2020 Democratic Party primary thread

[Deprecator]

So this is the minority faculty member that y'all think is precise, sincere, super intelligent and most likely to be our next president?

Vegas odds, wall street projections, and a number of foreign governments are already bracing for another Trump victory. And this makes sense; if he can win as an outsider and underdog then surely he's only that much more favored as a sitting president during a booming economy, and that's to say nothing of all of the campaign promises he's followed through on.

I don't think it matters much who gets the DNC nomination, though as far as saving face is concerned I think their best bets lie with Bernie or Biden. Bernie might be able to split certain factions of Trump's base by his appearance as both an outsider and anti-establishment character, and Biden might be one of the few candidates who can still appeal to moderates.

 

[Virtual ghost]

2 reasons:

She hasn’t proved she’s good at avoiding Trump’s and the Right’s baiting. She played right into their hands when she released her ancestry results and a corresponding PR video. She would have been better off ignoring the “pocohontas” taunts and memes. She didn’t need to convince any of her supporters or even most democrats, so ultimately the audience she was seeking to silence with that PR move just turned it back on her, and in the process she lost some credibility in the democratic camp and also got some criticism from certain Indian groups

Her critics have spent the last several years tearing her down and turning her into a punchline. It will be difficult for her to suddenly come back from this.

Don’t get me wrong, she’s one of my top 4, I’m just not convinced she can win.

Depends, if she plays professionally and presents good politics I am relatively sure that most will forgive her this (and the drinking video). All she needs to reply back at these accusations is "Is this is the best you got on me?". However the real problem is splitting the vote between her and Bernie. One eventually needs to give up if they don't want establishment candidate to win.


But I admit that I don't know all the details. (most of them probably don't even come all the way to me)

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

I actually think and thought at the time it was a smart move to do this stunt then, because if she plays it well from now on, the issue can justifiably regarded, and always referred to, as settled. No reason to rebut any claims: That was already done long, long ago, when she was not even running for president.

On the other hand, I do hope she learned her lesson from the beer-drinking video.

Trump and his most hardcore supporters have shown us nothing is too far back in the past to dredge up, as we saw in 2016 when they made the entire campaign about Hillary’s 2012 emails and shit her husband did in the nineties

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Depends, if she plays professionally and presents good politics I am relatively sure that most will forgive her this (and the drinking video). All she needs to reply back at these accusations is "Is this is the best you got on me?". However the real problem is splitting the vote between her and Bernie. One eventually needs to give up if they don't want establishment candidate to win.


But I admit that I don't know all the details. (most of them probably don't even come all the way to me)

I hope you’re right

 

[Nicodemus]

Trump and his most hardcore supporters have shown us nothing is too far back in the past to dredge up, as we saw in 2016 when they made the entire campaign about Hillary’s 2012 emails and shit her husband did in the nineties

As I said, it depends on how she plays it. Obviously, Trump will grab anything he can find, and if there is nothing, he will simply invent it. The media really decide how much air time they give to Trump's bullshit, and thus will decide much of the election. Unforunately, it appears many major newspapers and tv stations have still not learned to value information over entertainment.

I always shake my head when the Washington Post repeats Trump's lies instead of reporting "President Trump tweets lie #190394".

 

[Virtual ghost]

I hope you’re right

From what I understand there is a demand for concrete substance and if you can design and present that you will probably rise above the echo of pointless videos, tweets etc. True, that may be idealistic or culturally biased on my part but this is my impression. In my country internet politics is minimal.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

As I said, it depends on how she plays it. Obviously, Trump will grab anything he can find, and if there is nothing, he will simply invent it. The media really decide how much air time they give to Trump's bullshit, and thus will decide much of the election. Unforunately, it appears many major newspapers and tv stations have still not learned to value information over entertainment.

I always shake my head when the Washington Post repeats Trump's lies instead of reporting "President Trump tweets lie #190394".

I do hope you’re right and she can show the cunning to outmaneuver the Trump camp, but what you say about the media is sadly true. I do remember they played a big part in keeping the focus on Hillary’s emails and as much as I dislike the Clintons, that really bothered me

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From what I understand there is a demand for concrete substance and if you can design and present that you will probably rise above the echo of pointless videos, tweets etc. True, that may be idealistic or culturally biased on my part but this is my impression. In my country internet politics is minimal.

If only this election were taking place in your country.

 

[Virtual ghost]

That is certainly a possibility. But the US did elect Obama twice while racism is and was obviously very much alive and kicking. If you think Buttigieg is interested in 'doing identity politics', I think you have not seen much of him yet.

For the record: The fact that I am gay does not mean I automatically favor the gay candidate...

Ok but I don't see Gay and Black as something that has equal value in US. Plus stakes are much higher than in 2008, especially due to supreme court.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

That is certainly a possibility. But the US did elect Obama twice while racism is and was obviously very much alive and kicking. If you think Buttigieg is interested in 'doing identity politics', I think you have not seen much of him yet.

For the record: The fact that I am gay does not mean I automatically favor the gay candidate...

there is a strong social conservative streak in many black American communities, though stronger in older, religious black people, particularly in the south. That could lead to some of them switching votes or simply staying home if Buttigieg is unable to get through to them on issues like the economy. If he avoids “identity politics” the way Obama did, he might have a shot at getting more of their support

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

bidens the only one who can restore norms

 

[Virtual ghost]

If only this election were taking place in your country.

Well, that would be pure Bernie win. My place is still so to the left in economy that even Bernie would pass as mild right wing here.
However what we are actually doing batter in my opinion is that the whole official presidential campaign lasts only about 2 months, what GREATLY lowers drama.


But this is off topic.

 

[Nicodemus]

there is a strong social conservative streak in many black American communities, though stronger in older, religious black people, particularly in the south. That could lead to some of them switching votes or simply staying home if Buttigieg is unable to get through to them on issues like the economy. If he avoids “identity politics” the way Obama did, he might have a shot at getting more of their support

Provided he even becomes the candidate, he may well pick up some of the rural voters who opted for Trump in 2016 and have since noticed that they were conned. But sure, if a large portion of black voters were to reject him, he would go nowhere.

bidens the only one who can restore norms

Norms that allowed all of the current abomination to ride into town pretty much unimpeded. A return to pre-Trump politics is neither sensible nor possible at this point.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

Norms that allowed all of the current abomination to ride into town pretty much unimpeded. A return to pre-Trump politics is neither sensible nor possible at this point.

Haha, it's good to see you aren't brain-damage, even if you aren't a Bernie bro.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Norms that allowed all of the current abomination to ride into town pretty much unimpeded. A return to pre-Trump politics is neither sensible nor possible at this point.

I agree, going to what caused Trump in the first place is almost surely a bad idea. Perhaps it is possible but it is a bad idea, since that will probably end as 2016 or with some new Trump down the road.


However if US doesn't restart it's middle/working class the whole ship will just sink, everything else is secondary in priority. Especially since the rest of the world probably wouldn't have enough resources or the will to hold China and the rest of company at bay in this scenario. But to prevent all of that you will need "something" that is currently out of the box for the country.

 

[Jaguar]

So this is the minority faculty member that y'all think is precise, sincere, super intelligent and most likely to be our next president?

During a debate she couldn't/wouldn't answer the question posed to her, whether or not taxes would be raised on the middle class to pay for Medicare for All. Bernie told it straight. She didn't. Then Chris Matthews posed the same question to her after the debate, no less than 3 times, and when she still evaded the question, Chris Matthews got visibly annoyed. Understandably. I wouldn't call her sincere or precise. Intelligent? Perhaps. But certainly not "super."

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

Well, that would be pure Bernie win. My place is still so to the left in economy that even Bernie would pass as mild right wing here.
However what we are actually doing batter in my opinion is that the whole official presidential campaign lasts only about 2 months, what GREATLY lowers drama.


But this is off topic.

It would be a great topic for another thread though—how the American election cycle has become such a long and protracted event. Sometimes I wish we had a parliamentary system instead, rather than putting so much of the focus on electing Presidents. Congressional elections have become a secondary concern. I’ve met people who aren’t even aware we hold midterm elections.

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

Provided he even becomes the candidate, he may well pick up some of the rural voters who opted for Trump in 2016 and have since noticed that they were conned. But sure, if a large portion of black voters were to reject him, he would go nowhere.


Norms that allowed all of the current abomination to ride into town pretty much unimpeded. A return to pre-Trump politics is neither sensible nor possible at this point.

I have a feeling Pete will be on the VP short list of whoever the eventual nominee is.

 

[Virtual ghost]

It would be a great topic for another thread though—how the American election cycle has become such a long and protracted event. Sometimes I wish we had a parliamentary system instead, rather than putting so much of the focus on electing Presidents. Congressional elections have become a secondary concern. I’ve met people who aren’t even aware we hold midterm elections.

In my opinion long time ago it made sense, the president was traveling the huge country, gathering support from state to state while looking at local problems. However in the era of modern media having a campaign that lasts year and a half is absurd. Nothing good or of quality can come out of this endless drama, it is a waste of time and energy for everyone (at best).

 

[Kingu Kurimuzon]

In my opinion long time ago it made sense, the president was traveling the huge country, gathering support from state to state while looking at local problems. However in the era of modern media having a campaign that lasts year and a half is absurd. Nothing good or of quality can come out of this endless drama, it is a waste of time and energy for everyone (at best).

Agreed. It takes focus away from actual legislating and governing. Then the public is so burnt out by the time the election is over that they aren’t interested in paying attention to things like actual policies and laws that are being passed

 

[Virtual ghost]

During a debate she couldn't/wouldn't answer the question posed to her, whether or not taxes would be raised on the middle class to pay for Medicare for All. Bernie told it straight. She didn't. Then Chris Matthews posed the same question to her after the debate, no less than 3 times, and when she still evaded the question, Chris Matthews got visibly annoyed. Understandably. I wouldn't call her sincere or precise. Intelligent? Perhaps. But certainly not "super."

I didn't watch the whole thing since for me this isn't that important when it comes to details. But yes, she should have answered that.





But regardless of that I will tell everyone here one of my opinions. Which is that having program like Medicare for all is very important factor in winning trade wars, especially since trade wars are usually limited only to a number of sectors. Therefore if you have workers in them in the position that their healthcare doesn't depend directly on how well they are doing on the market you have much more maneuvering space in trade wars, or you just even the playing field if there is a balance in this regard. Health of the workforce can swing the trade war pretty quickly if disbalance with opponents is too big and this factor must not be overlooked in systematic manner.

 

[Jaguar]

I didn't watch the whole thing since for me this isn't that important when it comes to details. But yes, she should have answered that.

It speaks to overall credibility. When you have an interloper in the White House who lies every day, I have little to no patience for anyone running for office who dances around a question. Especially a question with serious consequences.