Please educate me about Ti

[Poki]

What is it that NTPs are missing then? I follow your analogy but I don't know what it explains exactly.



Just because someone has a visceral reaction doesn't mean I think they are stupid. I'm not that judgmental.

ENTP it comes out as devils advocate and INTP it comes out as correcting accurately.

i guess my demeanor downplays IQ and just intelligence in general which keeps them off of a defensive standpoint and actually puts them in a standpoint where they raise up IQ or intelligence with me. and the way that NTPs tend to be more correcting it puts an emphasis on "intelligence"and intelligence gets downplayed...knocked.

 

[ZNP-TBA]

ENTP it comes out as devils advocate and INTP it comes out as correcting accurately.

i guess my demeanor downplays IQ and just intelligence in general which keeps them off of a defensive standpoint and actually puts them in a standpoint where they raise up IQ or intelligence with me. and the way that NTPs tend to be more correcting it puts an emphasis on "intelligence"and intelligence gets downplayed...knocked.

IQ isn't necessarily 'intelligence,' at least not in the colloquial understanding of intelligence as in being opposed to dumb. A low IQ person isn't necessarily dumb in other words.

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

lets take ENFP. they generaly suck at expressing in details what they are thinking. its a high level understanding that in conversion to words get jacked. NTP are much better at the details and will jump all over the "jacked" for accuracy as opposed to understanding. now NTP does not hve that great an ability to see what matters most...just trees everywhere. combine that with "squirel" and they are let chasing squirels with pinpoint accuracy. now...ENFPs love squirels, so they take offense to squirel hunting. as opposed to attacking that they try to fix thier jacked which creates jacked again in another way and NTP goes "squirel"....until either ENFP gets frustrated or NTP thinks they are stupid.

You're saying that IQ doesn't explain all aspects of intelligence. The reason why a lot of NF's dismiss it, is because their type of intelligence isn't measured by IQ tests because it can't be converted in those ways. NTP's generally do well on IQ tests so by doing better on the tests, they think it's the end all be all of intelligence. Therefore, never recognizing NF's areas of expertise.

Is that right?

 

[Cloudpatrol]

By the way, I asked a group of ENFPs what they thought about the notion of an IQ. Every single one of them had something critical to say about it.

How many ENFP's were in this control group?

"3 out of 5 Dentist's recommend Crest" Well ok yes, that's right...only 5 Dentist's were ever consulted...

I couldn't find stats on this topic but take my family as a sampling: FJ Mother convinces Husband to take IQ test and join Mensa, explains why it is not "elitist". N Sister persuades parents to have Brother take IQ test so Teacher's will not mistake his hyperactivity for ADHD.

Same in my experience with ENFPs and feelers in general. They take IQ to mean 'who's smarter' and reject that on a visceral level. Of course that is a very narrow interpretation of IQ. Or they accept IQ as valid but insist on it being purely the result of one's environment rather than genetics. Some people become extremely uncomfortable with the idea that some people have better abilities than others naturally.

In my experience - as an F who values the concept of IQ being measured - I have found that both F and T's express the viewpoints you allude to above.

I don't think the bold is type related (if included in the context of the earlier statements).

categorization and abstraction is an art. something designed to help us as a society through reductionism. i dont see it as science.

The word science can be subjective. ie. "He has computer programming down to a real science".

However for the sake of this discussion let's take the word at it's base meaning:

noun
The intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behavior of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.
synonyms: branch of knowledge, body of knowledge/information, area of study

Correct me if I am wrong But, does that not apply to the process I described to PG?:

It's possible to rationally deduce. i.e. With the link I provided. Forecast or hypothesize the value of said information. Experiment with it and examine what results. Practical application of looking at ALL the functions

 

[pinkgraffiti]

By the way, I asked a group of ENFPs what they thought about the notion of an IQ. Every single one of them had something critical to say about it.

Go stick pencils in your eyeballs.

 

[Poki]

You're saying that IQ doesn't explain all aspects of intelligence. The reason why a lot of NF's dismiss it, is because their type of intelligence isn't measured by IQ tests because it can't be converted in those ways. NTP's generally do well on IQ tests so by doing better on the tests, they think it's the end all be all of intelligence. Therefore, never recognizing NF's areas of expertise.

Is that right?

yes, in a way. but the visceral is caused by this mentality...not directly...but the attitude it creates which even if not diretly said creates this image. its why woth some people they may try, but until the attitude changes they still face the same issues its just not "direct". types generally care about different things, even if within the same situation care and focus is different.

 

[Poki]

You're saying that IQ doesn't explain all aspects of intelligence. The reason why a lot of NF's dismiss it, is because their type of intelligence isn't measured by IQ tests because it can't be converted in those ways. NTP's generally do well on IQ tests so by doing better on the tests, they think it's the end all be all of intelligence. Therefore, never recognizing NF's areas of expertise.

Is that right?

what happens if we start to define what is by what we created. you have just removed cause and effect and stated, this wil always be and that alone cememts the cause and effect. you create your own static world that applies to anyone who shares your situation solidfying it even further. welcome to one of the biggest struggles of MBTI.

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

what happens if we start to define what is by what we created. you have just removed cause and effect and stated, this wil always be and that alone cememts the cause and effect. you create your own static world that applies to anyone who shares your situation solidfying it even further. welcome to one of the biggest struggles of MBTI.

I think I understand this post as a stand-alone but cannot connect what you say here with previous comments on IQ.

 

[Poki]

I think I understand this post as a stand-alone but cannot connect what you say here with previous comments on IQ.

because it ties back to the original post i responded to.

Same in my experience with ENFPs and feelers in general. They take IQ to mean 'who's smarter' and reject that on a visceral level.

its a cause and effect that applies to all, not just feelers in general.

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

because it ties back to the original post i responded to.



its a cause and effect that applies to all, not just feelers in general.

Ok. Thanks. I didn't know what part exactly you were referencing. I got it.