Socionics quadras - How one behavioral group experiences another.

[Entropic]

Oh come on, you know you wanna

No, I edited my post. Reread, k?

 

[Amargith]

No, I edited my post. Reread, k?

Ehhhmmm, I'm IEI-Fe, from my limited studying. Ya know, from your favorite quadra?

Can you explain what Ne-style of the ExI type means? Coz I'm still familiarising myself with the other types

 

[Entropic]

Ehhhmmm, I'm IEI-Fe, from my limited studying. Ya know, from your favorite quadra?

Can you explain what Ne-style of the ExI type means? Coz I'm still familiarising myself with the other types

I edited again.

Well, it's just possibility-seeking, kind of like, this person seems to be angry, what could the cause be for that? Maybe something bad happened to him?

 

[Amargith]

I edited again.

Well, it's just possibility-seeking, kind of like, this person seems to be angry, what could the cause be for that? Maybe something bad happened to him?

So you are saying I'm displaying this behaviour with you right now?


edit: and stop editing

Edit2: I didn't say stop posting

Edit3: Crap. I so hoped I would be able to hook you and steal your brains

 

[entropie]

I edited again.

Well, it's just possibility-seeking, kind of like, this person seems to be angry, what could the cause be for that? Maybe something bad happened to him?

One word of advice: if enfp's jump your back and get all clingy, then you have to drive them into positions in which they would have to say no and by that hurt your emotions. I for instance get all sexual and try to date them, in that moment they becoming charming and run away and by that you get rid of them.

So you are saying I'm displaying this behaviour with you right now?


edit: and stop editing

Edit2: I didn't say stop posting

Edit3: Crap. I so hoped I would be able to hook you and steal your brains

You can read up on the stuff here: http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=Wikisocion_home

there's a lot of intresting socionics stuff. Much of that stuff I already discussed in the forums but intrest was pretty low so far. I guess in the light of the systematic aproach mbti has and the safety net this gives young adults, its kinda disturbing if you have a second system next to it, equally systematic and contextually right. Many people dismissed it so far.

I wouldnt read it with the approach to see whats right or whats wrong, I read mbti and socionics against my own experience or, when I lack experience, I build new experience by checking the things socionics or mbti says in reality. This tho a way you prolly can only do age 25+.

 

[Amargith]

One word of advice: if enfp's jump your back and get all clingy, then you have to drive them into positions in which they would have to say no and by that hurt your emotions. I for instance get all sexual and try to date them, in that moment they becoming charming and run away and by that you get rid of them.

Hey! You're an evil, evil man, entropie

Fine, I'll go back to my corner *sulks*

You can read up on the stuff here: http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=Wikisocion_home

there's a lot of intresting socionics stuff. Much of that stuff I already discussed in the forums but intrest was pretty low so far. I guess in the light of the systematic aproach mbti has and the safety net this gives young adults, its kinda disturbing if you have a second system next to it, equally systematic and contextually right. Many people dismissed it so far.

I wouldnt read it with the approach to see whats right or whats wrong, I read mbti and socionics against my own experience or, when I lack experience, I build new experience by checking the things socionics or mbti says in reality. This tho a way you prolly can only do age 25+.

Ohhh cool, thanks for the link! Yeah I have heard around these parts about socionics before, but only recently got interested after some people were elaborately discussing it on vent. Then I saw some of the old gang from other forums talk about it, and figured, welp, let's see if we can get a convo going about this and see what its all about, as I do find it a fascinating, albeit slightly confusing system, at least at first.

I take it you're ILE, entropie?

 

[entropie]

I take it you're ILE, entropie?

Yes pretty much. Socionics test give me LIE and mbti tests INTJ, but I guess thats only because I cultivated Te job- and cultural-wise. I myself dont feel like that and most people who know me privately would prolly agree.

if you read up obn socionics make a thread about it, I'd like to discuss it.

 

[Amargith]

Yes pretty much. Socionics test give me LIE and mbti tests INTJ, but I guess thats only because I cultivated Te job- and cultural-wise. I myself dont feel like that and most people who know me privately would prolly agree.

if you read up obn socionics make a thread about it, I'd like to discuss it.

Why don't you just join in the thread creating madness? Let's take the forum by storm to achieve Socionics momentum!

 

[jixmixfix]

I love Betas. Especially the dramatic/campy/fabulous EIEs and IEIs <3

LSIs are okay to work with, if a little rigid. I've worked with 2 other SLEs and it was a miracle it didn't turn into a fight.

Edit: I love the link that [MENTION=10653]SuchIrony[/MENTION] posted, because of the correlations between quadras and classical elements.

I hate Betas *shivers*. Their imagination runs rampant and they are very emotionally expressive. They are also pretty impersonal and are too passive or too forceful.

 

[entropie]

Why don't you just join in the thread creating madness? Let's take the forum by storm to achieve Socionics momentum!

I ended reading socionics when it gave me that the relationship to my gf is one of mirage. There was much truth in what they said about mirage relationships, but I wasnt sure how much of that is realistic and how much I am interpreting into it, because I am frustrated about a thing at the moment.

Socionics gives you 8 functions, they are touchably dominant in an individual as the order suggests. Additionally they are put into 8 blocks:

Block 1 - Ego
1st function - Leading function (your spontaneous first reaction function, you feel well with)
2nd function - Creative Function (used to synthesize what comes from the 1st function into a sellable product)

Block 2 - Super-Ego
3rd function - Role function (your role in society)
4th function - Vulnerable function (Point of Least Resistance, your sensitive function)

Block 3 - Super ID
5th function - Suggestive function (it's the function you are not good at, but like other people being good at. Subconciously you seek out for information or people using that function. prolonged experience makes you feel good)
6th function - Mobilizing function (is the function that activates you to move, external help here is appreciated but too much help is seen as excessive)

Block 4 - ID Block
7th function - Ignoring function (it is the rival to the base function (1st one) and makes you react with aversion subconciously)
8th function - Demonstrative function (A person uses this element mainly as a kind of game, or to ridicule those who he thinks take it too seriously)

Here's an example with my type:

1st: Ne: Thats me
2nd: Ti: Thats my products, hobbies, job, etc.
3rd: Se: Thats the entp society role: pornstar and connaisseur par exellance [which he is not ]
4th: Fi: Sensitive function, talking about self is no problem for entps, but talking about real inner emotions is
5th: Si: Entps like people who remember the past or who have proven methods and algorithms to do things, thats because they themselves rarely remember last day and forget everything they ever learnt 10 days later
6th: Fe: Dom Fe people mobilize entps, if we are on a big party with a gracious host, we are motivated and start to be hosts ourselves to the extent of our abilities, excessive display of social rituals like the french do for example, would be too much at times
7th: Ni: I personally think most INJ's are insane
8th: Te: entps usage of Te in discussions is well known. Te would be what the lawyer type would use to organize his creative function Ti to prove a point. We ridicule tho people who make to-do lists cause somehow we are afraid of such things

I hope that gives you an idea for the start

 

[FDG]

Among other quadras I usually get along best with alphas. I think the atmosphere in both democratic and aristocratic quadras is similar, when it comes to "light" socializing.

 

[Amargith]

Among other quadras I usually get along best with alphas. I think the atmosphere in both democratic and aristocratic quadras is similar, when it comes to "light" socializing.

You're beta, right?

 

[FDG]

You're beta, right?

Nope, ENTj thus gamma...

 

[Entropic]

So you are saying I'm displaying this behaviour with you right now?

No? I however see you kind of 7 teasing?

edit: and stop editing

Edit2: I didn't say stop posting

You didn't but I don't spend my entire day in front of the computer or I pretend I'm not.

Edit3: Crap. I so hoped I would be able to hook you and steal your brains

I like my brain very much tyvm.

[MENTION=4109]entropie[/MENTION], I am not sure what you mean with that. I know two IEEs, one is pretty much confirmed, both of them enneagram 8s so unless they are in lust-mode, I wouldn't say they are clingy.

Also regarding your type, you need to look into your dominant function. ILI and LIE only really appear similar if you are ILI-Te subtype so you are more likely to express your Te or LIE-Ni subtype. I would also stress that the latter is a much more introverted type whereas ILI-Te can be quite extroverted. The logical explanation for this of course is that our energy is more directed towards introversion if LIE-Ni since Ni is an introverted function so we are less concerned about the external and ILI-Te types are more concerned since they seek to engage ways in the external world to activate their Te-creative. I for example see this with myself too being EII-Ne where my creative function is extroverted so I can be rather engaging with the world around me when I feel like it.

Also, a way to discern your type would be to study your PoLR and what you seek. Do you seek Se or Fi? Hard to mistake the two.

[MENTION=857]FDG[/MENTION] I am not sure I agree that there's little difference in light socialization between quadra types. I find that even during "light" socializing, Fe-valuing types (alpha, beta) are more prone to laughter and express their emotions. The way they get to know people is also somewhat different in that Fe-valuing types are more concerned about you as a person than they are themselves so a very interested Fe-valuing type can barrage a person with factual questions e.g. where do you live, what do you work with, are you married and so on. Fi-valuing types (gamma, delta) can of course also ask questions but I find that Fi-valuing types tend to in general use themselves more as a referential point during conversation by explaining their personal experiences (and thus feelings) about something e.g. I really don't like my work, my boss is so bossy! and so on.

 

[FDG]

Dunno. Those are my observations so I mean, take them as they are...perhaps I pay attention to other things? I see delta and beta as almost always forming super tight knit groups where it's hard to feel welcome.

 

[Entropic]

Dunno. Those are my observations so I mean, take them as they are...perhaps I pay attention to other things? I see delta and beta as almost always forming super tight knit groups where it's hard to feel welcome.

But if you are an LIE, why would you see this as a problem? You're Fi-valuing so you would inherently also prefer this kind of socialization. I mean, I can see what you are saying about delta and gamma groups being more closely knit and not as welcome to outsiders once well-established, but I think those groups are also likely to welcome "outsiders" as long as you've given a "passport" by being friends to someone who is a member of that group.

I see myself doing this a lot especially with the way I organize the various Skype groups I participate in, one of them being my personal creation. You only get invited to the group if you know me and I deem your presence in the group as acceptable. You need an invitation. I wouldn't say that I have ever discriminated anyone though (I for example invited to beta types and there are two alphas currently present) but as long as you are a cool person I think gamma and delta types can be quite welcoming. We're just a bit more round-about because we don't feel concerned if someone is an outsider or not. We simply assume the person will seek out the group if they desire so. Participation in the group is definitely not necessary and delta and gamma groups also tend to break up and reshape a lot. Having individuals leave for prolonged periods of time aren't strange at all. You only stay as long as you feel like staying.

 

[Kierva]

I hate Betas *shivers*. Their imagination runs rampant and they are very emotionally expressive. They are also pretty impersonal and are too passive or too forceful.

that's the point >.>

 

[Such Irony]

Cthulu? I know that guy. Maybe we can speak, after all.

Like I said though, I could be SLI. Which would be your quadra. I'd prefer to just stick to MBTI though.

You don't seem to express socionics Se from what I can tell. An Se base type would most likely have misuderstood what I did up there and not see the connection. I could also see an argument for LII? I do think you are Ne-Si valuing though, the way you went off-tangent with the "alien speak". And Se type would interpret what I said in a more literal manner and probably ask me about different languages such as body language etc.

Haha, I ditched MBTI in favor for socionics some time ago. Socionics makes more sense and my type accurracy is quite accurate in socionics. It just gets type down better than MBTI does. I'll probably figure out your type soon enough using intertype and IM after seeing a few more posts anyway

I don't see Se valuing or beta either. He seems very 'chill' rather than intense, which I'd associate more with Si/Ne valuing quadras. SLI is a good bet. Or SEI.

Also, are you an Ne subtype? I find that ExI-Fi ones can be SO stingy. I am totally not thinking of Maritsa on 16types. Who I should add, doesn't think I'm an EII at all.

I used to be on that forum. She typed me once as SEE. LOL!

Ehm, slow is not really a part of my vocabulary when I'm interested in something. I think I should just blame it on that I'm a 5 and I just like to think in technical complexities

I totally relate.

I ended reading socionics when it gave me that the relationship to my gf is one of mirage. There was much truth in what they said about mirage relationships, but I wasnt sure how much of that is realistic and how much I am interpreting into it, because I am frustrated about a thing at the moment.

Socionics gives you 8 functions, they are touchably dominant in an individual as the order suggests. Additionally they are put into 8 blocks:

Block 1 - Ego
1st function - Leading function (your spontaneous first reaction function, you feel well with)
2nd function - Creative Function (used to synthesize what comes from the 1st function into a sellable product)

Block 2 - Super-Ego
3rd function - Role function (your role in society)
4th function - Vulnerable function (Point of Least Resistance, your sensitive function)

Block 3 - Super ID
5th function - Suggestive function (it's the function you are not good at, but like other people being good at. Subconciously you seek out for information or people using that function. prolonged experience makes you feel good)
6th function - Mobilizing function (is the function that activates you to move, external help here is appreciated but too much help is seen as excessive)

Block 4 - ID Block
7th function - Ignoring function (it is the rival to the base function (1st one) and makes you react with aversion subconciously)
8th function - Demonstrative function (A person uses this element mainly as a kind of game, or to ridicule those who he thinks take it too seriously)

Here's an example with my type:

1st: Ne: Thats me
2nd: Ti: Thats my products, hobbies, job, etc.
3rd: Se: Thats the entp society role: pornstar and connaisseur par exellance [which he is not ]
4th: Fi: Sensitive function, talking about self is no problem for entps, but talking about real inner emotions is
5th: Si: Entps like people who remember the past or who have proven methods and algorithms to do things, thats because they themselves rarely remember last day and forget everything they ever learnt 10 days later
6th: Fe: Dom Fe people mobilize entps, if we are on a big party with a gracious host, we are motivated and start to be hosts ourselves to the extent of our abilities, excessive display of social rituals like the french do for example, would be too much at times
7th: Ni: I personally think most INJ's are insane
8th: Te: entps usage of Te in discussions is well known. Te would be what the lawyer type would use to organize his creative function Ti to prove a point. We ridicule tho people who make to-do lists cause somehow we are afraid of such things

I hope that gives you an idea for the start

I'm not totally sure of my type but I'm leaning towards INTj (LII)

1st: Ti. I can see how that works.
2nd: Ne. Yep.

3rd: I can see how Fi plays a role function. I often feel pressured into saying the polite thing or doing the socially correct thing.
4th: I could be Se vulnerable. I have issues with forcing others to do things or knowing how much force is appropriate to apply. However, I don't relate well to the whole spineless wimp thing.

5th: Fe. I can see how this fits.
6th: Si. I don't know. I don't really seek much help with Si and don't see how it activates me.

7th: Te. I see it more as complementing Ti rather than a rival. I have a hard time knowing if I value Ti or Te because I seem to value them both.
8th: Ni. I'm not aware of making a game out out it. I kind of ridicule anytime someone takes any function too seriously whether it's Ni or something else.

 

[Kierva]

What's your sociotype?

Anyway, like the OP, I found it immensely helpful to use the quadra values in order to pinpoint my sociotype as I first looked into LII and ILI (because I score as an INTP in MBTI) but as I researched further, I realized I'm not an alpha or a gamma. Funnily enough, on immediate reading, I did not even see myself as a delta and it was the quadra I thought was the furthest away from me and I identified the most with alpha and beta. How ironic, especially the beta part.

It became obvious over time that I'm as delta as they come and I'm most definitely an EII-Ne subtype. I personally have the greatest difficulty getting along with beta types in general which makes sense because beta is the quadra the most functionally opposed my quadra (delta). Some IEIs are all right, especially if Ni subtype, but overall I find that the way we view communication and interaction is too different. They promote this exurbant atmosphere with laughter and jokes which just annoys me to no end and I guess me sitting in my corner and apparing gloomy to them is equally annoying. And let's not even get started when they decide that I need to cheer up and be included in all the fun... JUST NO. I decide on my own when I'm included or not, thank you!

I really don't get along with LSIs and SLEs at all due to the Se and Ti. It's like talking to an alien from another planet. We don't speak the same language at all. With beta NFs I can work with them as long as we share a common goal or interest.

I should add that the laughter and fun aspect of alphas really annoy me as well. I for example think my cousin's father is an ILE and his need to always be funny and tell jokes and laugh loudly at social gatherings really irks me at some point. There is only so much time for laughter. I'd rather discuss what happens at the end of the universe than how funny it was that Pete did [insert random joke] thing.

So if I have to rate the quadras whose company I enjoy it's delta > gamma > alpha > beta. Gammas can be great although ESIs can annoy me, same with SEEs (Se PoLR). I know quite a few ILIs and some LIEs I get along with great even though we don't always agree due to differences in perception. I have yet to meet more people out of my own quadra. I know some IEEs and a person I suspect is an LSE but maybe it's just me, but where the fuck are all deltas?!

Does it matter what my sociotype is? I'll give you a clue: I get along with LSIs and SLEs VERY well, and it's like we speak the same language. One of my best friends is an LSI-Se 6w5 SX/SP. We share similar views on all types of things and we think alike.

As for you beta haters out there... that's the point of Betas! We're supposed to be loud and exuberant -- derogatory raillery, witty banter and sexual euphemisms (among many others) are what we like to talk about. And it's not so much about what we're doing, it's the mood of whole activity. I'm not the one to drink but I'll fuckin drink if the people don't suck and if the people can give me a good time.

It's not about what we're doing, it's about how we're with and how they make us feel, and how we can express ourselves freely with these people.

I can't express my feelings very well. I've been accused of being cold, arrogant and calculative by my peers and coworkers. But with the right people, they bring out the retarded clapping seal in me. Those are the kinds of people I want to be with, the ones that can make Vetani from a paranoid and aloof hermit into a retarded clapping seal.

Because it makes me happy.

 

[jixmixfix]

that's the point >.>

I'm delta and I think deltas and betas have trouble getting along.