chose to enter and as much as she and R get into arguments, internally she does seem to feel like just something being used -- a mother, a sex partner, maybe the queen, but who is she really and what did she ever want for herself? I don't feel like I have a good grasp of her as a person, because she's never been allowed to voice what she wants and maybe she doesn't even know.

Yes, I feel sorry for Alicent. Luckily for her, her husband isn't going to live that long.

As to Daemon, I think he was exploiting his niece to try to get on the throne. He is much more calculating then he lets on. I think that might have been why he pulled back.

After he was found out anyway, he made the best of it, didn't deny anything, and asked to marry her. If the king didn't have a son, this would have been a good way to stabilize the kingdom. However, Viserys can't get over his contempt for his younger brother.

Besides, the king doth protest too much. He wanted a way to name his son heir.

 

[Totenkindly]

I guess for a Game of Thrones wedding, that was pretty subdued. I was sitting there clutching the arm of my sofa the whole time, we all know how badly these events typically go in GRRM's world.

• So I was most concerned about Criston. He's too good a person for his environment, which typically means you end up dying early. That almost bore out here, first in his excessive honesty with Alicent and then with whatever the hell that was at the wedding and then out in the courtyard. It looks like Alicent saved him by virtue of being the Queen, and he would obey here -- but I'm not sure what she asked in return.
• I thought the actual bloodshed of the wedding was going to be Daemon and Jerold Royce -- but somehow that didn't happen. Matt Smith rocks his few scenes once again. I guess Targaryen ability to control dragons can also somewhat affect animals like horses? Rhea barely gets any scenes in this show, damn. She definitely was strong of heart, but I guess it didn't matter. However, it didn't matter for Daemon either, as by the time he was free of his vows, Rhaenyra had already been promised to make some of her own.
• Criston got too starry-eyed from their dalliance -- or maybe it was really his last bid to salvage his own honor and dignity as a member of the King's Guard. But Rhaenyra would have never run off with him.
• Larys is spreading the gossip around; he's a sneaky little shit who could have been played by Lukas Haas and no one should ever trust this guy.
• Alicent parties in the Hightower colors of war. Everyone's watching Daemon to see what shit he's going to pull, especially in regards to his niece. This whole wedding feels like it's a powder keg. And eventually it is, but not from what we thought it would be.
• Jason Lannister: “This is why men wage war, because women will never be ready for the battle in time." Rhaenyra: "Your presence is always such a pleasure, Lord Jason." SNARK!
• Viserys is about done; stick a fork in him.

 

[SearchingforPeace]

Just so good. I am so glad they figured how to do this and avoid (so far) the mistakes of the last season or so of GoT.

It is going to be hard waiting for season 2, once this season is done.

 

[Totenkindly]

Yeah, I'm happy with the quality of the show so far. It's actually a maturely written, fairly complex show, similar to early GoT. The showrunners at least actually care about their story. It feels a step above all the other adaptations we've been discussing recently.

I feel like e5 might have glossed over a few emotional beats that would have allowed us to more easily follow the internal character arcs. (Like, a few big things happened and the involved characters could have been tracked emotionally on screen a bit better, to build the tension.) I think that was my main criticism.

 

[ceecee]

Oh boy...

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1571806325109325824

This man is an agent of chaos like no one else. And nothing good ever comes out of a GoT wedding. Especially when you try to make out with the bride at her wedding. I loved Vis going - what is that MFR doing?? right in the middle of cutting his food.

Poor Ser Criston Cole. After pouring his heart out to Rhaenyra, she informs him that the best she can give him is to be her #1 side piece. But when you beat someone to death with your bare hands instead of slamming a couple shots in the back of the room, very few people will want to be anywhere near you. Except maybe the queen. Who he spilled everything to like a dumbass.

Laenor and Rhaenyra are good with an open marriage. I'm sure this will work out perfectly.

The dance with the dragons begins with Alicent in her green dress.

Lyonel Strong is a much better hand. But I don't know what he's going to do with a king that's literally losing pieces of himself. Apparently it's leprosy, not greyscale although Viserys' arm looks a lot like Jorah's arm before Sam cured him by peeling off his skin.

This is the last episode with the young Rhaenyra and Alicent so I think that may be part of the reason for glossing over some emotional beats although they could have done better with the tension. Halfway through, I'm really happy with the show.

 

[SearchingforPeace]

New episode was good. Transition of some of the characters to older actors was amazing. They really cast well.

Lines are being drawn. Heartbreak and betrayal, life and death, all happen. Oh, the pain, the fire.

And I despise Queen Alicent. She is a self righteous witch trying to justify her schemes.