Mental Illness and Wisdom

[Raffaella]

How is that romanticising mental illness? Those with greater struggles often are forced to dig deeper to find meaning and truth.

This doesn't happen to everyone.

Going through hardship and dark times builds empathy, perspective, and strength. It can also break you down to rock bottom before you get to that point. Some people never get there, but those who do are further along than the ones who were never forced to find meaning and hope in the midst of hell.

Not for everyone and not all the time. Not everyone experiences depression the same way, some people recover through medication and never experience the enlightenment that others do. Please don't generalise.

 

[five sounds]

[MENTION=20828]Deceptive[/MENTION] I explicitly said "some people never get there."

I'm the first one to say that every individual has a unique experience. But you seem to be discounting the rewards that come from working through such a deep and difficult issues.

Edit: I don't think those who recover through medication are exempt from gaining wisdom from their experiences. Not one bit.

 

[Raffaella]

[MENTION=20828]Deceptive[/MENTION] I explicitly said "some people never get there."

I'm the first one to say that every individual has a unique experience. But you seem to be discounting the rewards that come from working through such a deep and difficult issues.

I'm not discounting rewards from working through depression.I recognise that. My stance is that not everyone has the opportunity to work through that. Not everyone has an experience in which they can work through it, some people move on as if their lives hadn't changed.

 

[Totenkindly]

In context of the ongoing exchange here, and based on my own experiences, yes, it's always very textured to the degree I can't really comment on the things I've experienced in terms of "summing them up."

There are things I learned from dealing with chronic depression and anxiety (and I was medicated and treated as an outpatient) that I am grateful to have learned; at the same time, those were some of the most horrible periods of my life. So I find I can't sum them up into a bumper-sticker slogan. They were both remarkably helpful and horrible at once; I wish I could have learned what I did in some other way, but I'm not sure what that way would have been... and it's never "over," it's ongoing. Dealing with such things is still part of my life, even if I'm no longer under medical or therapeutic treatement; the resonances echo onwards through time.

So I can't bring myself to glamorize it or criticize it, it was just (and remains) a series of experiences that contributed to whom I am and will continue to be a part of me.

 

[prplchknz]

In context of the ongoing exchange here, and based on my own experiences, yes, it's always very textured to the degree I can't really comment on the things I've experienced in terms of "summing them up."

There are things I learned from dealing with chronic depression and anxiety (and I was medicated and treated as an outpatient) that I am grateful to have learned; at the same time, those were some of the most horrible periods of my life. So I find I can't sum them up into a bumper-sticker slogan. They were both remarkably helpful and horrible at once; I wish I could have learned what I did in some other way, but I'm not sure what that way would have been... and it's never "over," it's ongoing. Dealing with such things is still part of my life, even if I'm no longer under medical or therapeutic treatement; the resonances echo onwards through time.

So I can't bring myself to glamorize it or criticize it, it was just (and remains) a series of experiences that contributed to whom I am and will continue to be a part of me.

yeah but you can gain wisdom from any experience, not just emotional and brain ones. so is it the mental illness that's make you wiser or the fact that you have to work through/figure something out that is making you wiser?

 

[Totenkindly]

yeah but you can gain wisdom from any experience, not just emotional and brain ones. so is it the mental illness that's make you wiser or the fact that you have to work through/figure something out that is making you wiser?

It could be either or both, depending on the specifics. For example, sometimes an "illness" reveals life to you from a certain perspective, or exposes some kind of life experience to you, that you might not have gained from a different "illness."

 

[prplchknz]

It could be either or both, depending on the specifics.

yeah I guess mental illness is too broad of a term. but I still think a lot of the wisdom is gained through the suffering of the illness and working through the shit. and each experience we have we can gain wisdom, we usually don't cuz humans are stubborn and think"if i keep banging my head against this wall there will be a hole" and perhaps depending on what the wall is made of (like plaster more than likely) (brick you'll probably get brain damage and end up really stupid)

 

[Totenkindly]

yeah I guess mental illness is too broad of a term. but I still think a lot of the wisdom is gained through the suffering of the illness and working through the shit. and each experience we have we can gain wisdom, we usually don't cuz humans are stubborn and think"if i keep banging my head against this wall there will be a hole" and perhaps depending on what the wall is made of (like plaster more than likely) (brick you'll probably get brain damage and end up really stupid)

We can learn from experiences involving mental illness, certainly... but there are people who manage to do fine without experiencing it as well. And knowledge is always two-edged. Maybe someone might not have so much detailed life experience that allows them to process life in a more complex way, if they don't suffer; at the same time, is suffering (and this degree of suffering) mandatory towards experiencing a fulfilling life or necessary in order to gain relevant knowledge? Is being more innocent of such things going to detract from someone's quality of life? I don't know. It seems complex and somewhat specific to the individual.

 

[prplchknz]

We can learn from experiences involving mental illness, certainly... but there are people who manage to do fine without experiencing it as well. And knowledge is always two-edged. Maybe someone might not have so much detailed life experience that allows them to process life in a more complex way, if they don't suffer; at the same time, is suffering (and this degree of suffering) mandatory towards experiencing a fulfilling life or necessary in order to gain relevant knowledge? Is being more innocent of such things going to detract from someone's quality of life? I don't know. It seems complex and somewhat specific to the individual.

yeah that's sort of what i'm saying. but not really i'm not saying that mental illness causes wisdom. at all, I'm saying that experience does and a non-mentally ill person can suffer great lost work through it and be just as wise as someone who had depression

 

[AphroditeGoneAwry]

I think it bears mentioning that God does not want us to suffer. That suffering is not the goal, nor a necessary means to an ends. And God does not want us to learn the 'hard way', which is the very reason He gives us many laws in the bible.

That being said, people hurt each other in this world. And we are forced to learn from it whether we want to or not. If we but turn to God, He will bring beauty out of ashes.

 

[Tiltyred]

I had a breakdown last year about this time and was unable to work for four months. I was diagnosed Bipolar II with OCD and GAD. I was so happy to be properly diagnosed for the first time in my life, and given medicine that actually works. I don't mind telling my diagnosis, including to my employers. But on coming back to work, what I experience is not stigma but a horrific lack of compassion. I find people just don't know anything about mental illness. The attitude I get is something like "Why don't you just act right?"

A friend gave me a kit from 23andMe as a gift, and I enjoyed looking at the genealogy aspect -- then I downloaded my raw data to Promethease, which is a free site that gives the medical information for your genome. Page after page after page after page of disorders on the autism/bipolar/schizophrenic continuum. There is no question that this is genetic. Which makes me a lean very hard on the Nature side of any Nature versus Nurture debate. I almost feel that psychologists and counselors do a disservice because they dissipate energy that could be going to chemically treating what is an actual physical "disability." You can talk therapy this stuff endlessly, but really nothing changes until you receive the proper medical support, which has to come from a psychiatrist. For this reason, I think it's cruel to assert that there is no genetic component. It's more of the "why don't you just act right" attitude. The answer is, "Because that's not how I'm wired."

 

[OneLovelyAdventure]

I've had mental illnesses since I was a little girl. I've been on SSRIs since I was seven to combat OCD and GAD, followed by a bout of major depression and panic disorder my sophomore year of high school. I also spent two and a half years with an eating disorder. And I consider myself much more capable of understanding others. Having fought through mental disorders has made me feel able to conquer anything. I think people with mental illness should definitely be heard and that they possess more wisdom than most. I've met some remarkable people with mental illness with insights that have astounded me.

 

[Bush]

Yeah, going through some atypical experience can offer a different perspective. Not better, but different. And that perspective, when given a voice and combined with more 'normal' perspectives, then separating the wheat from the chaff in the whole thing, leads to greater collective wisdom.

Going through hell and back gives one something to offer, both to themselves and to other people.

 

[Pionart]

I wanted therapy to help me overcome issues. Instend I had medication forced on me. It's easy to force a pill on someone. It's harder to teach them to deal on their own. I hate the mental health system.