Extremes of humility and pride in a game

[Ghost of the dead horse]

Unfortunatly there are also many who remain in their psychological prison who can only find psychological safety in a gang or an organisation.

As a young child I always thought people compensated their disabilities by joining up a gang. For example, if I knew the traffic rules for a young bicyclist in my area, I could do it alone. If someone wanted to pretend they were a good cyclist and knew the traffic rules, they only needed to get two friends who were willing to stand up for them, even if none of them knew next to nothing.

So yeah, this is one of the first lessons in life I learned. But still, groups of people do some things better than an individual, so it's impossible to dismiss the worth of the groups.

 

[rain&sky]

I'll take a stab at answering the original request. I have had friends from time to time who have had frustrating habits of their own. I don't know that there is any definite guaranteed-to-work solution to a situation like this...but I have found that a lot of times if you show yourself willing to listen and empathize with a person, they tend to open up to you more and are more likely to heed your advice. It sounds like, from what you said, that you already value helping people so I suspect anything I say is already going to be familiar and intuitive to you (just a guess--I don't know you or anything). My experience (for what it's worth) is that a combo of empathy/listening with some firmness (ie not fixing every situation for a person who insists on acting unwisely) seems like the best bet. Even then, the person may warm up to you and be more open to your suggestions (consciously or unconsciously) ...or they may choose to go their own way. We all have faults and blindspots that are sometimes glaringly obvious to others yet take us years to see clearly for ourselves. This may be one of his/hers. In my opinion, you can continue to be a friend even if the person does not see the need to change...but you don't (and probably shouldn't) fix all their messes (though an occasional helping hand can make a big impact, too). In the end, I think that's how most of us finally see what needs to change in ourselves. And though you may not see marked change in the person for a long time, your friendship might well be a lifeline that overtime helps this person grow in many ways you may not be able to guess at now, or later. Not to put too much pressure on you--sometimes it is right to say no to a friendship. Just giving you a few things to think about. Being a friend to someone who has a difficult personality is a challenge and I will be the first to admit that sometimes I have been a good friend and sometimes I have made big mistakes. And you can't be there for everyone. But like the story of the starfish, you can be there for some people and for them it will make a world of difference--you just have to do your best to figure out how best to wisely invest your time and your self. Because you will have your own limitations and your own need for friends who build you up as well. I tend to think of the two kinds of friendships I often have as the ones where I am the "big sister" and the ones where the other person is the "big sister / brother" and I am the "little sister." I feel the need for both in my life, when I can get them.

Just some thoughts--perhaps nothing new to you. But I admire the fact that you want to help this person. I value helping people too--if you want to say there's an agenda there, I'd say there are at least a few--sometimes it is my human need to feel needed and strong and wise (which is not the best reason and can push my priorities out of wack). Sometimes it has perhaps sprung from knowing what it's like to feel isolated, lost, helpless and wanting to help someone else in that same need (which I think is a better motivation). But having an agenda is not in itself a bad thing--the question is whether or not your agenda is a good one. An agenda can be selfless, atruistic, even logical. It an also be twisted, self-serving, manipulative.

Well, I think I've run on long enough.
Blessings to you as you decide what to do.

 

[rain&sky]

I wrote the above without realizing you'd already gotten some pretty thorough answers to your question--I'd only seen the first page of this thread at that point. Sorry--I'm new around here and still a newbie with message boards, on top of that.

 

[ChrisFergusonFl]

I've had a chance to personally witness a person who goes to the extremes in both. Lets say thay play a shooting game in a team. He knows his role, he's trained, he goes to play. He thinks he handles himself well. Then there's some stuff everyone mistakes at some time, like dropping a flag in a flag carrying mission. Now when this guy makes a similar mistake, he gives explanations that are just impossible given the circumstances. He gives these defensive explanations pretty long time.

After a while people are agitated for him making the same mistake, say, dropping the flag. People shout at him, why doesn't he understand, he did drop the flag, and this is wrong with it. They explain it clearly. This guy resists for a long time. Resists for like 15 minutes with pride. Then he collapses, goes to reverse mode. He asks why everyone is after them, why do they hate him? In his own eyes, he is hated by everyone. Why do they hate him so much. He is devastated. Also, he fully (and overly) understands the extent of his errors and overexaggerates it a good amount. HE never does anything good. Everything is bad with him. How can he be allowed to be in the team.

I've tried to tell him he shouldn't be so cocky for making errors. Like being behind a pillar when a bomb goes off. I've tried to explain what's being behind a pillar in the game. He's stubborn, either stating he's done nothing wrong, or on the other hand, acting like he's terrible and lost his will to live.

Now, can you push me in the right direction to help this guy. He's in the clan, we rely on him somewhat, BUT it's really hard for the rest of the team he's not orientated towards devolopment. He doesn't have good skills in understanding himself. How can we stop this drama, with extremes about self-love and self-hate? The other players have talked about game mechanics, I've talked about those, and also about psychology. I'm not sure if anything is helping.

You sound smart, and I think you're an ENTP?

 

[Ghost of the dead horse]

You sound smart, and I think you're an ENTP?

Unrequested compliment and a personality assessment, thank you.

I'll replace the x in my type with a p, but don't think too much of it.