[NT] Would you try to date me?

[Virtual ghost]

Maybe you didn't mean it like this, but being direct is often mistaken for being confident. Not the same thing. Being direct could be a style of talking, a lack of consideration for others feelings, or just wanting to get to the point. Being confident is something within you, something that makes you know that your self worth is not given to you. It's yours. You have decide your own worth.

I can smell an insecure man a mile away. If he has many other wonderful attributes, I'll work with him in building his self confidence. But this is not something that I enjoy doing, and I have very little patience for slow learners.

This is how I know that the INFJ/ENTP pairing would never work for me. INTxs can be lacking self confidence, but the difference is that they don't care. Which makes them, somehow, more attractive.

Well, my confidance can be overlooked without too much problem since social stereotypes apply that very introverted people have a problem in this sphere.

Especially since my self confidance is not a raw one(for the most part).
By this I mean that I am not one of the move aside I can do a better job people..


Instead my confidance manifest itself as my faith in my ability to make a right choice. Which is one more factor why you can miss. Plus I don't make hasty desicions because I am usually careful with data I get. If I see the information could be wrong I "slow down" in order to get it right/to the bottom.

Which is exactly why I have a faith in my way of doing things.

 

[jenocyde]

Erm: How do you know what I seem to think? And why wouldn't I have applied it vice versa? The fact is that she already made the first move, now it's his turn.

Weeding out men with no confidence in my estimation, but the weeding process is different for everyone.

 

[jenocyde]

Well, my confidance can be overlooked without too much problem since social stereotypes apply that very introverted people have a problem in this sphere.

Especially since my self confidance is not a raw one(for the most part).
By this I mean that I am not one of the move aside I can do a better job people..


Instead my confidance manifest itself as my faith in my ability to make a right choice. Which is one more factor why you can miss. Plus I don't make hasty desicions because I am usually careful with data I get. If I see the information could be wrong I "slow down" in order to get it right/to the bottom.

Which is exactly why I have a faith in my way of doing things.

And that's wonderful and exactly what I would expect. Self confidence doesn't always look like Mr. ESTP. It's the having faith in yourself part, no matter how you manifest it.

I think you'll do fine.

 

[erm]

Erm: How do you know what I seem to think? And why wouldn't I have applied it vice versa?

You were answering this question:

"Would you mind explaining me why you don't like to be the one that pop the question about going out together?"

Weren't you?

The impression was, you like the man to ask you out, not vice versa. I was curious as to why the apparent gender distinction was there. Along with fluffywolf's and other's responses I've seen a lot around the place.

All answers I've seen can be applied from the man's perspective as well. A long with the, expecting the man to pay thing I see a lot.

 

[jenocyde]

You were answering this question:

"Would you mind explaining me why you don't like to be the one that pop the quetion about going out togather ?"

Weren't you?

The impression was, you like the man to ask you out, not vice versa. I was curious as to why the apparent gender distinction was there.

I never said anything about a gender distinction, in fact, I made it a point not to make it about gender. He asked me why I don't like it and I told him why I don't like it. It would be the same if I was a lesbian and was courting females.

 

[erm]

I never said anything about a gender distinction, in fact, I made it a point not to make it about gender. He asked me why I don't like it and I told him why I don't like it. It would be the same if I was a lesbian and was courting females.

Still, the double standard is there. You expect them to ask you out, what if they expect the same?

If you think giving strong signals is enough, what if they think the same?

Just curious and all. It certainly looks like a gender distinction. The "if things were different" (being a lesbian) response could be applied to absolutely anything, afterall.

It would make sense if say, you wanted to filter out people who think the same way as you.

 

[jenocyde]

All answers I've seen can be applied from the man's perspective as well. A long with the, expecting the man to pay thing I see a lot.

I never expect a man to pay for anything, but I will not be caught up haggling over a bill. It's humiliating. You pay this time and I'll pay next, but I won't split checks.

Traditionally, and even now, people in partnerships have different strengths and weaknesses. If it's the partners' goal to marry and raise children, it should be expected to know that while one partner is unable to work, the other can still afford to support the new family at the current level. It's not brain surgery why women "try a man on" like that. We all have dating criteria and I find it abhorrent that men can easily say that they want a woman with big breasts, a fat ass, able to cook, clean and bear children, etc... but it's looked down with disgust if a woman requests that a man have a sufficient salary.

If you don't like women who look for men with earning potential, then you have to define your own weeding out process.


As far as you making me speak hypothetically about my actual life, I have no answers for you. I am speaking in the context of me, and since I am attracted to men, it seems like a gender bias. But if you read anything of what I wrote you will see that I approach men more often than not. No gender bias. I just don't take them as seriously in the long run. And I'm entitled to have that point of view.

 

[erm]

We all have dating criteria and I find it abhorrent that men can easily say that they want a woman with big breasts, a fat ass, able to cook, clean and bear children, etc... but it's looked down with disgust if a woman requests that a man have a sufficient salary.

I wasn't aware of that double standard. I thought both were seen as shallow? Probably the male one more so than the female one (which I agree with).

As far as you making me speak hypothetically about my actual life, I have no answers for you. I am speaking in the context of me, and since I am attracted to men, it seems like a gender bias. But if you read anything of what I wrote you will see that I approach men more often than not. No gender bias. I just don't take them as seriously in the long run. And I'm entitled to have that point of view.

I wasn't suggesting anything contradictory to that. Like I said, just curious.

If I was offended by a gender bias, every hetero or homosexual would offend me.

 

[jenocyde]

I wasn't aware of that double standard. I thought both were seen as shallow? Probably the male one more so than the female one.

No, it's quite common that a man expect a woman should know how to cook, at the very least. And women are judged every single day on their bodies, not just by shallow men. But with changing times and people living more on credit, traditional gender roles have had to change. And expectations have had to change. There are still a few relics hanging around. But I can't speak for all womankind. I just know that I like a confident person, romantically. How do I judge confidence? Well, being able to approach me, for one.

I know you are just curious. I have no problem with answering your questions.

 

[Virtual ghost]

When it come to date dinamics does it really matter who poped the question ? (or that is relative)

 

[jenocyde]

Completely relative.
I've known women who have proposed marriage to their SO.
It's a mixture of social conditioning and personal preference.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Completely relative.
I've known women who have proposed marriage to their SO.
It's a mixture of social conditioning and personal preference.

Well I thought that it probably was.

However I will ask you one more thing. Once you said that you really like to be suprised. So I am wondering if are thinking about "same" thing.
Here is the story.


Usually I just keep everything to myself but sometimes I give people my attention. However sometimes and in a very rare situations I deliberately act like a real eccentric just for the sake of it.


Once I got invited to a private party. Nothing big, just a mild socialization between people of the same age. (early 20s)
So since I haven't done anything social for months I said "Why not, I will be there". But the entire thing was low buget so the deal was that everyone has to bring their own drink (aka alcohol). But I am not a big fan of alcohol plus I had to study next morning. So I went to the nearby store and bought a few packages of milk and went to the party with that.


So when I got there I shocked (litterally) everyone when I started to pull those milk packeges at the table. But some of them were sure that I am just messing with them. You know that "Yeah, nice try" attitude.
But when I have opened the first package and pull out a bag out of my jacket in which was a straw that ended up in a milk package. That almost kill them. So, I were drinking milk the whole night long.


Even today I remember faces of people which didn't know me before that night. However I have managed to pull the joke to the end without looking like an ass. Especially since most of people there were NPs (plus some SPs) so they took it as joke. (since it was a joke actually)


Is this the ability to suprise you were talking about ?

 

[jenocyde]

I love that story. Absolutely love it. I *wish* you would have thought to bring along soy, almond or rice milk for all the non dairy drinkers, but other than that, you would have been fast tracked to becoming one of my most favorite people.

 

[luminous beam]

If I wasn't already dating Solitary Walker, perhaps.

 

[Virtual ghost]

I love that story. Absolutely love it. I *wish* you would have thought to bring along soy, almond or rice milk for all the non dairy drinkers, but other than that, you would have been fast tracked to becoming one of my most favorite people.

Well, truth to be told I like to play with social conventions from time to time..
But to be honest I find this "skill" quite useful if I don't want to comes as robotic.

 

[jenocyde]

And this will take you far in life, at least with that ENTP girl you are thinking about. I don't know if an SFJ would find that amusing. But I think it's great.

 

[Virtual ghost]

And this will take you far in life, at least with that ENTP girl you are thinking about. I don't know if an SFJ would find that amusing. But I think it's great.

Well, I was thinking about her since I don't see anything in that direction. I simply said that I will be on a look out.

But it looks to me that Ne-doms in general appriciate this "skill".

 

[Saslou]

And this will take you far in life, at least with that ENTP girl you are thinking about. I don't know if an SFJ would find that amusing. But I think it's great.

Amusing, No. Quirky, Yes.

You never quite know what to expect with an INTJ. It keeps you on your toes, and thats always a good thing.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Well it has been some time since this thread was active.

 

[JocktheMotie]

Have you gotten anyone to date you yet?