[INFJ] When an INFJ doorslams you / cuts you out of their life / breaks off contact

[cascadeco]

I don't think you're going to get a whole lot of feedback, because for one you posted virtually the same thing months ago and got feedback from some people on it. For another thing, yes, you keep writing the same thing over and over again. Also, a lot of what you write about this person goes outside the bounds of mbti, and is highly specific in nature to the problems you are having, ie financials, so-called narcissism, etc etc. Mbti doesn't get that specific. What you're describing doesn't sound all that different from a divorce, honestly.

Finally, you write about how she's low-level, how you'd like to make her a better person, how maybe there's hope, how you think a peaceful solution could be reached, how you keep trying to bring her back into your life, how you care for her, you, you, you. How sadly it might become a legal situation... blah. Well, MAKE it a legal situation!! Who cares? If she doesn't want you in her life, she doesn't want you in her life. End of story. It seems very cut and dry to me. She's moved on, you're speculating and psycho-analyzing for months on end about why she's doing what she's doing, just cut her off and move on with your life. Why agonize over maybe somehow bringing her back to a peaceful solution when she's for all intents and purposes done with you and the relationship? And why are you so invested in her anymore anyway if she's so low-level and narcissitic in the first place? Why are you holding onto someone like that? Actually, don't answer that -that's merely food for thought. You haven't moved on / proceeded legally because somehow it's more important to you to hold onto the possibility of resolution, and your 'love' for her, while spinning her side in a wholly negative light.

I called to tell her I loved her, that she is my best friend, that it's okay, that I'd help her get the help she needs, that I'd be happy to work with her together on an every day communicating basis so that we both can be mutually happy, whatever that may be.

Again, this is you - all of your needs/desires. It seems somewhat evident based on her responses that you aren't her best friend, that she wouldn't be happy working with you, that she doesn't want to communicate every day, and that she won't be happy even if you would be.

You can call it anything you want, you can personally theorize that she's gravely harming herself, but honestly... it's her life. Take what she's doing as Fact, and if it's harming you, then do something about it. Take legal action. Be done with it already.

 

[Starry]

...exact same post over and over again...

Dude…it is so very rare that anything on this site causes me to have an emotional reaction…but as an ENFP and an individual that has been in the same position you are in with an INFJ that I love with every ounce of my being…I must say I find your posts insulting…and I am having a difficult time ascertaining who the true Narcissist is in this scenario.

If anyone ever talked about me in the way you speak of your INFJ…I would doorslam his ass as well.

It appears that she has given you her answer. If you truly have a financial concern that needs immediate attention (and not just using this as a way to strong-arm her back into a relationship with you)…then this is what you say: ‘I love you. But as I’m sure you understand…I need to proceed with [insert legal action]’. And then you leave her alone.

 

[BalanceFind]

I appreciate all feedback, even negative. I don't abandon people in life. It's not something I do. Due to stress obatained in a variety of ways, the infj I know spiraled downward in a bad way. Much of it was concealed. As stated this is someone I've known 9 years. She panicked because she didn't think she'd be able to pull off a few large projects. I financially backed these projects with her. She got in over her head financially instead of taking a more balanced less self indulgent approach. She did this because of different stressors. It hadn't been an issue in the past. I was not expecting a door slam after I helped her with these projects. I am a part owner in these projects that we share. She unexpectedly vanished into thin air shortly after the completion of these projects. She did this immediately after I said I would not be able or willing to continue to spend at the level she was doing. It was out of control self-indulgence. In the past she was more balanced than that. She has refused to get a handle on her spending. She is desperately trying keep up a high profile image. She doesn't need to do that. I could have immediately made it a nasty adversarial situation. I didn't. I wanted a peaceful resolution. I am being blocked from things that are rightfully mine. I am being blocked because I have cut off financial contributions. She wanted to do these projects on her own. She got in over her head. I helped her as much as I possibly could in the process. Now she vanished because instead of controlling spending, she sees money with me not going to be there in same way any longer. Now I'm forced to confront the matter. I do care about her. I know she is a good person who has gotten into trouble. However I don't seem to be able to communicate with her. I came here to help myself and to help others. I am not interested in making it an adversarial legal situation because I know that it could be resolved more peacefully. And yes, I am financially unable to walk away from all of it, without doing harm to myself. I never said I was without fault. I am however under a lot of pressure to take care of this situation. If it was all about me, I would have taken legal action 5 months ago. If was all about me, I wouldn't have helped in the first place. If it was all about me, I wouldn't have come here in the first place. Previously I was told I wasn't providing enough background information. So, I gave as much as possible this time. I'll take the replies into consideration. In terms of repeating myself, I'm willing to do that, and take some heat for it. My goal is to help two people, someone else and myself come up with a win/win solution, to a difficult, stressful, immediate situation.

 

[ilovelurking]

What it seems to me is that you're trying to help someone who doesn't want your help. This is beyond MBTI.

Sure you're not without flaw and so does she - noone in this world is. This isn't about not abandoning anyone in your Life. This is about cutting the fat - and no matter how unhealthy your INFJ may seem to you, she is cutting you out because in her reality you're the fat.

If you're financially unable to walk away from it - do something to get the money back. You can always ask for your money back and since you're an entrepreneur, have firm belief in your business. Consider the possibility of being able to make that money back no matter how big or small the amount is - with or without her assistance. You can choose the timeframe in getting your money back - immediate or in installments, with or without a lawyer it is all up to you since it is your money.

Just do something instead of analysing.

 

[BalanceFind]

Thx for the feedback. I did make the decision to go there but there is a waiting period so the cost of the trip is less expensive.

At first I was trying to figure out what happened. Now, I am more certain of what happened. That's a good start. Problem is I'm scared that she could sink to even lower levels of anger, retaliation, etc...because she is unstable. I am not used to that. If I come on strong, I don't want to make it worse for me or her. Believe it or not, as an Entp/Enfp I'm showing quite a bit of restraint here.

Her brief contact with me only stated: "You'll get your money when I (she) can get it to me." I didn't even say what I wanted on the phone. I hadn't even said a word. So, she is aware that she did this. Our local friends there don't get back to me which is highly unusual. They previously reach out to me first often. I believe she has something to do with that. It's another of my list of things to take care of...

Again, I appreciate the feedback. I believe I understand it better now and I have a plan. It took a lot for me to contact a mutual friend to explain the situation. I waited 5 months to do that. I've gone from wanting the relationship to work, to wanting to help her no matter what, to making sure protect myself first while hoping to help her too.

I had to retrace things. Isolation/long distance, and some other things caused her stress. This caused her self-indulgence. But this time it spiraled out of control. Her door slam occurred immediately after I cut her off from large financial contributions. Previously we were 50/50 generous with each other. Then I helped her in big ways to keep some things going...but I wanted to get things back to more balanced in terms of self-indulgence and she kept going the other way. I leave town, then surprise door slam. The shock and pain was overwhelming and still is....but because I care I thought of her first. Call me naïve, etc...but I gave her time and space, blamed myself too much, all those things. In reality, blame is shared, and communication poor. As stated she believes she has to live up to an extravagant image. She believes it more when under stress. After 5 months, she's still in that phase or state of mind. It might not be long for an infj, but my regret is not doing this after 1 month tops.

Maybe others can learn from my mistakes. I wish I knew better how to reach/connect with someone who is going through a bad narcissistic way ruinging relationships, finances, etc...all to maintain an image of success. That is what is going on her.e. I still won't abandon her in life. I will protect myself, and cut her off financially, and retrieve what is mine...but in life and as a person, I won't cut her off. I knew the person she was before for a long time. There is hope for anyone in life. I'll just have to do it with less trust and more from a distance. I'm not ruthless, I don't just pick up and disgard people. And prior to this for the 9 years I've known her, neither did she. But she's doing it now, and not just with me. Thanks again.

 

[PeaceBaby]

I sense there's way more to this story than you're offering ... if you really wish sound advice, you need to stop offering your projections as fact.

 

[Ivy]

Agreed. I also do not understand why you are still referring to her as your girlfriend- she seems to have broken up with you, pretty unmistakably.

 

[BalanceFind]

So it's okay for you to make projections but not me? You can project that this infj is no longer my girlfriend despite no conversation or indication otherwise. I'm so supposed to project that. But I'm not allowed to do that with anything else? Every single post here could be true or false or both, etc...and it's up to the posters to believe or not believe what he/she reads. In terms of that topic, she really isn't a girlfriend or ex-girlfriend until things get resolved. I used the term girlfriend or infj to identify her for purposes of posting.

Door slamming imo is a poor choice under all circumstances. It's anyone's right to do so. But that person will eventually have to deal with the consequences of disappearing without resolving issues. And, that person doesn't always get to decide when to do so on his/her time. I was trying to avoid a lose/lose situation.

There is always more to any story. But I'm comfortable with what I've shared and can freely answer any specific question. I have nothing to hide in the situation.

If it makes you feel any better, I have had plenty of self questioning and self-blame. But I've concluded that regardless of anything in my particular situation, the door slam has been and still is a disaster, not just for me, but for her as well.

As I stated before, I'm not without fault. I have many. I make mistakes daily. I'm very self-aware. Once every blue moon, an emergency can cause one to be more aggressive seeking answers. Apologies for egocentricity in terms of posting here. Thankfully, for me it's only during times of unique next to never stress. Remember, I've waited 5 months to speak because I hoped that after some time she'd resolve these issues. She referenced that she would actions are showing that was just repeated stall tactics.. I've had many cross sections of emotions. But I've decided I've had enough. I was hoping to avoid uneccessary problems and hassles for her and me. I've even wanted the relationship to work for much of this time. My focus has shifted to how to approach someone who has vanished in a door slam. Directly, indirectly, etc...and all of those types of things. Warning, without warning etc....I have had the extra challenge of very long distance. But not for much longer. Thanks.

 

[Ivy]

I would say not speaking to you for five months IS an indication otherwise.

 

[ilovelurking]

I don't know about other INFJs but for me, if I clearly have not made any effort to communicate (not even a hint) in weeks - that would mean I'm over it and have moved on with no thoughts of a particular person 24/7 anymore.

Your intentions are good - I can sense it but it's time to really move on with what's at hand eg. your finances. Your INFJ can take care of herself and if she is meant to be in your Life, she'll make an effort to show up, send a message etc.

 

[Fidelia]

Agreed. The more you keep stirring things up, the more you will either annoy her (and make her less cooperative) or the more emotional white noise you will create (which requires absence from you to deal with). Either way, give her some space and do what you have to do legally to deal with the money end of things.

 

[BalanceFind]

Thanks for the feedback. Imo, her increased stress put a lot of pressure on my last visit to be perfect. She wasn't "right" in that the most minor things upset her much more than usual. The "roughing it" for a long time was unusual and I know how infj's are particular about their surroundings. I respect that. I was proud of her. But it got to be too much too long for her. She started becoming jealous of our local friends in another country and their perceived happiness. As I stated, these conditions, combined with long distance put a lot of increased pressure on my visits. She was irrationally scared to pull off some of the financial situations where she needed me. In the past we both had a 50/50 financial relationship. Never an issue except when once in a while she spent more money than she could afford to spend. But she previously reeled it in enough. We had exactly one time where she asked when she'd be getting another large sum of money for something, and I snapped back briefly hurt by her asking and stunned by her asking. I said don't you realize how hard I worked to get you the other stuff. I said there wouldn't be more any time soon. But there would be down the road. I wasn't playing games, it was all I could do at the time. The sad thing is she was very comortable upper middle class. It wasn't enough for her.

So, she didn't set out to use me for money. But because of stress for a variety of reasons, mostly her doing, but some me too, she was in a bad self-indulgent way. It was not possible to politely stop her spending. I knew her wrath would be great because I knew she wasn't being herself.

Multiple people have said give time and space. Problem is I have no idea what she is doing with that. She is living in a home that is part mine. We both worked years for it. She has said something to our friends because out of the blue they now won't get back to me. She also has a language advantage with them. In essence she has ruined the last 5 months of my life.

My regret at this time is that I waited this long. I should have turned right around imo and flew back within a weeks and taken care of it. This is clearly a situation where she thinks she can act like some of these things are hers that aren't. She was willing to exploit me out of her being in a bad way.

After 5 months, her only words to me was I'll get my money some time. ? She didn't even know what I wanted. I wanted to know she was alive, safe where she was all those things. I have every intention of living in our new home there. The way she spoke it was as if it was hers and she'll just maybe pay me when she felt like it. It was delusional.

It's easy to read thi stuff and say what's the problem? Take legal action cut her off. And, it looks headed that way. But as I said, 9 yrs, I know the high functioning infj that she has been most of that time. She has been acting like a low functioning Estp. Ruthless, surprise. I can't get her to sit down with me and happily peacefully calmly go over things and work things out for both. I'd be happy to do that. But I no longer have time, I no longer will allow her to speak ill of me to others if she is doing that too....without me clearing that up with those people. 5 months. She has no change. Defensive, anger, covering her tracks.

No, I don't have any more time for time and space. The reason is I'm not convinced she wouldn't just vanish permanently which would destroy my life even more.

 

[iwakar]

Your need to continue providing more detail and context and information long after the point of outside perspective has been achieved gives readers here the impression that you need our agreement and approval and sympathy with your perspective more. If I was you, I'd be asking myself why that is.

 

[Fidelia]

Whether you feel you can explain her inconsiderate behaviour as the result of stress or not, it does not change the result. She's had ample time to deal with the financial end of things, she's proven herself somewhat irresponsible with money in the past (even if for explainable reasons) and has occasionally taken you for granted. Given the fact that she has given you no plan for getting back the money and has cut off contact with you, I believe the only option you have left is to either forget about the money (which you can't afford to do), or else take legal action to arrange a repayment plan.

I understand what it is like to watch someone you love not doing well and treating you badly in the process. It's very difficult to walk away from the personal investment, but at some point you have to face that the person does not have the personal resources to carry on a relationship at that time and that they also are not acting with your best interests in mind. I would have never dreamed that my boyfriend of five years would blatantly lie about me or that he would behave as he did twoards the end. I didn't want to believe my judgement was that bad, I truly cared about his well-being and I could see that he was imploding. He acted out of character not only towards me but at work and towards his friends. His good moments made me believe that his real feelings were deep and sincere and that the investment I had made would not be wasted if I waited a little longer. Ultimately though, it didn't change the fact that we could not carry on a reciprocal or healthy relationship and I needed to get out.

I just don't understand what you are seeking from the people here, as the situation seems pretty clear and no matter what other details you include, it still indicates that probably the relationship is over and you need to cut your losses in whatever way you see fit.

 

[BalanceFind]

Thanks for the feedback. I'm not seeking agreement or approval, more insight I suppose.

I'm very familiar with the Enneagram, and she's a 4w3. Her behavior is text book level 6 and level of Enneagram 4 and 3. She's never been at the low levels of those with me.

I suppose what I am trying to do is help her and myself at the same time. I would say I've gone from walking on egg shells to a very real fear that she is in an unstable phase where she is willing to say anything and do anything to protect a false image to others. If that means throw me under the bus then so be it.

When an infj door slams, which is new for me, he/she doesn't check in at all and assumes the other person's thoughts, feelings, behavior. And in this case she has assumed wrong. She thinks I'm out for retaliation for what she did to me. She doesn't understand that I do want to help her, but I have a responsibility to myself and others to protect myself too.

I spoke with her again on phone Internationally. A bit longer, and it was mostly rage, anger, defensive from her. I tried to tell her that she has assumed wrong. I tried to tell her what I wanted and needed to do. She kept repeating that she has been working hard to get me money, blaming me for bothering her. I waited 5 months to "bother" her. When I told her I had every right to live in our new home, she said no I didn't. I'm afraid to even go there without other people at this point who are either friends, or business and legal people.

There has to be a way to "reach" an unhealthy troubled Infj 4w3. She's still at that I don't have to answer to anyone stage of defiance, anger. 100 percent self absorbed. I tried to inform her of our friend's death, and something else. She paused for a 5 seconds and said "I'm sorry" and went straight back to other things. I gave her other 3rd party good news, same result, less seconds of that's good, I'm happy for them. Then it was right back to her being mad at the world.

I don't trust her at this point. I also will not throw away my and our hard work in that country and just leave. That's an unrealistic request of hers.

She is angry and blaming me for all of her troubles. Generally if we were both local, and no other loose ends. I'd walk away and she may or may not reappear months or years down the road. I don't have any more time. So I have to now force confrontation, something she doesn't handle well as an Infj. I've tried every kind way I know. It's just very frustrating.

 

[Vasilisa]

I suppose what I am trying to do is help her and myself at the same time. I would say I've gone from walking on egg shells to a very real fear that she is in an unstable phase where she is willing to say anything and do anything to protect a false image to others. If that means throw me under the bus then so be it.

Hey everyone!! I am in a relationship with an INFJ and really would like INFJ help here.

I recently notice I don't feel as secure around my SO as I usually am. It's because my SO is insecure and I believe projects this anxiety onto me. In turn she wonders why I am insecure then her empathy locks on to my 'pseudo' insecurity and the downward spiral is on.

Now, I just want to love her.

BalanceFind and Lenian should commiserate. You two have similar stories that you keep magnifying with details. Take a break from seeking validation from the INFJs in your life and on the forum. Maybe you could learn things from one another. That whole no door (slammed) shut, without a window being opened kind of thing. Let the window be self awareness and insight.

 

[BalanceFind]

I don't have time to step back. What a door slamming person doesn't understand is that life doesn't stop. It keeps going. There are basic rules to life that everyone must follow without exception, or there will be severe consequences.

If the above Infj, or any other Infj put him or herself in my mentioned Infj's shoes, I promise you that you would not someone to come in a cold hearted ruthless legal fashion and crush you figuratively. If the Infj thinks it's bad now, that scenario would be waaaaaaaay worse for this Infj.

It makes a lot more sense to resolve issues, loose ends in a productive way first. It also makes a lot ore sense to have the courage to re-visit hasty decisions for more productive solutions.

Helping a struggling Infj from him or herself is quite the challenge. I'm not the type of person to abandon others. I know it's a bad low level Estp phase out of fear of deprivation. I can't stop it, but I know what it is...And I know enough to know that some day, she'll have many regrets about this behavior. She is after all an Infj.

Sure, the type of relationship would change, but I don't care for people, and then throw them away like a gum wrapper. That just isn't who I am as a person. I wanted to avoid legal action, crushing the Infj even more than the misery she is going through right now.

As stated before, it is anyone's right to door slam, but there will always be consequences to doing so. In this case, harsh confrontational consequences, deprivation and all the things feared that easily could have been avoided.

 

[cascadeco]

1.All of this goes WAAAYYYY beyond the lovely doorslamming concept and infj's in general. You're talking about a Business+Financial+Properties+Personal relationship gone amuk, and which began going amuk prior to her supposed grand finale 'doorslam'.
2. All of your 'care'/concerns for her are tied up in business/money . I don't even think you've mentioned any of her good qualities, actually - her supposed 'healthy' phase of 9 years is only in the context of how the business was going and money usage, and her actions being convenient and alligning with your own interests.

When an infj door slams, which is new for me, he/she doesn't check in at all and assumes the other person's thoughts, feelings, behavior.

3.No. This isn't a cut and dry concept. I'm also tired of being associated with your notions of what an infj is, and what 'doorslamming' is.

4.Because your grievances are pretty much only tied to your business/money/property and how you're being negatively impacted by her jumping ship, treat it as a business venture turned sour, as again, you haven't cited anything in all of your posts which highlights the actual qualities you like about her. And again, she doesn't want to be involved with you. Take care of the business.

5.I challenge you not to respond to this 'insight' (which you are seeking) with 5 more paragraphs telling us again that she's an unhealthy 4w3 infj who is being unreasonable. If you don't trust her, and if you think she's so unhealthy, then for the love of god be an adult and provide the business closure that is apparently needed. This stopped being personal/truly intimate long ago, probably. And she as and adult needs to accept responsibility for the actions she's chosen to take.

 

[BalanceFind]

Fidelia provided some good help. I'm seeking strategic help based on personal experience and knowledge. I suppose I was hoping to see or hear something other than the strategy of legal action and destroying someone that I don't want to destroy.

As for the immediate above,
"Be an adult." It doesn't make me less of an adult to want to exhaust every other strategy or possibility first. The best solutions aren't always easy to find. To me, there has to be something in between do nothing and legal action. An extreme solution will not benefit anyone in this situation, a situation which involves far more than two people as well.

 

[Lenian]

That whole no door (slammed) shut, without a window being opened kind of thing. Let the window be self awareness and insight.

I'm sorry...I'm afraid you've got it wrong or don't see it entirely..which was never the point.

Forums to some are for general ideas..and I wasn't expecting any person to be general manager of the universe. But thanks.