Gay and transexuals

[Poki]

No.

And God gives the ability to men to not procreate.

Why does everyone want to make God the bad guy?

It's the lack of caring and overly judgementalness of some religious people that make god the bad guy. Don't confuse people arguing with you and your beliefs an act of judgement against God himself.

Your beliefs and understanding of the Bible are yours, not everyone elses. I know it's hard to understand because we get trapped in he fact that sometimes we can't see anything except what we see and that controls our beliefs. Learning never stops and understanding never stops.

Let me give you an example. My GF dad sent her a direct quote from the bible that what we are doing is a sin...not married, live together, have sex, and have a child together. She being religious herself looked up the passage and read it from start to finish. His beliefs were skewed by his vision as he took one thing and used that word for word. It wasn't even out of context, but it was not the entire truth. Its was a small portion of the truth. These things if propogated not in its entirety make god out to look like an awful horrible person, not due to who he is, but due to the people who follow him.

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

Yes, I understand.

I was referring to the references by some posters about how God supposedly forbids masturbation (and you who implied God demands procreation). I inferred from these statements that you guys were criticizing God's word (even if they were incorrect).

 

[magpie]

trans people have body dysmorphia.

Thank you for your contribution.

It's true we haven't talked about how body dysmorphic disorder and hypoactive sexual desire disorder are still listed in the current rendition of the DSM as disorders the way homosexuality used to be.

 

[jixmixfix]

Thank you for your contribution.

It's true we haven't talked about how body dysmorphic disorder and hypoactive sexual desire disorder are still listed in the current rendition of the DSM as disorders the way homosexuality used to be.

That's a silly comparison I was referring to the reasons stated in the op.Trans people unlike homosexuals have body dysmorphia its pretty much a fact.

 

[magpie]

That's a silly comparison I was referring to the reasons stated in the op.Trans people unlike homosexuals have body dysmorphia its pretty much a fact.

Yes. Trans people have body dysmorphia. Asexuals have a lack of sexual attraction. Homosexuals have sexual attraction to the same sex.

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

Then are not a true Christian. Christians believe in and try to adhere to the Bible.

It's like saying I am a Aristotelian but don't believe in his writings.

I cringed when I read this. If there was only one way to be a Christian, then why so many branches? Presbetyrian, Babtist, Pentecostal....on and on. This doesn't even count Episcopal and Catholicism. Nor other religions of the world.

It's almost as if you can love God through many different disciplines.

So a "true" Christian is your truth through to God. Okay. I support that. Shouldn't everyone have the ability to do this, provided they bring no harm to others in the name of God?

Can you not at least, see that others may have alternate paths that may seem false to you but are true for them?

Also, not everyone is a believer. So what of them? Should they not get the rights on this Earth?

It seems very simple to allow each other to be themselves. It doesn't mean you have to alter your views but your views shouldn't impede anothers ability to live their own lives.

You can see this is not the case when these attitudes gravitate toward discriminatory practices and pervasive negative attitudes toward others that stir hatred and sometimes violence. That is not of God.

I'm not saying you are of that ilk - at all! But just showing there is a slippery slope there.

 

[Betty Blue]

Transsexuals claim to have a different brain want to get their sex change. Gay people have a brain similar to females yet they don't have the urge to get their sex change. Why is this?


Edit: Actually mods, don't delete this thread. I change my mind.

It's a very interesting question. The reason it is interesting to me is that in order to feel like you were born the 'wrong' sex and want to change sex you have to identify very strongly as female or male. This brings into question societies role in gender stereotyping. Often trans people identify, from a very young age, as wanting to; dress as play as, the opposite gender to which they were physically born.... but then what happens with tomboys or tom girls.... I think the thing is that gender is a lot more complex that the genitalia we are born with. Societies expectations play a large part too. It's something I have mulled over many many times. Because often when you ask a trans individual they will identify with the stereotype of the other gender, which I have always found to be society generated. But it's possible that it is just over emphasised because of a perceived lack in themselves of being that sex.

However there are plenty of people who do not identify with gender at all. Sort of gender neutral. And also people who identify with both genders. There are also people who are trans and gay lesbian or bi etc. Sexuality is not based on the gender you identify as.


Edit: There are also hundreds of intersexed conditions that people are not aware of. Many of these are subtle and genetic based and not obvious from any physical standpoint. But there are tons of conditions that are seemingly mild, such as a physical male having part of a fallopian tube internally, or a female who develops a chest as muscular pecs rather than breast tissue. Often people know the very dramatic hermaphrodite but they do count for a tiny proportion of intersected conditions, something like 0.3% i forget the stats, though I did look them up and post them on this forum at some stage in the past five years. It's not only physical either, some individual identify as male/female physically but the opposite emotionally and are happy or not with this. It really is a vast topic... and fascinating!

 

[Jaguar]

Being gay is a disorder that should be explored for a cause and a treatment.

I think being in denial should be explored for treatment.

 

[kyuuei]

Condescend much?

There is a lot of unrest and anger against me personally by you guys.

if you read my posts, there is no anger, only wonder, and wanting to get to the truth of these matters...

why are so many here so angry about gayness being something learned versus something innate?

Sorry, but when ignorance and denial are that gaping, it is hard not to be condescending. You basically come in here and say, "This is true, so why don't we fix it?" A hundred people tell you it isn't true at all and there's nothing to fix. And you say, "Why u mad bro? just fix it!" You're crying that a fish is dead and it should be alive because it is cuter alive, and we're saying it's natural for fish to die and nothing wrong was done here except you flailing the fish's dead body around screaming about it like a child without any knowledge of death.

If people can become traumatized and get physical ailments and psychological disorders from childhood abuse and neglect, why can they not get sexual disorders from abuse and neglect as well?

I am suggesting that sexual disorders comprise a wide spectrum of what used to be considered strange and sinful but we now call normal variation; that sexual disorders range from asexuality and inorgasmia to hypersexuality and erectile dysfunction to homesexuality, promiscuity, and transgender issues, to name a few.

Instead of even considering this, in order to potentially FIX an underlying and dormant problem, we are quick (as a society) to falsely claim biology or organic genesis as the reason for such aberrant sexual inclinations.

Well, we aren't falsely claiming biology. There is just biological proof there.. also, like, thousands of years of history where homosexuality harmed pretty much no one but ignorance and intolerance did. If we are going by what has caused more harm without being diagnosed as a disorder, religious zealots should be on the chopping block long before homosexuality. We really do need to fix violent christians that do terrorist acts like blow up and shoot up planned parenthood centers before we try to fix two dudes tossing a salad. The worst part is, Christianity is so well accepted that no one dares call christian terrorists just that--they can call any muslim a terrorist for simply looking muslim, but they will not come out and say Christians can be terrorists as well. Religion has been behind many many many acts of violence and general disrespectful behavior that has brought society down and destroyed families and loved ones over personal reasons and beliefs. I think before any Christians go crusading at people outside of their ranks (i.e. imposing their beliefs into situations with wildly different views like this one), they need to take care of those inside of their ranks making them look bad (i.e. maybe you should be helping causes that get rid of WBC and Christian terrorists and do the world some actual good).

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

I cringed when I read this. If there was only one way to be a Christian, then why so many branches? Presbetyrian, Babtist, Pentecostal....on and on. This doesn't even count Episcopal and Catholicism. Nor other religions of the world.

It's almost as if you can love God through many different disciplines.

So a "true" Christian is your truth through to God. Okay. I support that. Shouldn't everyone have the ability to do this, provided they bring no harm to others in the name of God?

Can you not at least, see that others may have alternate paths that may seem false to you but are true for them?

Also, not everyone is a believer. So what of them? Should they not get the rights on this Earth?

It seems very simple to allow each other to be themselves. It doesn't mean you have to alter your views but your views shouldn't impede anothers ability to live their own lives.

You can see this is not the case when these attitudes gravitate toward discriminatory practices and pervasive negative attitudes toward others that stir hatred and sometimes violence. That is not of God.

I'm not saying you are of that ilk - at all! But just showing there is a slippery slope there.

Sure. That is between them and God.

Just sharing the truth as I know it.

 

[prplchknz]

Sorry, but when ignorance and denial are that gaping, it is hard not to be condescending. You basically come in here and say, "This is true, so why don't we fix it?" A hundred people tell you it isn't true at all and there's nothing to fix. And you say, "Why u mad bro? just fix it!" You're crying that a fish is dead and it should be alive because it is cuter alive, and we're saying it's natural for fish to die and nothing wrong was done here except you flailing the fish's dead body around screaming about it like a child without any knowledge of death.



Well, we aren't falsely claiming biology. There is just biological proof there.. also, like, thousands of years of history where homosexuality harmed pretty much no one but ignorance and intolerance did. If we are going by what has caused more harm without being diagnosed as a disorder, religious zealots should be on the chopping block long before homosexuality. We really do need to fix violent christians that do terrorist acts like blow up and shoot up planned parenthood centers before we try to fix two dudes tossing a salad. The worst part is, Christianity is so well accepted that no one dares call christian terrorists just that--they can call any muslim a terrorist for simply looking muslim, but they will not come out and say Christians can be terrorists as well. Religion has been behind many many many acts of violence and general disrespectful behavior that has brought society down and destroyed families and loved ones over personal reasons and beliefs. I think before any Christians go crusading at people outside of their ranks (i.e. imposing their beliefs into situations with wildly different views like this one), they need to take care of those inside of their ranks making them look bad (i.e. maybe you should be helping causes that get rid of WBC and Christian terrorists and do the world some actual good).

tried to find a pic of two dudes tossing a dinner salad couldn't find one but here's one of them playing jenga same thing pretty much

 

[Jaguar]

Latest issue of Scientific American Mind
http://www.scientificamerican.com/magazine/mind/2016/01-01/

Maybe someone should shake a Bible at those kids. That's the solution. Really fuck them up.

 

[fetus]

Then are not a true Christian. Christians believe in and try to adhere to the Bible.

It's like saying I am a Aristotelian but don't believe in his writings.

I'm not a true Christian because I believe that homosexuality is A-OK? Is that the basis of religion now? Doctrine and Biblical fine print?

It says in the Bible that if you believe in the Holy Trinity and the divinity of Jesus Christ, and you've accepted Christ in your life, you're basically a Christian. Read Romans 10:10. It outlines what being saved actually is.

Man...

 

[Yama]

Just sharing the truth as I know it.

You mean the "truth" that "sexual disorders" are caused by the traumatization of children?

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

If people can become traumatized and get physical ailments and psychological disorders from childhood abuse and neglect, why can they not get sexual disorders from abuse and neglect as well?

I am suggesting that sexual disorders comprise a wide spectrum of what used to be considered strange and sinful but we now call normal variation; that sexual disorders range from asexuality and inorgasmia to hypersexuality and erectile dysfunction to homesexuality, promiscuity, and transgender issues, to name a few.

Instead of even considering this, in order to potentially FIX an underlying and dormant problem, we are quick (as a society) to falsely claim biology or organic genesis as the reason for such aberrant sexual inclinations.

People do get sexual disorders from abuse and neglect. Those disorders usually show up in forms of hypersexuality in younger sexual abuse victims. A fear of intimacy or physical closeness with others. I mean, yes. This is proven. But you are making a giant leap here...I'll explain...

Can we agree that not all gay/transgendered people have been sexually or physically abused?

The ones that have been - how many have been abused by a same sex abuser? All of them? Doubtful.

The statistics show that there are more cases of sexual abuse than there are gay/lesbians. 1-8% of the population identify as LG. 16% of males and 27% of females report they have been sexually abused. So, how is this the only explanation? You see the disparity here, right?

It's sort of like me saying, all those children molested by priests will show a propensity towards Catholicism. It's nonsensical. Bad example but you see what I am trying to show you. That correlation/causation isn't either/or.

We are much more complex than that and based on evidence, you have to at least entertain biological causation as an equally viable option to the discussion.

 

[Bilateral Entry]

And slowly, 1 by 1, we realize that she's only using logic to confirm her own beliefs, and turns off logic to cover her ears from any legit counter arguments. And 1 by 1, we give up... until.... the next thread.

 

[Yama]

And slowly, 1 by 1, we realize that she's only using logic to confirm her own beliefs, and turns off logic to cover her ears from any legit counter arguments. And 1 by 1, we give up... until.... the next thread.

I mean, I'd be more than happy to continue discussing with her, but it seems that ever since I told her in my counter-argument that I was trans, she hasn't responded to a single one of my posts (other than once to insult me and not actually respond maturely to anything), despite the fact that I had some legit points that prompted further discussion. Because, y'know, being trans means you're insane and obviously don't know what you're talking about and can't be logical.

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

Nah... I've just said my piece and y'all have said yours and there is really nothing more to say, that's all. Otherwise it turns into ranting and raving.

Merry Christmas, Everyone! <3

 

[á´…eparted]

Nah... I've just said my piece and y'all have said yours and there is really nothing more to say, that's all. Otherwise it turns into ranting and raving.

Cut and run. Typical. Classic. Continue to ignore all of the issues pointed out, ignore all the points brought up, and continue to life in the false illogical world you have created that doesn't reflect how reality actually is. What a wonderful way to win over everyone and get respect.

Merry Christmas, Everyone! <3

No.

 

[Yama]

Nah... I've just said my piece and y'all have said yours and there is really nothing more to say, that's all. Otherwise it turns into ranting and raving.

Merry Christmas, Everyone! <3

I replied to you pages ago and you continued to respond to other people for multiple pages but absolutely nothing that I said, so forgive me if I find it a little hard to believe. But at this point I don't think anything productive would come of it anyway, so this will be the last time I mention it.