Z Buck McFate
Pepperidge Farm remembers.
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2009
- Messages
- 6,050
- Enneagram
- 5w4
- Instinctual Variant
- sx/sp
Interesting ... Let me clarify first: Are you saying I want reciprocity but how could I want that if I didn't notice or wasn't keeping score?
Basically, yes.
I think in very basic human terms (outside of Fe or Fi exclusivity), if dealing with someone requires attending to their needs (and humoring the ‘courtesy’ they provide as if it’s really a courtesy and not some obligation they are imposing on you) in a manner disproportionate with having needs met in return- that’s a problem. The reason it’s a good idea to “keep score†is because if someone is more draining than not, it probably shouldn’t go ignored. It is my experience that Fi'ers are every bit as capable of thinking they are doing a 'courtesy' (which in reality works out to be an imposition, more taxing than not) as Fe'ers are- so I was wondering exactly what separates the Fi expectation of "reciprocity" from when a Fe'er expects "reciprocity". Imo- it just seems to me there should be a genuinely respectful common denominator that has nothing to do with type.
But maybe nevermind my question because I'm not sure I'm following what exactly is meant here by “emotional currency†anyway.
eta:When someone only does things or expresses care for someone else for the returns it brings them, yeah, that’s the very definition of narcissism. I believe this is true regardless of a person’s “typeâ€: the more someone does something out of a genuine desire to provide a ‘courtesy’ or to express caring or good will, the less they will need “reciprocityâ€. At the same time: the less reciprocity genuinely surfaces on it’s own during repeated interaction with someone, that’s probably a red flag to back away from a relationship because it’s very possibly one-sided.
The thing that is somewhat stuck in my craw in this conversation is that it seems like Fi’ers are jumping on “I pay attention to how much reciprocity happens in interaction with someone†as if merely paying attention is a horrible Fe thing and necessarily implies that someone is in the interaction for the gains they may get. But that’s not the only reason to pay attention. Js take note simply because we unconsciously take note of pretty much everything, as fia has already said. [And frankly, it seems to me like I’m hearing it loosely implied that Fi’ers are less likely to use other people in a narcissistic way- which is the part that’s annoying me.]
Regarding my reaction to the tomatoes: I don't think it's a so dom thing. Just like the tier thing helps me decide on how much I trust certain advice, etc, I also think to past experiences and how the outcome worked out for everyone and calibrate my reaction to the situation. So if offered free tomatoes by one person, I might take them. From someone who turns it into a huge obligation, I would politely refuse or else just leave the plans hazy enough that unless the other person did something, the exchange would never come about. Ni is a big part of that whole process though.
The so dom thing occurred to me because (I wondered if) maybe it seemed like the lesser of two evils to be super diplomatic about it. I wish I had that priority of saying things in a more diplomatic way- both Fi'ers and Fe'ers who are more at the influence of so variant tend to be more careful about this. I'm sure having "so dominant" brought up gets old (sorry). (I actually do wish I felt it regularly as more of a priority myself though.)
Yes, I think the whole Ni tier thing would create an aversion to being backed into that tomato corner from the very first time it happened (even if it was simply witnessing someone else get backed into that corner). If it's someone I didn't know particularly well, then I'd do my best to politely decline and then avoid the person/situation too. If it's someone I can't really avoid, then I'll flat out say why I refuse to participate in it (though I am very careful and still try to personalize how much I really need to say based on how much I suspect they'll actually be able to hear and use- if I’m saying something ‘for me’ instead of ‘for them’, then it’s just mean). I think the reason I do this is because if the tables were turned, I'd be sorta aghast to find out someone was 'pretending' to appreciate the tomatoes and secretly harboring resentment about it- I feel like I owe it to people to be upfront. My very first option, though, is to try to politely back away/avoid.