[Te] Tertiary Te

[Virtual ghost]

You can also be an ENFP and don't use Te at all. I don't think everyone has the exactly the 'proper' function order.

There you go Amar, he said it before I did.

 

[PeaceBaby]

Thanks amargith for expanding on the initial issue.

I agree with AO on the breakdown of functional components at play.

Fi would have been your inner annoyance at having to do the project you have been procrastinating on. Fe would have been the snap and the outer expression of your inner frustration when nagged by your SO. Te would have been involved when you decided you were going to organize and finally execute the project. But not in the ways you FELT at the time.

My hubs is an ESTJ (Te to the max!) so I can relate a personal story to this too. We are functional opposites so to speak. And he almost always has something to contribute to "how" I decide to do things and in what order etc. My approach to this has evolved over the years to where I think I have a good strategy to handle my annoyance at continually being "second-guessed." When he starts with the Te, I ask him to expand on how he would do the whole project. He's concise anyway so this part doesn't take long. I then explain my plan to him and once he sees I have a plan to get to the same end result, he can usually step away and let me proceed as I wish. Sometimes I incorporate his ideas and sometimes I do have to say "I'm not you and you're not me and this is the way I think is best to do this." Followed with a hug and I usually end with the disclaimer "If you see me about to blow the house up please do stop me before that happens."

Te is impersonal at least from the deliverer's POV; it's our reaction to it that starts the Fe a-working. With Fi as a dominant or auxiliary function, we always do know how we feel but it takes some pushing to get that expressed out in the world as annoyance. This is likely why your SO was upset too - you probably do a good job of handling your own negative emotions and don't generally let them spill out on others.

 

[BlueScreen]

I'm afraid of using it. Really am. I..got encouraged to do so last week and was reminded of why it was I only use it when not around people and even then. It makes me feel like an elephant in a china cabinet around people. And the worst part is, that if I completely embrace it, I don't realize I was said elephant untill later on

Is this just because I have no practice? Do you gain more refined control over it if you just bite the bullet? Or is this because it's a tertiary function and I'll just have to live with it? I absolutely love Te in NTJs, and admire the way they wield it. I must look like such an amateur to them

I caused a lot of havoc learning about it, and am only just falling in love with it. But I think I like it and want it to become stronger. It's just getting how to be assertive without crossing other values is hard at first. And you tend to be either too harsh, or do nothing at all. The feedback from the other person is an extra factor to deal with too. It is not like we get to make it from a detached perspective, that whole empathy factor is still there. So it needs to be a factor in how we use it. And also learning where it is damaging and not damaging is something we need to do to be comfortable using it confidently.

 

[BerberElla]

I caused a lot of havoc learning about it, and am only just falling in love with it. But I think I like it and want it to become stronger. It's just getting how to be assertive without crossing other values is hard at first. And you tend to be either too harsh, or do nothing at all. The feedback from the other person is an extra factor to deal with too. It is not like we get to make it from a detached perspective, that whole empathy factor is still there. So it needs to be a factor in how we use it. And also learning where it is damaging and not damaging is something we need to do to be comfortable using it confidently.

Yep. It's like a target board, I fire an arrow and hope I land on the centre, which represents healthy assertiveness, but usually miss and end up somewhere in the passive circle, or the aggressive one.

Even if it's not loaded with what turned out to be an F reaction, It's still like you said, needing to factor in the other persons reaction through that damn empathy.

 

[Kalach]

Still, how do you get the best from both worlds, the tolerance of Fi towards others and the efficiency of Te instead of the perfectionism/high standards for harmony of Fi and the disregard for others from Te?

Literal best of both worlds won't ever happen. Theory says the functions aren't equal in strength and maturity and are not equally consciously accessible. Literally, says theory, one just doesn't control tertiary functions as well as one can control auxiliaries. They require more mental energy to call up, and most importantly the results are suspect if the dominant and auxiliary functions are not properly engaged first.

I don't know what this means in practice except to think that tertiary functions are like a stamp of approval, an extra layer of complexity that appears in the functioning of the whole person if the person is doing what they should do.

I figured I'd labour the point because this whole topic--auxiliary and inferior functions--is interesting: how on Earth does one have an *unconscious* function?


One specific result, or supposed observation, is when tertiary functions are called on, people get cranky much quicker. Being brusque and potentially rude isn't necessarily a feature of Te use in general, just like being cranky and dismissive isn't necessarily a feature of Fi, although it can be if INTJs are called too long to emote, yeah?


Dunno if any of that's helpful. I'm just riffin'.

 

[Amargith]

Appreciate the replies, I find it interesting that Fe has a hand in this, from your explanations.

I was aware of the fact that it wasn't 'naked' Te as AO called it, it's just that it seems to be the trigger to these kind of situations which makes me really uncomfortable. Hence I'm wondering if it is possible to learn somehow how to use this smoothly.

I have the same at work. Once I get into work, and start finishing everything and making lists etc, it aggrevates me to no end when for instance one of my collegues suddenly steals my computer while I've gone to pick up some documents from the printer, as I cannot proceed without the damned thing. I'm standing there doing nothing while my head goes 'must finish this, this and this, only have this much time left and why in the **** does she not use her own bloody pc for this!'

I don't vent this as I know that sometimes they need that pc coz they cannot access stuff from theirs or whatever and I understand where they are coming from, but it can really ruin my mood and momentum. I would love to be able to just get rid of that urge, feeling, whatever you wanna call it, while remaining productive.

 

[entropie]

When I work on something with a deadline and someone gets in my way, I reasonably and politely inform him with a dash of emphasis that I got no time atm but first thing when I am finished will be to come back to him.

That strikes me as Fe.

If someone wants me to do something, but doesnt let me work on it on my own, I listen to him and understand what he wants, then I adapt. (And I got a lot of patience)

Thats a NeTi thing. If the guy is tho persistent on making me to do it his way and really gets annoying, he can do it alone thats like a perfect natural reaction.

Whats a thing one got to learn in that department is patience. When I was young I often bombarded people with all my tricks on how to solve a problem. That was way too much information for them.

Nowadays if I see my Dad trieing to get onto an internet site on the Computer, what gives me the creeps, I slowly guide him there. And with every lesson he has, I give him an occasional hint or shortcut and he remembers.

So patience is one of the great virtues that comes to one life when gettin older and if it doesnt one should develop it.

I dont know how this is related in any way to the OP . But I think gettin angry or out of line, is neither an indicator for Fe nor Te. An indicator for Te in that matter would be to organize things with that much of time spare that everything can be done. And an indicator for Fe would be, if one doesnt loose his cool no matter how great the pressure put on him is.

I know this sounds all very assertive and is prolly exactly the thing society expects from oneself to become. But to me its also the most logical and efficient way to deal with things and people in a way that I dont loose my soul or mind to insanity in the end.

 

[PeaceBaby]

But I think gettin angry or out of line, is neither an indicator for Fe nor Te. An indicator for Te in that matter would be to organize things with that much of time spare that everything can be done. And an indicator for Fe would be, if one doesnt loose his cool no matter how great the pressure put on him is.

Agreed too - the self-control to the outer world sounds like it would be Fe as well.

 

[BlackCat]

Inferior Te is exciting to use. Tertiary Si is kinda boring but very much needed and I'd hate to have it inferior (seeing how ENPs are).

 

[mortabunt]

^ I know. ENFP's can be endlessly frustrating when they don't follow through. Good thing that their Fe can be used to guilt trip them.

 

[ergophobe]

I use Te a lot -- pretty much any activity or work is done with the view of finding the most efficient way possible. I'm also pretty good at following someone else's argument and seeing what pieces they missed.

My brain seems to automatically organize thoughts and ideas systematically. It has a natural inclination to do so. I just follow its lead.

 

[Galusha]

It doesn't really matter how badly you use your tertiary Te, it's a part of yourself that you have to embrace, and unfortunately, that means failing at it in front of others. People with more prominent Te see your use as you see our use of Fi-- if it's not appropriately developed, we seem childish, petty, able to blow up with a tiny, random provocation.

Also, the only reason it seemed cold is because you never use it, and don't integrate it into your usual persona. If you work on it, you'll seem like a more level-headed, grounded person and your complaints will take on a deeper meaning to your INTJ.

 

[Jeffster]

Do you people actually go through life labeling certain actions you take as "Te" and "Fe" and the like?

 

[PeaceBaby]

^ I've had the same thought ... I just don't see them as concretely as others seem to label their actions either. I think there's overlap for sure.

 

[Galusha]

Do you people actually go through life labeling certain actions you take as "Te" and "Fe" and the like?

Sometimes, if I'm trying to figure out why I'm acting the way I am. Though it is very unusual for one function to work by itself, so my more common ones are Te-Ni for study, Te-Se for play, and the dreaded Fi-Ni loop when nothing's going right for me.

 

[lamp]

Do you people actually go through life labeling certain actions you take as "Te" and "Fe" and the like?

I have been learning about the various functions, so yes I find this helps things 'click' for me.



So I was thinking about this thread today at work, and it seems that when I go to make a decision I often decide what is 'necessary' using Fi. From that point, I use Te to structure everything else into place around the necessary elements, and Te of course acts under the watchful eye of Fi here. So Te acts almost in a logistical sense, thinking ahead and helping visualize roles.

he'd either let me get to it and get out of my way, or do it himself

Is this Fi? "putting your foot down"

 

[Jeffster]

Sometimes, if I'm trying to figure out why I'm acting the way I am. Though it is very unusual for one function to work by itself, so my more common ones are Te-Ni for study, Te-Se for play, and the dreaded Fi-Ni loop when nothing's going right for me.

But, how do you know? And what's the point?

 

[alcea rosea]

I learned that Te balances Ne.
So, I've practiced my Te usage from early ages and it's good for me as long as it won't take hold on me more.

I've never "balanced my functions" as by the theory, for heavens sake, I've only known the theory for few years. But I see things in myself that I think need development (I always had done this) and then I try to develop them.

Like with Te. My chaotic nature needed balancing. I brought some order into my life and some scheduling and organizing. I call that Te. It has helped me even if I wouldn't know about MBTI theory. Now I just have names for the different sides of my personality that I call Ne and Te and...

 

[Amargith]

Is this Fi? "putting your foot down"

This was more a case of impatience, aka Te wanting to get back to work already. Actually, the last part of that sentence is Fi. If the way I'm doing it isn't good enough for him, he can bloody well do it himself, coz then I aint going to waste energy on it. The entire motivation to do this organizing etc though, is Fi for me. The way I go about it is Te..I think.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Can you tell me something if it is not a secret: In which situations do you realize that you have too little Te in yourself ?