When Fe meets Fi......

[entropie]

When the whore meets the saint....

only freedom will now.

 

[fetus]

I have been most intensely connected with Fe types. Over the course of my life I've had deep issues with dependency, and coincidentally (or maybe not coincidentally) all of those people have been FJs. I think it's the more expressive nature of Fe that is alluring to me. I need feedback, support, and open appreciation--I thrive on it--and I've found that Fe is far more likely to do that than Fi.

However, I get along extremely well with ISFPs. It's not in the same way as FJs; I don't constantly look for support/appreciation as I'm inclined to do with FJs, but the rapport and buddy-like connection is wonderful. I frequently find myself saying "me too!" when we share experiences and opinions.

INFPs are a whole different ball game. I find them so hard to get to know and their guarded nature can be a bit intimidating. But I love them nonetheless.

 

[RedAmazoneFriendZone]

Fi users are the only type that know how to get me to self-destruct.
I have to psychologically convince myself that it's okay whenever I interact with them.
I don't how or why.
I try to get along.

Besides that, I hold a lot of respect for ESFPs. One day, I hope to have an ESFP child. I really look up to you guys.

What type are you ? We can choose the sex of some child, it is not impossible that in some few years we'll be able to choose the MBTI type of it.

Fe are the only types that can make me wanna hide for a long time or go away from them. BUT :

That depends how they master the distance with me...


That is not Fe user or Fi users that pushes a person to self-destruction/. It is how you feel with yourself unconsciously,

and one day (not by chance!) an unhealthy (or healthy) type crosses your way

and shows you what was already inside of you. When I understood that mechanism it helped me not generalising.

https://youtu.be/dofkD66kibY

 

[Norrsken]

The one thing I don't really like about Fi types (INFP, ISFP, ENFP, ESFP, ENTJ, ESTJ, ISTJ, ENTJ, INTJ) is them thinking that they have to be blunt or brutally honest in order to get a point across and its like, no, you don't? I'm not saying you should be sugary all the time, but the honest truth should be spoken in a way that frees yourself or another person from inevitable harm, not to cause that same harm with your sharp tongue. Its just not needed. Not that all Fi types are like this, and there are Fe types who can also be blunt when pushed too far, but I really just hate that whole mantra on, if its not brutal honesty, then its not good enough or something.

I should also add that this, of course, always depends on the individual and how balanced they are, cognitive function wise.

 

[Forever]

The one thing I don't really like about Fi types (INFP, ISFP, ENFP, ESFP, ENTJ, ESTJ, ISTJ, ENTJ, INTJ) is them thinking that they have to be blunt or brutally honest in order to get a point across and its like, no, you don't? I'm not saying you should be sugary all the time, but the honest truth should be spoken in a way that frees yourself or another person from inevitable harm, not to cause that same harm with your sharp tongue. Its just not needed. Not that all Fi types are like this, and there are Fe types who can also be blunt when pushed too far, but I really just hate that whole mantra on, if its not brutal honesty, then its not good enough or something.

I should also add that this, of course, always depends on the individual and how balanced they are, cognitive function wise.

I see brutal honesty as more of another approach that isn't wrong really. But those who are honest with everyone are likely more accountable to everyone. It isn't easy and it is very commendable. I may not have "brutal honesty" 100% of the time but I can see it in others who look at me and people have told they want to be just like me because I'm not afraid to be who I am and where I stand with others.

And the good person rarely has to lie.
Rule#1 when you love yourself, you'll start to love others naturally. So your love can hit them with blunt force.

 

[Norrsken]

I see brutal honesty as more of another approach that isn't wrong really. But those who are honest with everyone are likely more accountable to everyone. It isn't easy and it is very commendable. I may not have "brutal honesty" 100% of the time but I can see it in others who look at me and people have told they want to be just like me because I'm not afraid to be who I am and where I stand with others.

And the good person rarely has to lie.
Rule#1 when you love yourself, you'll start to love others naturally. So your love can hit them with blunt force.

Oh, its not that I don't enjoy honesty, because I do and it is a weakness for Fe types to understand sometimes when it is time to be true to oneself. I have trouble standing up for myself still, and that is partly because of imagined danger and/or social repercussions, and it is also because I hate disappointing other people. Honesty is a virtue we must all hold up to, I agree with you. What I mean with brutal honesty is, is more like me talking about those who want to be rude to others and then quickly start the "I'm just being honest" bull and it really ruffles my feathers.

And its not like Fe types haven't stepped on other peoples' toes before, or that Fi types can't bite their tongues just like we can. I'm just speaking in generalities. I definitely agree with your last sentence; love is a remarkable force.

 

[ZNP-TBA]

Yeah, this sounds about right. I think Fe, in different stacking locations, become sort of manipulative to the feelings of a group or between individuals in different ways. For a TP type, with tertiary or inferior Fe, it usually just means that they tend to try to analyze emotions through their Ti, and are willing to experiment with it so far as their Pe function will conceive of and then Ti will deem reasonable. For a FJ, however, I sometimes get more wary, and this is what has lead to my particular dislike of Fe - is that it tries to control so rigidly. More so than Te, I think. As Te often seems like it can get things done without having to be an infringement upon others (perhaps in the future of my career I'll actually find Te to be worse, limiting my own methods in the workplace), whereas Fe needs to have harmony, and is willing to compromise the fuck out of everything else to get there. The way I, for one, view my use of Fe is by avoiding too much unnecessary interaction. I don't go and actively meet strangers so much, unless it's potentially very fruitful, and I don't continually interact with people whom I'm likely to have useless conflict with. So I preserve harmony (use Fe) by rationalizing (Ti) that based on previous patterns (Ne-Si), I will be better off alone in many situations. And really, I am often best off just in my own little room, inside my head, working on whatever activities interest me and not having to think about feelings. (because what's really the point, in my case?) An FJ, however, needs to have that Fe, and will seek out drama and situations which are disharmonious in order to become the social fixer. I really rather not have part in that, as I think I can avoid the situation before it happens.

I see what you're saying and relate to most of it. Thanks for sharing your perspective from an 'inferior' Fe/ dominant Ti perspective. I think Fe being my tertiary works slightly differently for me. I'm not as wary of Fe. However, what is very true for me as well is processing my emotions through Ti or basically rationalizing them. I find it rather difficult to express my feelings without infusing a logical progression for them. This might come off as disingenuous to some people as it seems like I'm overtly repressing my feelings but that's not the case at all. Rationalizing them helps me understand them even if it appears more detached. My Fe is my 'facilitator' in a sense as it helps me adapt and establish a 'mood' with someone I'm talking to help better convey my Ne-Ti ideas to them. Ne mixed with Fe is actually fun as you can capture the 'feeling' with an applicable metaphor and then translate that into other ideas or scenarios the person can understand. Sometimes this comes off as 'charm' while other times it comes off as invasive depending how cranked up the Fe dial is and the other person's reception to it.

 

[ZNP-TBA]

Now let's push the subject a little bit farther... Do Fe feel more attracted to Fi than Fi can ?

I'll bite. The attraction I feel towards Fi's is more intense and super charged. I see they are like a volcano of passion waiting to erupt. I know we're not supposed to 'poke' Fi but I can't help it. I like to disturb this creature and see what happens next.

My attraction to Fe is more mature and (probably) compatible. Rather than being intensely charged it's a slow burner and takes its time getting to the right temperature or takes its time like trees in the ground gradually entwining their roots. I think the 'stay power' with the Fe is stronger for me.

So for Fe, I'd like to know...... how healthy you think you could be at the moment ? Does Fi help you knowing your needs ?

I don't see myself as unhealthy. I find interaction with Fi is fun because they ask me questions that I typically don't consider like how I personally feel about things that I typically don't associate feelings with.

Do Fi tend to get on your nerves ? Do you judge them selfish or lucky to have such a nature

Nah, they don't get on my nerves.

 

[RedAmazoneFriendZone]

I'll bite. The attraction I feel towards Fi's is more intense and super charged. I see they are like a volcano of passion waiting to erupt. I know we're not supposed to 'poke' Fi but I can't help it. I like to disturb this creature and see what happens next.

My attraction to Fe is more mature and (probably) compatible. Rather than being intensely charged it's a slow burner and takes its time getting to the right temperature or takes its time like trees in the ground gradually entwining their roots. I think the 'stay power' with the Fe is stronger for me.



I don't see myself as unhealthy. I find interaction with Fi is fun because they ask me questions that I typically don't consider like how I personally feel about things that I typically don't associate feelings with.



Nah, they don't get on my nerves.

I was asking to Fe dom, not to Ne dom

Now I'm curious to know your "technics" (that sounds definitely very crual) to "disturb creatures and see what happens next".

How about if that "creature" (god creature) tests you more than you do ? What is the point of your "game" ? Why playing such games ?

Is that a way to gain power over "that creature" ?

I'd like you to give concrete example if you are able to remember... that would be tasty I think....

I've seen several Fe and Se bitting their own tail because they wanted to test me but did not even know me !!!!


Here is an interesting point Fi is fun because they ask me questions that I typically don't consider like how I personally feel about things that I typically don't associate feelings with.

This reminds me of myself telling to my teachers how they should considerate others' feelings to get a better attention and how they could communicate (because I generally know my teacher

a bit and I enjoy talking to them sometimes, and mostly because : I love giving my point of view and learning on others' points of views) !


I see they are like a volcano of passion waiting to erupt.
I am not Fi dominant I just have it as a second function. I seem quick minded and calm at the same time (a bit like ISTP from the outside).

I've noticed some Fe sometimes ask questions in a non-direct way that may sound totally inappropriate or nonsense on the spot to me !
That is probably when they wanna please others. Well I do wonder...
Do you recognise yourself you Fe in such behaviours ?

 

[ZNP-TBA]

I was asking to Fe dom, not to Ne dom

Yeah but my Fe is pretty impressive.

Now I'm curious to know your "technics" (that sounds definitely very crual) to "disturb creatures and see what happens next".

Not sure what you mean by 'technics?' Do you mean techniques?

How about if that "creature" (god creature) tests you more than you do ? What is the point of your "game" ? Why playing such games ?

I love being tested. Back and forth is tons of fun. I don't really consider it a 'game' though I guess it could be considered such in a certain light. There really isn't a point aside from being able to see more simply for the sake of seeing more.

Is that a way to gain power over "that creature" ?

No unless its in the bedroom.

I'd like you to give concrete example if you are able to remember... that would be tasty I think....

I liken it like a moth to a flame. Fi can be very private and unfortunately shut down discussion and inquiry into certain parts of a personality. Rather than a deterrent to me this is like a huge welcome sign with neon lights because I like to push up against boundaries to see how much more I can learn. An INFP ex/friend would talk to me about practically everything but there were some beliefs she held that were not up for discussion and negotiation. I hold no sacred cows and I'm hopelessly inquisitive so the more 'forbidden' something is to talk about the more I want to talk about it. I knew I had to be tactful though and not overtly violate her boundaries. Rather I turned up the Fe dial to better understand her sentiments and adapted accordingly gradually making those boundaries more elastic and accessible. It wasn't always smooth but I think overall both of us enjoyed talking about it at some point.

I am not Fi dominant I just have it as a second function. I seem quick minded and calm at the same time (a bit like ISTP from the outside).

I find wherever Fi is in the stack there is at least some fire/passion inside that's not exactly logical. Your 'ISTP' surface appearance is probably due to the Se similarities but it's another story beneath the surface. I relate a lot to ISTPs myself actually.

I've noticed some Fe sometimes ask questions in a non-direct way that may sound totally inappropriate or nonsense on the spot to me !
That is probably when they wanna please others. Well I do wonder...
Do you recognise yourself you Fe in such behaviours ?

My Fe doesn't motivate me to please others. My Fe is probably a bit selfish actually (being tertiary and all). As I mentioned earlier my Fe works like a 'facilitator' or something like 'climate control' in a particular space. I accommodate the other person to the extent they become more comfortable/willing to exchange information with me. My goal is to exchange that information and not to accommodate.

 

[Virtual ghost]

The one thing I don't really like about Fi types (INFP, ISFP, ENFP, ESFP, ENTJ, ESTJ, ISTJ, ENTJ, INTJ) is them thinking that they have to be blunt or brutally honest in order to get a point across and its like, no, you don't? I'm not saying you should be sugary all the time, but the honest truth should be spoken in a way that frees yourself or another person from inevitable harm, not to cause that same harm with your sharp tongue. Its just not needed. Not that all Fi types are like this, and there are Fe types who can also be blunt when pushed too far, but I really just hate that whole mantra on, if its not brutal honesty, then its not good enough or something.

I should also add that this, of course, always depends on the individual and how balanced they are, cognitive function wise.

My whole life people say to me that I am too honest and direct, what got to the point that I stopped caring at all what people really think and I stopped engaging them based upon that. Some of us are just hardwired like that, not to mention that I think that generally it the best to just get everything out in the clear, so that solution becomes pretty much obvious. Once we get the problem out of the way we can do something we really want. I over do this but often it is perhaps best not to wait too much. When I am too nice to people I often feel like a complete idiot or a fraud and therefore I try not to do it. It happens that people imagine all kinds of things regarding me but I find that flattering.

 

[ZNP-TBA]

My whole life people say to me that I am too honest and direct, what got to the point that I stopped caring at all what people really think and I stopped engaging them based upon that. Some of us are just hardwired like that, not to mention that I think that generally it the best to just get everything out in the clear, so that solution becomes pretty much obvious. Once we get the problem out of the way we can do something we really want. I over do this but often it is perhaps best not to wait too much. When I am too nice to people I often feel like a complete idiot or a fraud and therefore I try not to do it. It happens that people imagine all kinds of things regarding me but I find that flattering.

Without tact in social discourse you can obscure the actual point you're trying to get across. As annoying as it sounds it's sometimes necessary to filter your message in a way where it won't immediately repulse people. It doesn't require going to an accommodating extreme but it's still relevant.

 

[SearchingforPeace]

Fe dom for your questions

Now let's push the subject a little bit farther... Do Fe feel more attracted to Fi than Fi can ?

Hell, yes. IFPs burn like a supernova to me. They have an intensity that is extremely clear to me. As a young man, my best friend was a ESFP and I dated mostly FPs before marrying my wife, a ISFP.

I was never very interested in Ts. FJs seemed boring and uninteresting.

I put this on to immaturity on my part. FPs had what I didn't consciously have, and so wanted.

I still feel when a Fi dom is around. I still find them appealing. I love my wife with her Fi, even as it causes me discomfort at times.

But I have learned to find the appeal of other types.

I can read lots of Fi dom recognise the social warmth and generosity, the quality of Fe dom to engage fully in their environment.

Maybe. I don't know. My wife says she liked my attitude and friendliness. I do a lot of effort supporting the emotional environment.....

I can't read the real feelings of Fe there

Fe is real. It isn't artificial or fake. My sunny disposition is authentic. Fe isn't an exterior add on to me.

As a Fe dom, I can and do hold opposite emotional states inside and out. This isn't inauthentic. It is prioritizing the exterior over the interior.

Everyone doesn't need my shit thrown into their life. It really isn't fair to them. When Fi users push their shit on others, they are essentially accessing shadow Fe. Doing it badly is extremely painful to others.

They tease and goof around a lot, avoiding any conversation that involves personal interests or anything related to discussion involving how someone relates to something personally.

That behaviour ! That behaviour for an ESFP who loves fun is first of all admirable, impressive and I do feel attracted to such an exhibitionist attitude....at the first sight !

But as the most unhealthy Fe don't ask questions about YOUR real interests, feelings, all that "Fe show" becomes very quickly superficial to me. With unhealthy ones of course...

I do care about the feelings of others. I know many of them in advanced, though.

They can even think they know what is good for me without taking time to have a frank and serious discussion about my needs and tastes ! (Immediate Turn off_)

Unfortunately. The problem is we can be really aware of your needs and tastes prior to your expressing them. So much is unconscious, but is virtually written all over your face.

Is the turn because they don't take the time to talk to you about your needs and tastes, or because they are wrong?

Besides, IME, FPs can be so annoyingly stubborn in refusing to express such, even when they are extremely evident to the EFJ. I can anticipate 90% + of my wifes words and needs and have ever since we have been together. I have learned that I need to take the time to listen to her rather than immediately solve all problems before she realizes that she has problems.

Unhealthy Fe are not in touch with their own tastes and needs. Which doesn't help to have a deep and meaningful conversation (mainly if your subtype is sx).

We are usually very in touch with our values and ideals. We have lots of meaningful and deep conversations on such.

I don't know if all Fi dom (or having it as a secondary function) are the same as me. If someone wanna know me personally, they'll have to ask questions about my feelings.

I'll be aware of them but I'll never ever display them. Feelings are precious to me.

The contradiction! You don't want to display your feelings but are upset that Fe doms hide their own...... hmmmmm. My feelings are extremely precious to me, as are the feelings of others.

Some Fe dom I know, a bit more healthy,seem to enjoy a more focused and individualistic approach of things (whatever it is ...art, philosophie, trips, psychologie)

without thinking expressing oneself is being selfish.


So for Fe, I'd like to know...... how healthy you think you could be at the moment ? Does Fi help you knowing your needs ?

Does my wife's Fi help me to know my needs? Hell, no. Does turning Fe inward and exploring my depths help me? Yes.

Do Fi tend to get on your nerves ? Do you judge them selfish or lucky to have such a nature ?
:hi:

Fi refusing to open up is extremely frustrating. Fi unwilling to discuss things is annoying.

I don’t envy FPs. I don't judge them as selfish. They just are.....

 

[RedAmazoneFriendZone]

Do you mean techniques? Yes. I was thinking it sounds too much french as we write "techniques" too

I love being tested. Back and forth is tons of fun. I don't really consider it a 'game' though I guess it could be considered such in a certain light. There really isn't a point aside from being able to see more simply for the sake of seeing more. Maybe that is your stuff or some ENTP stuff. It seems Fe dom (and not tertiary) test others not in the only purpose to learn...

No unless its in the bedroom. Oh....well I do ignore why....anyway how is it in the bathroom ?

Fi can be very private and unfortunately shut down discussion and inquiry into certain parts of a personality.
Yes. Even when somebody talks to me in a daily communications, let's say her/his habits I am looking for a deepest meaning. What is under the surface.
I'm looking for the meaning of things. If somebody did the same with me I would probably not trust her/him (unless they he/she is a very good friend and listener).
I am very open-minded about others. I am very private about my own life. That's maybe why I'm the first one to ask questions and make jokes...


I hold no sacred cows and I'm hopelessly inquisitive so the more 'forbidden' something is to talk about the more I want to talk about it.
How about if...you are finding yourself with a person who has no taboos ? No forbidden subjects. How do you behave ? Silence is very exciting...
IF I am close to someone or I feel close to someone (which is the same to me!) he/she can speak about anything. It allows me to learn about life as well as about my friend.
I used to be like you (probably a 7w8 thing), I used to push the limits whenever it was possible. Today I am much more aware of others' feelings and limits.
They have their own reasons...

I find wherever Fi is in the stack there is at least some fire/passion inside that's not exactly logical.
Of course it isn't ! That's all the beauty of it ! Le coeur a ses raisons que la raison ignore !


I accommodate the other person to the extent they become more comfortable/willing to exchange information with me. My goal is to exchange that information and not to accommodate.
Some Fe can seem Ne....some Ne can seem Fe......you never know which animal is hiding behind the bush unless you observe it for a while and find out...
Finding out motivations.
Thanks for sharing your own experience [MENTION=25403]ZNP-TBA[/MENTION].

 

[Betty Blue]

It generally depends on what mood I am in and what place in my life I am visiting.

 

[Norrsken]

My whole life people say to me that I am too honest and direct, what got to the point that I stopped caring at all what people really think and I stopped engaging them based upon that. Some of us are just hardwired like that, not to mention that I think that generally it the best to just get everything out in the clear, so that solution becomes pretty much obvious. Once we get the problem out of the way we can do something we really want. I over do this but often it is perhaps best not to wait too much. When I am too nice to people I often feel like a complete idiot or a fraud and therefore I try not to do it. It happens that people imagine all kinds of things regarding me but I find that flattering.

And see, I absolutely understand where you are coming from, because honesty is a virtue to uphold all of us to and it is the best way to clear the air, so to speak. I'll give you an example, when I was on this one medication, it has done something very strange to my hormones levels that I started gaining unwanted weight even when I tried to eat sensibly + exercise. My husband's friend, this INTJ (or so we suspect), decided it was necessary to point blank tell me that I needed to lose weight. As if I was too stupid to not already realize the size of my girth at that moment. My husband was appalled that he just out and said it, but my husband also touts the brutal honesty mantra, that is, until the same is done to him, lol. Of course, I don't let it get to me, because in the end, the INTJ friend looked like a complete asshat all without me having to lift a finger.

A better way to go about that would be is if the friend asks me if I am under stress or if I am under any medication, or another reason why I may have put on some weight, and if he can provide some help with my health issues. That would have gone way better and I would (1) know that my weight should go down for the sake of my health, and (2) he cares enough to find out more information before jumping to conclusion that I was just a fat slob with no control over my gluttony. Thankfully, that was a while back, and I am at a normal healthy weight again.

Thank you for responding to my post. It is a very hard subject to talk about sometimes, this honesty ordeal.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Without tact in social discourse you can obscure the actual point you're trying to get across. As annoying as it sounds it's sometimes necessary to filter your message in a way where it won't immediately repulse people. It doesn't require going to an accommodating extreme but it's still relevant.

I know, but I have also realized that people that are often too sensitive in this regard turn out not to be really worth the effort on the long run. The problem is that with such people I may do "the Fe thing" over and over again and that drains me or annoys me. If there is something really important going on I will control what I say, however in general I am pretty unhappy when people push me too much into social protocols that have no real practical purpose.


Diagnosis for me was always pretty much "bluntness", even when I try to control things that I say. Since I often end up as too serious or too structured in my expression. However the only area where I am trully suffering from this is my general relationship with women. But ok, I am repairing even that one at the moment. Before pretty much every conversation I make analysis what are the odds that this converation will backfire on me so I try to avoid converastions that will probably turn out to be unplesant to either side. I know very well about what you are talking about but sometimes it is very hard to go against yourself. Imagine that someone requires you to cut out the Ne stuff, stop being a flirt/fun and gives you a serious detailed job from 9-7 PM. You can do it but after a month you will surely be quite annoyed and frustrated ... my problem isn't that much different.


However I have a few very redeeming qualities ... very good trouble shooter or I channel people in a way that they figure out what is going on, I do what I say/promise I will do, I drag people out of problem(s) or give them extra pair of hands. In many situations it was me who was a parent to my FP parents and everywhere where I show up there is a increase of efficency or order almost automatically. What may benefit people indirectly by having a working system ... what lowers general sense of drama.


This is a messy issue for me but in general I try to win respect of people with other things than my Fe usage, but I don't EVER directly insult people since I find that quite childlish. But truth to be said: dom Fe and I actually don't have that many problem in general, since we generally find common language in getting stuff done (ExxJ). Plus they are usually completely open so I don't have to play guessing games with them. However Fe in lower positions where it is "incomplete" or FPs that are stuck in their values may have a problem with me. (and the other way around)

And see, I absolutely understand where you are coming from, because honesty is a virtue to uphold all of us to and it is the best way to clear the air, so to speak. I'll give you an example, when I was on this one medication, it has done something very strange to my hormones levels that I started gaining unwanted weight even when I tried to eat sensibly + exercise. My husband's friend, this INTJ (or so we suspect), decided it was necessary to point blank tell me that I needed to lose weight. As if I was too stupid to not already realize the size of my girth at that moment. My husband was appalled that he just out and said it, but my husband also touts the brutal honesty mantra, that is, until the same is done to him, lol. Of course, I don't let it get to me, because in the end, the INTJ friend looked like a complete asshat all without me having to lift a finger.

A better way to go about that would be is if the friend asks me if I am under stress or if I am under any medication, or another reason why I may have put on some weight, and if he can provide some help with my health issues. That would have gone way better and I would (1) know that my weight should go down for the sake of my health, and (2) he cares enough to find out more information before jumping to conclusion that I was just a fat slob with no control over my gluttony. Thankfully, that was a while back, and I am at a normal healthy weight again.

Thank you for responding to my post. It is a very hard subject to talk about sometimes, this honesty ordeal.

This is why I am often silent among people I don't know well, since I am pretty sure I will say something wrong. I don't know what exactly happned with that INTJ but stuff like this can be a invitation to the topic/converation. I throw you a direct line and then you explain to me your problem. This can show that NTJ is interested in what is going on and wants to know more ... but feels that politeness may feel like a pity. Thereore if the guy wasn't obviously sarcastic there was probably misunderstanding in that conversation.

 

[RedAmazoneFriendZone]

Fe dom for your questions

Very authentic and precise answer.

But I'll need to know a bit more


I still feel when a Fi dom is around. I still find them appealing. I love my wife with her Fi, even as it causes me discomfort at times.

Can you give more info ? How do you notice them around ? Why does it cause you some discomfort at times ?


Maybe. I don't know. My wife says she liked my attitude and friendliness. I do a lot of effort supporting the emotional environment.....

Some Fe I know (health) are direct, upbeat, sympathetic, understanding, warm. Some others, unhealthy are manipulative (mainly ESFJ), try to get attention, can be aggressive and very unhealthy

can even bully who (in this case I think it is "what") they think is weak !


Fe is real. It isn't artificial or fake. My sunny disposition is authentic. Fe isn't an exterior add on to me.

I like this. That is true to healthy types again, as usual. Do you sometimes use tricks to get someone's attention ? Your wife attention maybe ?

When Fi users push their shit on others, they are essentially accessing shadow Fe. Doing it badly is extremely painful to others.

I don't have any idea of what Fi shit could be What do you wall "shadow Fe" ?



So much is unconscious, but is virtually written all over your face.

I hope it isn't the same with Fi as a secondary function...... I hate people reading me unless I choose to do so.

Is the turn because they don't take the time to talk to you about your needs and tastes, or because they are wrong?

BOTH

I have learned that I need to take the time to listen to her rather than immediately solve all problems before she realizes that she has problems.
If she trusts you this way it is good for you two.
I don't work this way and I become very angry if a man tries to solve my problems before I can talk to him about them.

We are usually very in touch with our values and ideals.We have lots of meaningful and deep conversations on such.
I guess this is as important for Fe as for Fi. Am I wrong ?

The contradiction! You don't want to display your feelings but are upset that Fe doms hide their own...... hmmmmm. My feelings are extremely precious to me, as are the feelings of others.
NO.
That depends on the situation and the person that is with me.
I didn't write the word "upset", did I ? I just expressed the idea that Fe tend to guess my feelings instead of ASKING the right questions
Maybe I didn't express it into a good english
To give you more details : when I am with someone I trust I don't need to test, protect my feelings, think someone can judge me as weak, know I can joke around, I can just be myself and I'm very generous.
When I'm with someone I don't know yet, that all depends of my intuition and how clear the other person is to me. I'll wait for the other person to express himself/herself so I can know what are his/her values.
I behave the same in the groups I belong to. I feel people's intentions very fast and I observe their qualities. I never judge but I make precise choices based on my preferences and what is fair to me.
When you write the word "contradiction" that is only one for the outside world ! Not for me. In fact, it is the way I feel.

Does my wife's Fi help me to know my needs? Hell, no. Does turning Fe inward and exploring my depths help me? Yes.
That is interesting. I have noticed healthy Fe enjoy Fi and find it funny and intriguing. I'm curious to about Fe and how you use your dom function to explore your depths.

Fi refusing to open up is extremely frustrating.

That is why my partner must encourage me to express my feelings. I don't do it automatically and never will.
I can express my tastes, like sand dislikes, intellectual interests, what I've planned to do and so on.
Feelings are like jewels, you don't put them in anybody's hands, anywhere, or just for fun...
Unless I'm on stage... And here Se will help me a lot !

 

[SearchingforPeace]

Fe dom for your questions

Very authentic and precise answer.

But I'll need to know a bit more


I still feel when a Fi dom is around. I still find them appealing. I love my wife with her Fi, even as it causes me discomfort at times.

Can you give more info ? How do you notice them around ? Why does it cause you some discomfort at times ?

I feel it. I see it. It is if they put a neon light on their head.

As to discomfort, Fi when extremely upset is like a supernova. I just feel the intensity. I can't believe others are unaware

So, similarly, Fi when extremely happy is like the most glorious flower garden ever. Fi when really engaged during sex is on par or maybe better than my orgasm.

Intense emotions touch me directly.....

Maybe. I don't know. My wife says she liked my attitude and friendliness. I do a lot of effort supporting the emotional environment.....

Some Fe I know (health) are direct, upbeat, sympathetic, understanding, warm. Some others, unhealthy are manipulative (mainly ESFJ), try to get attention, can be aggressive and very unhealthy

can even bully who (in this case I think it is "what") they think is weak !

Sounds more like unhealthy ESFJs, but I could see that in a very unhealthy ENFJ. I recently saw a unhealthy ESFJ act like this...... not good.

Fe is real. It isn't artificial or fake. My sunny disposition is authentic. Fe isn't an exterior add on to me.

I like this. That is true to healthy types again, as usual. Do you sometimes use tricks to get someone's attention ? Your wife attention maybe ?

No tricks. I don't do that. Seems to fit EXTPs more or very unhealthy EXFJs

When Fi users push their shit on others, they are essentially accessing shadow Fe. Doing it badly is extremely painful to others.

I don't have any idea of what Fi shit could be What do you wall "shadow Fe" ?

Have you never yelled and screamed at people? Or just been extremely upset?

Around a Fi user, if they are upset, I feel the volcano inside them. When they express it to others (sometimes called Fi venting), it is pushing their internal emotional garbage out, indiscriminately.

My ENTJ friend is very mild mannered, but he explodes at his ISFJ wife once a week. He says it just builds up and he needs to let it out and directs it at her. They have been near divorce several times and he is just now beginning to understand how insensitive and mean he has been for 15 years....

My ESFP SIL is fun and happy and easy going, until she isn't. At that point, it is run and hide time.

I don't know a Fi user that doesn't turn into Mr or Ms Nasty occasionally. It is pushing internal feelings out, effectively accessing a shadow form of the function.

And doing so is actually painful to Fe.

Fe users looking inside is similar. I don't naturally listen to my feelings. As I have turned my Fe innerward, I have been exploring my inner feelings. It has been a changing experience.

So much is unconscious, but is virtually written all over your face.

I hope it isn't the same with Fi as a secondary function...... I hate people reading me unless I choose to do so.

I read everyone. I don't know if SFJs are as insightful as NFJs. The ESFJs I know well are very in tune to the emotional environment, but seem to lack some of precision of understanding.

But, yes, you really can't hide anything......

Is the turn because they don't take the time to talk to you about your needs and tastes, or because they are wrong?

BOTH

I have learned that I need to take the time to listen to her rather than immediately solve all problems before she realizes that she has problems.
If she trusts you this way it is good for you two.
I don't work this way and I become very angry if a man tries to solve my problems before I can talk to him about them.

And if a woman does? No reason to make this a male/female issue.

But that is the rub. If I see the problem days, weeks, hours, etc before someone even realizes, should I just let it go? Should I ignore the trainwreck that is coming? Or should I work to minimize the problem?

Being heard is very important, I know.....but would be upset if you found out after the fact that the entire problem could have been avoided, and the ENFJ didn't do so just to respect your space?

I battle with this subject often. I can prevent huge problems my wife runs into, but I hold back to not step on her toes......

We are usually very in touch with our values and ideals.We have lots of meaningful and deep conversations on such.
I guess this is as important for Fe as for Fi. Am I wrong ?

I don't find SFPs very interested in abstract deep conversations, or revealling conversations. Just not the style of every SFP in my life....

NFPs seem to care about meaningful conversations as much as NFJs, and ENTPs and NTJs as well.

Maybe we just have different definition of deep and meaningful, because I rarely ever have one with a S......

The contradiction! You don't want to display your feelings but are upset that Fe doms hide their own...... hmmmmm. My feelings are extremely precious to me, as are the feelings of others.
NO.
That depends on the situation and the person that is with me.
I didn't write the word "upset", did I ? I just expressed the idea that Fe tend to guess my feelings instead of ASKING the right questions
Maybe I didn't express it into a good english
To give you more details : when I am with someone I trust I don't need to test, protect my feelings, think someone can judge me as weak, know I can joke around, I can just be myself and I'm very generous.
When I'm with someone I don't know yet, that all depends of my intuition and how clear the other person is to me. I'll wait for the other person to express himself/herself so I can know what are his/her values.
I behave the same in the groups I belong to. I feel people's intentions very fast and I observe their qualities. I never judge but I make precise choices based on my preferences and what is fair to me.
When you write the word "contradiction" that is only one for the outside world ! Not for me. In fact, it is the way I feel.

The contradiction I see is you want something from Fe doms you don't seem to be willing to give yourself. Why should a Fe dom give you inner feelings for you to read? I can be in a world of extreme emotional pain, but if good luck finding that. I can cover it up pretty well.....

Does my wife's Fi help me to know my needs? Hell, no. Does turning Fe inward and exploring my depths help me? Yes.
That is interesting. I have noticed healthy Fe enjoy Fi and find it funny and intriguing. I'm curious to about Fe and how you use your dom function to explore your depths.

Some say we have 8 functions, others 4. Either way, we can access the opposite orientation. A Fi dom can access shadow Fe (either turning Fi outward or using the opposite function), and interact with others using something that looks like Fe.

Your shadow is there, just hard to use consciously.

Fi refusing to open up is extremely frustrating.

That is why my partner must encourage me to express my feelings. I don't do it automatically and never will.
I can express my tastes, like sand dislikes, intellectual interests, what I've planned to do and so on.
Feelings are like jewels, you don't put them in anybody's hands, anywhere, or just for fun...
Unless I'm on stage... And here Se will help me a lot !

Well, my wife of 21 years struggles to express her feelings and it is challenging for my marriage, to say the least.......

 

[RedAmazoneFriendZone]

Intense emotions touch me directly.....

If that is true to most Fe dom I guess... I understand why they feel "kind of frustrated" when they feel some "volcano" are boiling inside but... aren't satisfied because it does not

Have you never yelled and screamed at people? Or just been extremely upset?

Yes I can be. Mainly in my intimate relationships. I have plenty of stories aside...


My ENTJ friend is very mild mannered, but he explodes at his ISFJ wife once a week. He says it just builds up and he needs to let it out and directs it at her. They have been near divorce several times and he is just now beginning to understand how insensitive and mean he has been for 15 years....

Poor ISFJ I think after my bad experiences (2years) I could only go away from ENTJ. For my own good.
They (Or should I say he used to...) rationalise our feelings, minimise them, scratch them, mock at them, disrespect them totally.
Fights all year long. Superiority complex on his side and pride.
Maybe here again that is a question of healthy/unhealthy and what we consciously/unconsciously look for in a relationship.

After him, I had peace and harmony with my ISFP lover. Another planet. No fight. Understanding...

Being heard is very important, I know.....but would be upset if you found out after the fact that the entire problem could have been avoided, and the ENFJ didn't do so just to respect your space?

Maybe we just have different definition of deep and meaningful, because I rarely ever have one with a S......

Probably.... I can have a meaningful conversation depending on the person's sensitivity, confidence, generosity, and spirituality much more than based on any "s" or "n" criteria.
That isn't relevent to me.
I follow my own instinct...

Why should a Fe dom give you inner feelings for you to read? I can be in a world of extreme emotional pain, but if good luck finding that. I can cover it up pretty well.....
Once again : NO. This is not what I said. That is your own interpretation (no offense).
I am trying to understand in the most precise way some experiences about Fe dom with Fi dom and I thank you anyway for your own stories.
I never expect to receive something FROM THE OUTSIDE. Truth and love, security and care are inside of me. I know it too well and this is MY JEWEL
I probably need people to express their feelings, opinions, and be receptive in an authentic way with their own and "free style" to feel good with my surrounding...


Some say we have 8 functions, others 4. Either way, we can access the opposite orientation. A Fi dom can access shadow Fe (either turning Fi outward or using the opposite function), and interact with others using something that looks like Fe.

Your shadow is there, just hard to use consciously.

That is new to me. I don't see how I could use my Fi outward. I think my Fi helps people to have their own values respected, to make them reflect over their values, to makes them develop new strength pillars
in their own life, to become proud of who they are, to respect their body their mind, their heart.

We are probably automatically attracted to our shadow...in a way or another...