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Cold war 2.0

Virtual ghost

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The current cover of Der Spiegel:

8ec511ce-f1f6-4947-aba4-5ab3bf550207_w335_r0.7502857142857143_fpx38_fpy23.jpg

"The Traitors - Secret Documents - How the AfD is working for China and Russia"


Germany — National parliament voting intention

But the good sign is that they are loosing support even without recent scandal. Therefore this should speed up the loss and there isn't much time left until elections. In other words there isn't time for recovery.
 

Virtual ghost

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A European Wagenknecht Group?


When we are in these kinds of topics I can post this one as well.
This is a little bit bigger and more more complicated read but if someone is interested the link is here. In other words it seems that she should have enough pawns to create "illiberal left" group in EU parliament after elections. In other words when you see at who she is aiming it is evident that this is going to be Russia friendly group. What is a problem that could persists down the road. Because once a group is established it stays in the system and often gets new members to replace those that lost their seats.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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I couldn't stand it a few years ago, when everyone was obsessed with those stories about the mistreatment of the Uighurs. It seemed extremely racist the way people criticized the Chinese government for that.
 

The Cat

Just a Magic Cat who hangs out at the Crossroads.
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I couldn't stand it a few years ago, when everyone was obsessed with those stories about the mistreatment of the Uighurs. It seemed extremely racist the way people criticized the Chinese government for that.
What could you stand for a few years ago and it can't be about cats or computers. Go.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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What could you stand for a few years ago and it can't be about cats or computers. Go.
Edibles. Booze. Trips to California. Some people I dated briefly. New friends. My job.
 
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Virtual ghost

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France — European Parliament voting intention

Le Pen will evidently come first. With this much of difference I really don't see how this can be turned around in 6 weeks.
Plus you need to add REC and DLF on top of that. What means that hard right is at 40%. In other words they never had the lead of this size over the mainstream (that is getting more and more fragmented). All of this has pretty large implications down the road.
 

Red Herring

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I couldn't stand it a few years ago, when everyone was obsessed with those stories about the mistreatment of the Uighurs. It seemed extremely racist the way people criticized the Chinese government for that.
I have a few thoughts one that but not the time to expand one them right now. Consider this a placeholder.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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I have a few thoughts one that but not the time to expand one them right now. Consider this a placeholder.
D'oh. I need to apologize to you now. That was a clumsy attempt at satire. I never should have made that post; it violated a rule I have to stay away from "character" posts in the interest of humor or raising a broader point. The problem with them is that they confuse people, causing others to assume those are my views. I've made this mistake too many times in my past, including in real life. I don't believe that about China.

Sorry about that.
 

Red Herring

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D'oh. I need to apologize to you now. That was a clumsy attempt at satire. I never should have made that post; it violated a rule I have to stay away from "character" posts in the interest of humor or raising a broader point. The problem with them is that they confuse people, causing others to assume those are my views. I've made this mistake too many times in my past, including in real life. I don't believe that about China.

Sorry about that.
No need to apologize. I'm notoriously bad at recognizing sarcasm online (actually, ever since childhood I have had a hard time telling when to take something literally and when to either read something as sarcasm or as a metaphor). My intuition is that this might be supposed to draw a parallel with accusations of antisemitism when the state of Israel (or its current government) is being criticized. Well, I also have a lot of thoughts (and a shitload of accumulated frustration and despair over mankind in general) on that but for the time being I'll not jump to conclusions and just add my previously announced two cents on China:

Accusations against China should be looked at on a case by case basis as China and its conflict with the West are a pretty complex issue. There probably is a lot of anti-Chinese propaganda and overly negative reporting, especially by American media, but you also can't get away from the fact that the current Chinese government under Xi Jinping has become more and more authoritarian. There is a clear attempt to isolate its people from outside influences and restore traditional Confucian values. Dissent is efficiently stifled. However, it is my impression that Xi and the elite around him are for the most part genuinely looking for an alternative to Western values and the Western system that might work for their country. They are just incredibly scared that if they liberalize things and let in foreign influences the whole country of 1.4 billion people would fall into chaos (and in Chinese culture harmony and stability are extremely important values). They have seen Russia after the end of the cold war and the Arab spring and want to avoid that. It's not like there's this elite exploiting the people and enjoying the highlife while everyine else starves. Life has improved tremendously for the average Chinese citizen over the last generations. The country is free from foreign interference, crime is low, people have not just enough to eat but make a better living than any generation before them, food and public services are readily available and affordable, education is accessable and affordable, people are proud of their country, their history and their culture. Politics aside the country has a lot going for it.

Now to the Uyghurs. Officially China is proudly multiethnic, multicultural and multireligious. Unofficially you are of course supposed to be a non-religious Han who follows Confucian ethics. I think what happened (and to some degree still happens) in Xinjiang is a perfect storm of several factors. There actually were a bunch of islamist terror attacks, there was violent seperatism and the Chinese state reacted the apparently only way they know how - by swiftly moving in and making all sorts of (often preemptive) arrests and forcefully "reeducating" people. From what I could gather, it has been proven beyond a doubt that human rights violations were and likely are taking place there. Probably not always the way and to the extent American media suggests, but yes, clearly this does exists. Stating that is not racist, it's a matter of fact. Stating that, oh, I don't know, Chinese culture is collectivist and not compatible with Western style liberalism and democracy, now that could be considered racist (and has been sucessfully disproven by Taiwan ... which is probably part of why its existence bothers Beijing so much, just like the idea of a free, democratic and fully European Ukraine is a threat to Moscow).

Is there anti-Chinese racism? Definitely. Is there anti-Chinese racism in the reporting about China? Hell, yeah. I mean, just look at the early phase of the Covid pandemic and all the talk about the Wuhan wet market and how, well, these people will eat anything, they're nasty, serves them right, this was bound to happen. I remember reports in Germany during the first days, even before we had our first confirmed Covid case in the country, when people at a soccer match were geting hysterical because there was a (not sure if it was one person or two) Chinese-looking person present and people were afraid they'd all get sick by being in the same space as a Asian looking person. I also get this sense that there is a lot of gloating and sensationalism in the Western (again, especially American) reporting on China.
I think it's only natural that China wants a seat at the table and to be respected as a superpower on par with the West. I just dislike how they go about it. People rejecting that idea outright or seeing it as a threat and something evil per se (just because they are expected to share the cake, not because of how China treats its own citizens or other countries) does reak of racism and a nostalgic colinialist-ish mindset.

Does that mean I am a fan of the Chinese government or the current Chinese way of running thing? Nope. Do I think it is an empire of evil? Nope. Do I know where my loyalty lies when push comes to shove? No question. Does is seriously bother and worry me that public discourse both in the US and in Europe (but again, it seems to be even more of a thing in the US than in Europe, sorry) tends to be extremely manichean and simplistic (it's black and white, good vs evil, us vs them, you're with us or against us, team red or team blue)? You bet!

Guess what, I can be annoyed by certain aspects of several parties without it turning into "bothsideism". That doesn't mean I don't have sympathies and clear leanings. Maybe it's an INTP thing, preferring to see politics as an academic exercise rather than constant foreplay to potential war that could actually get you yourself killed (after all, I wouldn't have to live under Trump (and a summary of his Time magazine interview sent shivers down my spine!!!) and so far the (proto)fascists in my own country are alive and kicking but still held at bay, so it's easy for me to point at the flaws, intellectual laziness and self-righteousness of the American and European left).

tl;dr: Racism probably is a factor in Western criticism of and hostility towards China, but the human rights violations against the Uyghurs are also probably real.
 
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