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2020 Democratic Party primary thread

Doctor Cringelord

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It's important to prepare for the worst case scenario, which is that Biden (a true Republican-lite candidate) wins the nomination. What do you think will the American people be subjected to in that time between then and when he probably loses the general election?

Here are a few of my guesses:

  1. We need to return to normalcy. Normalcy, in this case, meant wages staying stagnant (not that Trump has done anything to help the situation), but hey, profits on Wall Street skyrocketed, so everything is fine... this has been the case for all of my adult life by the way in "good" economic times... and the commentators act mystified about why productivity and profits have grown but wages haven't.
  2. We need a robust foreign policy and be a world leader again, Trump has weakened all of us by not taking an active role on the world stage.
  3. Free trade is an undeniable good that should never be questioned.
  4. Donald Trump has tarnished the institution of the Presidency. We need someone who will value norms.

I think Sanders is very good at addressing bad idea 1 and 3. Gabbard is good at addressing bad idea 2. Both are good at addressing bad idea 4, because the candidates themselves are represent concepts outside the treasured "norms." (If the norms were so great and valuable, Trump wouldn't have become President in the first place. The electoral college is a "norm.")

It's important that Sanders and Gabbard (and Marianne, and maybe Yang) get as much airtime as possible, because this helps create counters to all of the crap Biden will be spewing if he wins the nomination. People need to realize that alternatives to shit exist.

I think it was you who said we should worry about repeating 2004 rather than 1972? If Biden is nominee, it could very well be a repeat of 2004. The republicans will of course hammer Biden on every little thing he's backtracked on or every view/position he's evolved over the years. They will bring up his opposition to busing in the 70s and play the "dems are the real racists" card again.

I also don't see Biden doing a great job of luring the mythical swing voter.

Marianne is far less of a loony than she's been portrayed.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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I think it was you who said we should worry about repeating 2004 rather than 1972? If Biden is nominee, it could very well be a repeat of 2004. The republicans will of course hammer Biden on every little thing he's backtracked on or every view/position he's evolved over the years. They will bring up his opposition to busing in the 70s and play the "dems are the real racists" card again.

I also don't see Biden doing a great job of luring the mythical swing voter.

Marianne is far less of a loony than she's been portrayed.

I'll just echo all of this.
 

ceecee

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I think it was you who said we should worry about repeating 2004 rather than 1972? If Biden is nominee, it could very well be a repeat of 2004. The republicans will of course hammer Biden on every little thing he's backtracked on or every view/position he's evolved over the years. They will bring up his opposition to busing in the 70s and play the "dems are the real racists" card again.

I also don't see Biden doing a great job of luring the mythical swing voter.

Marianne is far less of a loony than she's been portrayed.

I heard her interviewed before the debates and this was the conclusion I came to as well.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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I’ll fanboy a little more for Tulsi. One of the reasons I think she’s levelheaded is the way she deals with sometimes hostile hosts when appearing on Fox News. She’s probably appeared on Fox more than any other dem running and has yet to lose her cool or stumble when they’ve attempted to trip her up. I think she’d make Donnie look like the spoiled narcissist he is if they ever debated.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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I’ll fanboy a little more for Tulsi. One of the reasons I think she’s levelheaded is the way she deals with sometimes hostile hosts when appearing on Fox News. She’s probably appeared on Fox more than any other dem running and has yet to lose her cool or stumble when they’ve attempted to trip her up. I think she’d make Donnie look like the spoiled narcissist he is if they ever debated.

Remember when Bernie made that appearance and he kicked all kinds of ass? Not sure why people see that kind of thing as a negative. Isn't this what the virtues of "electable" candidates like Biden are supposed to be?

Tulsi was a combat medic. I'm sure a debate is nothing compared to that.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Remember when Bernie made that appearance and he kicked all kinds of ass? Not sure why people see that kind of thing as a negative. Isn't this what the virtues of "electable" candidates like Biden are supposed to be?

Yeah, wasn't he the first (or one of the first) to go on Fox this year? I think that's the key. Fox is a right wing echo chamber, but that doesn't mean some of these candidates won't get through to some of those people watching at home. I really don't know why this is seen as a negative.

Also, I don't understand what people mean when they use the term "electability". They put too much emphasis on this as if it were a hard metric, when it's highly subjective. I remember pundits saying Obama was less electable than Hillary in 2008.
 

Julius_Van_Der_Beak

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Yeah, wasn't he the first (or one of the first) to go on Fox this year? I think that's the key. Fox is a right wing echo chamber, but that doesn't mean some of these candidates won't get through to some of those people watching at home. I really don't know why this is seen as a negative.

Also, I don't understand what people mean when they use the term "electability". They put too much emphasis on this as if it were a hard metric, when it's highly subjective. I remember pundits saying Obama was less electable than Hillary in 2008.

That's because pundits are overpaid morons.
 

ceecee

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Yeah, wasn't he the first (or one of the first) to go on Fox this year? I think that's the key. Fox is a right wing echo chamber, but that doesn't mean some of these candidates won't get through to some of those people watching at home. I really don't know why this is seen as a negative.

Also, I don't understand what people mean when they use the term "electability". They put too much emphasis on this as if it were a hard metric, when it's highly subjective. I remember pundits saying Obama was less electable than Hillary in 2008.

I think Bernie going on Fox was a great idea. Obviously his message went over very well but people forget how many primary votes he got in red states. The "electability" thing pisses me off. The DNC is terrible but the DCCC is worse and groups like Emily's List makes you want to bang your head against the wall but pundits are the worst. "We've Got People" by Ryan Grim explained it really clearly why they have a fetish about electablity.
 

SearchingforPeace

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Why the Rich Want to Bury Bernie, the Not-Really-Socialist | Black Agenda Report

.....

San Francisco City College political scientist Rick Baum’s analysis of Federal Reserve Board data shows that the top one percent of the population has increased its share of the national wealth from 23.3% in 1989 to 31.1% in the first quarter of 2019 – a boost of over 33 percent in just a generation and a half. Meanwhile, beginning in 2014 under President Obama, the share of wealth held by the bottom 90 percent dwindled to less than that amassed by the One Percent for the first time since 1989.

The neoliberal policies imposed by both halves of the corporate electoral duopoly over the last 30 years have been highly profitable to the top 1%, and especially to the billionaire class, whose ranks have increased from 55 in 1989 to 412 in 2012,the mid-point of Barack Obama’s presidency, to 609 in 2018 . Baum’s stats show the “average person in the top 1% holds net wealth that is worth 1,200 times the net wealth of an average person among the poorest 50% of the U.S. population.”

Possibly even more disturbing, is that the top one-tenth of one percent (.1%) of the population -- households making $2.757 million a year -- now number almost 200,000 families, a cohort big enough to create and inhabit a large and coherent social world of its own. From their rich enclaves in every state of the country, this formidable “base” of truly wealthy folks effectively dictate the politics of their regions for the benefit of themselves and the oligarchs at the top of the pyramid.

.....

Sanders’ “socialism” is no threat to the rule of capital, or to the 200,000 multimillionaire families – except for grossly overpaid doctors and pharmaceutical and insurance executives that might be wiped out by Medicare for All. But even enactment of the full Sanders wish list would leave the oligarchs owning the commanding heights of the economy, and free to gobble up as much more of the national assets as they wish. The reason the ruler’s have decreed “anybody but Bernie” is that Sanders’ (and to a lesser perceived degree, Warren’s) campaign proposals challenge the austerity regime that has been relentlessly erected since the 1970s precisely to set American workers and the whole capitalist world on a Race to the Bottom, in which each year brings lower living standards and more insecurity to the population at large. The obscene increases in wealth inequality are the desired result and true essence of austerity, which is designed to force working people to be happy to take any job, at any wage, under any conditions because, in the words of Margaret Thatcher, Ronald Reagan’s mentor, “There is no alternative.”

.....

Barack Obama was a champion of austerity who succeeded in imposing its harshest discipline on Black America by virtue of his race and the false hopes of his strongest supporters. Obama not only oversaw the most dramatic evisceration of Black wealth in history during the Great Recession, but his economic “recovery” was purely a consolidation of wealth and power for the oligarchs and a drastic degradation of the life prospects for almost everyone else. Fully 94 percent of the 10 million new jobs created under Obama were temporary, contract positions, or part-time "gig" jobs, according to a study by economists Lawrence Katz, of Harvard University, and Alan Krueger at Princeton. This “son of Africa” did his corporate duty to reduce U.S. workers to the insecurity and desperation that the global capitalist ruling class is imposing on every acre of the world under their control.

....

They would rather the Democrats lose to Trump than win with Bernie. Should Sanders secure the nomination, the moneyed classes will immediately set about creating a “centrist” party to preserve the austerity regime, “grandfathering” in current “moderate” Democrats, en mass.

In other words, leftish anti-austerity forces can get their own party, either by inheriting the Democratic shell after a Sanders victory, or by abandoning the Party after witnessing the full menu of dirty tricks the rulers and their minions will inflict on Sanders this season.
 

Red Memories

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Of all the candidates, I like Tulsi Gabbard the best and feel she is a good line between the progression. I fear however just based on everything Warren, Biden, or Harris are just going to be the automatics.
 

Doctor Cringelord

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Who do you think will win this and why ? (make a educated guess)

Ugh, probably Kamala or Biden. More likely the former because she ticks what dems will think are the right boxes.

Primary voters will be convinced either of them have the best shot at defeating Trump
 
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