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Trump vs. Biden

FemMecha

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The secret Trump voter exists because of discrimination, not because its fun.
i thought you said elsewhere that you enjoy Trump's trolling persona and behaviors. That sounds like it fits with the "tossing a brick into the machine" metaphor. When I Read TT's post I remembered some conversations with your posts fitting that description quite well. So fun or not it can give that impression to others.
 

Virtual ghost

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This is slowly but surely starting to turn onto 2000 elections on steroids. What is actually the worst option that is on the table.
 

Maou

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i thought you said elsewhere that you enjoy Trump's trolling persona and behaviors. That sounds like it fits with the "tossing a brick into the machine" metaphor. When I Read TT's post I remembered some conversations with your posts fitting that description quite well. So fun or not it can give that impression to others.

I'm talking about why people don't openly support Trump in public, not why they vote for him. Also, they are not exclusive. Some Trump supporters might wanna throw off the polls, others don't care. Either way, both groups can be discriminated against. Especially in Liberal areas.
 

Red Herring

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The fat lady isn't singing.

123973994_1461141700943664_2385818188164434670_n.jpg


electoral victory
counting all votes
 

Virtual ghost

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It would be kinda ironic that Biden takes victory due to the having 0.2% wins in rust belt. (what seems to be on the table)
 
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It would be kinda ironic that Biden takes victory due to the having 0.2% wins in rust belt. (what seems to be on the table)

He's currently up in Michigan. I understand most of the uncounted ballots are in Detroit and other "Democrat" areas. Michigan is really more important than Pennsylvania right now. Since he won Arizona and the one district in Nebraska, assuming he wins Nevada, he'll squeak by even if Pennsylvania doesn't come through.

If Michigan and Nevada maintain or grow their leads, we should still be able to do some fun Hunger Games stuff.
 
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i thought you said elsewhere that you enjoy Trump's trolling persona and behaviors. That sounds like it fits with the "tossing a brick into the machine" metaphor. When I Read TT's post I remembered some conversations with your posts fitting that description quite well. So fun or not it can give that impression to others.

Trolling does tend to have social repercussions that one should take into account when engaging in or openly encouraging such behavior. People should accept personal responsibility at the very least if they're going to do it. I don't have a great deal of sympathy with people being bullied because they're Trump supporters. It might make sense to consider the fact that antagonizing people for fun might have negative repercussions.
 

Maou

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Trolling does tend to have social repercussions that one should take into account when engaging in or openly encouraging such behavior. People should accept personal responsibility at the very least if they're going to do it. I don't have a great deal of sympathy with people being bullied because they're Trump supporters. It might make sense to consider the fact that antagonizing people for fun might have negative repercussions.

You're overgeneralizing.

- - - Updated - - -

Biden is going to win, Trump gonna ask for a recount due to several reported cases of fraud. I hope you guys are ready.
 
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You're overgeneralizing.

- - - Updated - - -

Biden is going to win, Trump gonna ask for a recount due to several reported cases of fraud. I hope you guys are ready.

If that happens and it works, you can bet the bullying of Trump supporters is going to get way worse. We'd also start seeing more stuff like what happened in the Northwest over the summer. People scared of socialism should not be hoping for that outcome.
 

Maou

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I just know that people who enjoy trolling and owning people shouldn't whine when that behavior rebounds back at them. It's childish and hardly worthy of my respect.

This just proves how little you know of actual Trump supporters. Most are just normal everyday people.
 

Virtual ghost

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He's currently up in Michigan. I understand most of the uncounted ballots are in Detroit and other "Democrat" areas. Michigan is really more important than Pennsylvania right now. Since he won Arizona and the one district in Nebraska, assuming he wins Nevada, he'll squeak by even if Pennsylvania doesn't come through.

Then we can do fun Hunger Games stuff.


I know and that tiny Nebraska district opening a path is evidently half bizarre element.
Although Georgia isn't fully done either the last time I checked.
 

Kingu Kurimuzon

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The secret Trump voter exists because of discrimination, not because its fun.
i thought you said elsewhere that you enjoy Trump's trolling persona and behaviors. That sounds like it fits with the "tossing a brick into the machine" metaphor. When I Read TT's post I remembered some conversations with your posts fitting that description quite well. So fun or not it can give that impression to others.

-I do think that to some extent, anti-Trump voter sentiment might have led many Trump voters to be more reticent in sharing their true intentions.

-But I think there's a smaller number who really do take some glee in fucking with the system any way they can.

Difficult to know how many of either reticent or "trickster" Trump supporters, because it's not like a poll would give an accurate picture.


It's a combination of factors that likely explain the polling errors since 2016, so I wouldn't say it's just the above two reasons. But that is certainly a part of it.

This is slowly but surely starting to turn onto 2000 elections on steroids. What is actually the worst option that is on the table.

I think it will be decided by the end of this week. There are still, what, 30 million votes uncounted? And it seems like the odds favor a majority of those going to Biden. Might be early next week. Stay tuned.
 

Dreamer

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I’m not sure. Some of my sources have huge expected gains for Biden in outstanding absentee ballots, which are counted later in rust belt, GA and NV. It is not out of the realm of possibility that Biden actually wins this thing with 306 electoral votes.

Of course Trump can win. If he does, he’ll likely have lost the popular vote by an even larger margin than in 2016, and will come in under 300 EV’s.

I think people underestimated the different voting preferences for Dems (absentee) vs. Reps (in person). The urban/rural divide seems larger than ever, and we’re going to have to figure out as a country how to work together and appreciate each other’s differences. We are a divided nation, but there is potential for reconciliation.

Absolutely. This is much needed regardless who wins. Hyperbolic word vomit can be fun and entertaining across media before the election and drives up ratings and activities through the roof, but when all is said and done, are we still left with a country with effectively two oposing sides? Certainly within either side there is only a handful of the voting block that actually believes the other side to be the devil incarnate, but this sort of resentment and hate over being unable, unwilling, to see from differing perspectives is what is troubling to me the most. Have we become so intolerant? How can we expect our country to thrive if many of us are unwilling to compromise or work with those they presume to be actual Satin?

Whatever the results bring, it is imperative we move past this as a country through inspection and by recalling our most basic shared values as a country that DOES unite us.
 
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Whatever the results bring, it is imperative we move past this as a country through inspection and by recalling our most basic shared values as a country that DOES unite us.

What shared values? I recall lots of people on the other side were pretty happy with the murder of unarmed protestors over the summer.

It would be great if we could all come together. Sadly, the facts on the table do not suggest that is possible.
 

FemMecha

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Trolling does tend to have social repercussions that one should take into account when engaging in or openly encouraging such behavior. People should accept personal responsibility at the very least if they're going to do it. I don't have a great deal of sympathy with people being bullied because they're Trump supporters. It might make sense to consider the fact that antagonizing people for fun might have negative repercussions.
This is a complicated issue. There is a way that a lot of Trump supporters feel persecuted, but I think there are a number of factors to consider.

Firstly, I've mentioned elsewhere that I think Trump appeals to people inside bullying culture because his persona feels like strength to them, and it is typically familiar and similar to the behavior of parents and authority that bullied them. So a person who feels powerless on the inside from living in bullying culture can feel stronger attaching themselves to Trump's archetype. It provides a way for them to become the dominant bully instead of victim in their self identity. Of course this is not consciously done, but it is a paradigm intimately fused with individual feeling of persecution and powerlessness.

Secondly, it is common in religious extremist ideology to feel persecuted by the outside. This is what drives these groups to be intensely insider and stocking up on weapons. The extreme right militias and religious groups already have persecution narratives that bind the group identity and unity. These transfer readily to the identity of Trump supporter. This is about feelings of group persecution requiring overcompensation to reclaim power.

Thirdly, there is a trend right now for Liberals to unfriend anyone who is a Trump supporter. They see it as crossing moral line while the Trump supporter sees it as a legitimate political option as neutral conceptually as choosing a brand of spaghetti sauce. I do think there is a problem in Liberals shunning Trump supporters, although I will confess to recently posting a statement about explicit Trump support relating to the condoning of moral violations in both self and Trump. The Liberals that are unfriending are often connected to certain kinds of privilege. It implies a person even has the option of editing certain people out of their lives and that typically requires money and privilege to have such an option. These echo chambers will tend to leaves people on the Right feeling shunned because they are.

Finally, Trumps ideology is one of dominance for the U.S. and corporations, but it is conveyed to his base to provide feelings of individual dominance. This creates an expectation of more power than others, so even if an exchange is equal, there can be a tendency for a Trump-minded individual to feel persecuted. The entitlement for dominance over others is experienced in a way that others would experience a feeling of equality.
 

Dreamer

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What shared values? I recall lots of people on the other side were pretty happy with the murder of unarmed protestors over the summer.

It would be great if we could all come together. Sadly, the facts on the table do not suggest that is possible.

Liberty, freedom of speech, democracy, etc. Different versions of any of these terms are likely in play these days, but there are undoubtedly core values we all hold. Why do so many migrants come to seek citizenship each year? Their ideals of America are all subjective via their own life experiences, but they are also based on some truth.

Ultimately, this is a personal assessment due to the subjectivity I touched on above, so I couldn’t definitively outline all the shared values for you or anyone else.
 
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This is a complicated issue. There is a way that a lot of Trump supporters feel persecuted, but I think there are a number of factors to consider.

Firstly, I've mentioned elsewhere that I think Trump appeals to people inside bullying culture because his persona feels like strength to them, and it is typically familiar and similar to the behavior of parents and authority that bullied them. So a person who feels powerless on the inside from living in bullying culture can feel stronger attaching themselves to Trump's archetype. It provides a way for them to become the dominant bully instead of victim in their self identity. Of course this is not consciously done, but it is a paradigm intimately fused with individual feeling of persecution and powerlessness.

Secondly, it is common in religious extremist ideology to feel persecuted by the outside. This is what drives these groups to be intensely insider and stocking up on weapons. The extreme right militias and religious group already have persecution narratives that bind the group identity and unity. This transfer readily to the identity of Trump supporter. This is about feelings of group persecution requiring overcompensation to reclaim power.

Thirdly, there is a trend right now for Liberals to unfriend anyone who is a Trump supporter. They see it as crossing moral line while the Trump supporter sees it as a legitimate political option as neutral conceptually as choosing a brand of spaghetti sauce. I do think there is a problem in Liberals shunning Trump supporters, although I will confess to recently posting a statement about explicit Trump support relating to the condoning of moral violations in both self and Trump. The Liberals that are unfriending are often connected to certain kinds of privilege. It implies a person even has the option of editing certain people out of their lives and that typically requires money and privilege to have such an option. These echo chambers will tend to leaves people on the Right feeling shunned because they are.

Finally, Trumps ideology is one of dominance for the U.S. and corporations, but it is conveyed to his base to provide feelings of individual dominance. This creates an expectation of more power than others, so even if an exchange is equal, there can be a tendency for a Trump-minded individual to feel persecuted. The entitlement for dominance over others is experienced in a way that others would experience a feeling of equality.

The bolded is something I don't agree with. It just reinforces the "snowflake" thing. Just because you unfriended them doesn't make them go away. I could just feel this way because I've probably been active online longer than the average person, and I'm used to political discussions and the stuff that goes on. I also think it makes me more in touch with what people on the other side actually think. People who haven't been online as much seem to be more shocked by the kinds of things people believe, while I'm more like "they've been believing that kind of stuff for a long time before Trump."

The only unfriending that happened because of politics was when one right-wing uncle (my mom's twin!) unfriended me. I didn't unfriend the other right-wing uncle, even though, yes, he does tend to troll my rare political posts. My cousin (the suspected NTP) isn't on Facebook. I don't know if he even voted for Trump again... I got the sense he would have gone for Bernie in 2016 if he had been on the table.
 
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