[SJ] SJs, where have you gone?!

[jixmixfix]

This is a gossip forum. There is very little "open-ended" speculation. Plus, contrary to what it's been set up as, typology is a HIGHLY PRACTICAL-APPLICATION ORIENTED SUBJECT. It's not really all that theoretical (what little theory is involved is simple.)

The theory itself can be used for practical purposes but the forum is all debates, arguments, speculations etc. Would it not surprise you to see this forum filled up with 60% ESFJS? and only 10% INTPS I doubt it would ever happen, the forum attracts intellectuals. It's a market. Are SJ's intellectuals? they could be but for the most part they are task oriented type individuals.

 

[Patches]

- Statistics tell me that Ns are only 25% of the population so it is rarer to be an N so I am an N

Being N may make you special in the real world but as far as forum statistics that I just made up off the top of my head, SJ's make up less than 10% of the TypoC population. Which means on TypoC... I'm a unique and special snowflake.

 

[Orangey]

the forum attracts intellectuals.

You lost all credibility right there.

 

[jixmixfix]

You lost all credibility right there.

I'm not looking for your credibility.

 

[jixmixfix]

I think it's far more likely that most people on these sites identify as INPs and INJs because they want to be special.

quite an arrogant thing to assume.

 

[Anew Leaf]

I, for one, welcome my new SJ overlords!

 

[ReflecTcelfeR]

I feel like I could most definitely be an SJ, or I do not doubt my ability to delude myself into being an N.

 

[EJCC]

Changing dynamics of the SJ vs N subconsciously and consciously
- SJs won't subject themselves to psychology and Ns would ergo I must be an N
- SJs are short-sighted and I'm not therefore I must be an N
- SJs are not imaginative and I am therefore I must be an N
- SJs aren't open to new possibilities and I am therefore I must be an N
- I want to fit in therefore I am an N
- I want to not be stereotyped and taken more seriously therefore I am an N
- I want people on here to like me therefore I am an N
- I want to be seen me as a genius therefore I am an N
- I am like that person and that person is an N therefore I am an N
- I like the letter N over S therefore I am an N (If we did not label Ne and Ni as it is and did not call them introverted or extraverted, types would change)
- Statistics tell me that Ns are only 25% of the population so it is rarer to be an N so I am an N

The change is not often due to people enforcing a negative connotation to the S type but rather, the positive connotation the general media and education system tends to like to make of the traits that the N types often describe.

I agree with this. Any negative connotation of the S type is implied from comparing it to the N type.

because typology is a forum that speculates about theory and has open ended discussions.

Part of the forum, yeah. But not where I hang out!

If the entire forum were like the NT rationale or the Philosophy/Religion and Politics subforums, I would never have joined. So I guess I agree with you there, in that a little bit of the reason why there aren't as many SJs on the forum is that they're repelled by the hyper-philosophical NT discussion. But at the same time I agree with [MENTION=4490]Orangey[/MENTION] and [MENTION=6071]Oakysage[/MENTION]. The problem isn't exclusively from one of those two things -- it's from both.

The theory itself can be used for practical purposes but the forum is all debates, arguments, speculations etc. Would it not surprise you to see this forum filled up with 60% ESFJS? and only 10% INTPS I doubt it would ever happen, the forum attracts intellectuals. It's a market. Are SJ's intellectuals? they could be but for the most part they are task oriented type individuals.[/i]

Being an intellectual does not necessarily mean asking questions for the sake of asking questions, in the way you're assuming that it is. Yes, SJs have a general distaste for people who sit around, ask themselves pointless questions, and don't get a real job -- but so does anyone who likes stuff to get done. (I have some INFJ and ENTJ friends who share that distaste.) But a lot of intellectuals -- e.g. most of the ones who work for universities -- spend their time writing papers that are relevant to real life issues, going to conferences that deal with real issues, etc, and a lot of the time their work is read by important people -- some of whom are policymakers or influence policymakers. (Which is why you see a lot of SJ university professors!! I've seen a bunch of them in poli sci and history departments. [MENTION=7254]Wind-Up Rex[/MENTION] and I were just talking about one of them, actually )

EDIT: Also, for the record, I am a member of this forum because of its benefit to me and my understanding of myself and other people, and I believe that's why most people are here. I also enjoy studying music, theology, the social sciences, etc, for the same reason -- and so do a lot of SJs I know. If they aren't interested in typology, it's because they feel more confident in themselves and their interactions with other people than I do. A lot of my feelings of imperfection regarding communication etc, and a lot of my relief at reading things that tell me it's okay to be that way, would probably not be all that strong in, say, an ESTJ type 8. They aren't nearly as sensitive to imperfection (and being disliked by others and/or feeling like a jerk) as an ESTJ type 1w2 like me would feel.

quite an arrogant thing to assume.

It's not Orangey's arrogant assumption -- it's the assumption of a whole lot of type descriptions online. Generally, the stereotype based on type descriptions is that the geniuses, masterminds, deep thinkers, movers/shakers, and overall mentally impressive people of the world are INPs and INJs -- NTs in the sciences, NFs in the arts.

The assumption is: It's not recommended that you be in academia or the sciences or the arts if you're an SJ... because it's not practical enough for you and you'll get bored. This assumption is wrong, and I explained why earlier in the post.

 

[EJCC]

Lot of hatorade in this thread

NEED MAOR SJs!!!!! We've got vacant office chairs people!!!!

lol yes INEFFICIENT USE OF SPACE!

I, for one, welcome my new SJ overlords!

Excellent. Your support is duly noted. Would you like a position in our one-party kleptocracy Benevolent Royal Committee?

I feel like I could most definitely be an SJ, or I do not doubt my ability to delude myself into being an N.

Join us! We made cookies.

 

[Anew Leaf]

Excellent. Your support is duly noted. Would you like a position in our one-party kleptocracy Benevolent Royal Committee?

Join us! We made cookies.

yay!!!!!!!!!

can i be an sj too?! i would like to be ESTJ please.....

 

[EJCC]

yay!!!!!!!!!

can i be an sj too?! i would like to be ESTJ please.....

Of course!!

Also... your post made me realize that I was mixing my metaphors a little. Whoops!

 

[tinker683]

I, for one, welcome my new SJ overlords!

Super hot supplicants such as yourself will be the backbone of our freshly scrubbed utopia. You are most welcomed here

If the entire forum were like the NT rationale or the Philosophy/Religion and Politics subforums, I would never have joined. So I guess I agree with you there, in that a little bit of the reason why there aren't as many SJs on the forum is that they're repelled by the hyper-philosophical NT discussion. But at the same time I agree with [MENTION=4490]Orangey[/MENTION] and [MENTION=6071]Oakysage[/MENTION]. The problem isn't exclusively from one of those two things -- it's from both.

Indeedy. I like deep thought and discussion as much as the next guy but yeesh...

Being an intellectual does not necessarily mean asking questions for the sake of asking questions, in the way you're assuming that it is.

No kidding! All that does is make them pedantic and annoying.

Yes, SJs have a general distaste for people who sit around, ask themselves pointless questions, and don't get a real job -- but so does anyone who likes stuff to get done. (I have some INFJ and ENTJ friends who share that distaste.) But a lot of intellectuals -- e.g. most of the ones who work for universities -- spend their time writing papers that are relevant to real life issues, going to conferences that deal with real issues, etc, and a lot of the time their work is read by important people -- some of whom are policymakers or influence policymakers. (Which is why you see a lot of SJ university professors!! I've seen a bunch of them in poli sci and history departments. [MENTION=7254]Wind-Up Rex[/MENTION] and I were just talking about one of them, actually )

Totally agree!!!

EDIT: Also, for the record, I am a member of this forum because of its benefit to me and my understanding of myself and other people, and I believe that's why most people are here.

That's pretty much what got me into typology. I want to recognize my weaknesses and grow so that I can be the best person I can be. I also want to understand the people around me because I like people and I want to get along with them

I also enjoy studying music, theology, the social sciences, etc, for the same reason -- and so do a lot of SJs I know.

I love the social sciences. History too

If they aren't interested in typology, it's because they feel more confident in themselves and their interactions with other people than I do. A lot of my feelings of imperfection regarding communication etc, and a lot of my relief at reading things that tell me it's okay to be that way, would probably not be all that strong in, say, an ESTJ type 8. They aren't nearly as sensitive to imperfection (and being disliked by others and/or feeling like a jerk) as an ESTJ type 1w2 like me would feel.

Some some other people I suspect who are SJs, they're not interested in it because they liken it to astrology - interesting, but not helpful.

Which I think is a shame because I've found it to be very helpful.

It's not Orangey's arrogant assumption -- it's the assumption of a whole lot of type descriptions online. Generally, the stereotype based on type descriptions is that the geniuses, masterminds, deep thinkers, movers/shakers, and overall mentally impressive people of the world are INPs and INJs -- NTs in the sciences, NFs in the arts.

The assumption is: It's not recommended that you be in academia or the sciences or the arts if you're an SJ... because it's not practical enough for you and you'll get bored. This assumption is wrong, and I explained why earlier in the post.

Pretty much. SJ is damned near a pejorative on this forum. Everyone's uptight professor or ridged parents or blah blah blah must have been an SJ. It's almost like I'm afflicted with a disease or something.

Not that I give a shit. I like being me, but I do very much resent the idea that I'm some rigid, stuck-in-my-ways tight ass because I don't accept every hair brained idea that shits itself out of an NTs skull

ETA: My inferior Ne has been on the warpath the past couple of weeks. Starting to wonder if I'm reaching that point in my life now

 

[EJCC]

That's pretty much what got me into typology. I want to recognize my weaknesses and grow so that I can be the best person I can be. I also want to understand the people around me because I like people and I want to get along with them

Exactly!!!

I love the social sciences. History too

Some some other people I suspect who are SJs, they're not interested in it because they liken it to astrology - interesting, but not helpful.

Which I think is a shame because I've found it to be very helpful.

How bizarre! There are so many practical uses for it! I believe it was even invented with a practical use in mind: getting women jobs that suited their personalities when all the men were overseas in WWII!

Pretty much. SJ is damned near a pejorative on this forum. Everyone's uptight professor or ridged parents or blah blah blah must have been an SJ. It's almost like I'm afflicted with a disease or something.

Not that I give a shit. I like being me, but I do very much resent the idea that I'm some rigid, stuck-in-my-ways tight ass because I don't accept every hair brained idea that shits itself out of an NTs skull

For sure! I feel ya, bro. I've talked with some other people on the forum about this -- and we agree that in terms of being rigid and stuck in your ways, NJs REALLY beat SJs. My STJ friends and I are MUCH more open to new ideas than my NFJ friends. (Don't get me wrong -- I <3 NFJs. Most of my friends are NFJ! But they are STUBBORN AS HELL!)

 

[Viridian]

I do think it is necessary not only to shred some of the old "traditionalist" stereotypes, but also to see SJs as keepers of systems and groups, rather than keepers of the status quo.

I kinda wish some profiles listed SJs that helped change or improve society. Like activists, for instance. Aren't there any SJs in the SJ movement?

 

[Nicodemus]

I propose that you write new type descriptions. Write them well and true and beautiful so that we can, in good consciousness, spread them across the internet. TypologyCentral, as one of the bigger forums concerning this game, seems a suitable place to start a new trend in stereotyping. Corresponding 'motivational posters' would be a good idea, too.

 

[King sns]

I agree with this. Any negative connotation of the S type is implied from comparing it to the N type.

Part of the forum, yeah. But not where I hang out!

If the entire forum were like the NT rationale or the Philosophy/Religion and Politics subforums, I would never have joined. So I guess I agree with you there, in that a little bit of the reason why there aren't as many SJs on the forum is that they're repelled by the hyper-philosophical NT discussion. But at the same time I agree with [MENTION=4490]Orangey[/MENTION] and [MENTION=6071]Oakysage[/MENTION]. The problem isn't exclusively from one of those two things -- it's from both.

Being an intellectual does not necessarily mean asking questions for the sake of asking questions, in the way you're assuming that it is. Yes, SJs have a general distaste for people who sit around, ask themselves pointless questions, and don't get a real job -- but so does anyone who likes stuff to get done. (I have some INFJ and ENTJ friends who share that distaste.) But a lot of intellectuals -- e.g. most of the ones who work for universities -- spend their time writing papers that are relevant to real life issues, going to conferences that deal with real issues, etc, and a lot of the time their work is read by important people -- some of whom are policymakers or influence policymakers. (Which is why you see a lot of SJ university professors!! I've seen a bunch of them in poli sci and history departments. [MENTION=7254]Wind-Up Rex[/MENTION] and I were just talking about one of them, actually )

EDIT: Also, for the record, I am a member of this forum because of its benefit to me and my understanding of myself and other people, and I believe that's why most people are here. I also enjoy studying music, theology, the social sciences, etc, for the same reason -- and so do a lot of SJs I know. If they aren't interested in typology, it's because they feel more confident in themselves and their interactions with other people than I do. A lot of my feelings of imperfection regarding communication etc, and a lot of my relief at reading things that tell me it's okay to be that way, would probably not be all that strong in, say, an ESTJ type 8. They aren't nearly as sensitive to imperfection (and being disliked by others and/or feeling like a jerk) as an ESTJ type 1w2 like me would feel.

It's not Orangey's arrogant assumption -- it's the assumption of a whole lot of type descriptions online. Generally, the stereotype based on type descriptions is that the geniuses, masterminds, deep thinkers, movers/shakers, and overall mentally impressive people of the world are INPs and INJs -- NTs in the sciences, NFs in the arts.

The assumption is: It's not recommended that you be in academia or the sciences or the arts if you're an SJ... because it's not practical enough for you and you'll get bored. This assumption is wrong, and I explained why earlier in the post.

Well, actually, I was going to say regarding the lack of SJ's on this forum, I think part of it is perhaps that this topic may be attractive to people who feel like they may have problems with their communication or personality- may see that everyone else acts a certain way and feel like they are alone. I can see potential for a lot of INJ's feeling this way since they are so few of the population so may feel that they have fewer like-minds to talk to. They can be certainly INJ's, and this is the place in the world where INJ's feel like they can shine-a personality forum. Their personalities are different. Since SJ's tend to be more common, they can actually be understood and stand out in the real world.

However, I think to assume that people are just trying to be a certain type just to be special and stand out is a bit of a stretch-(assuming that people are doing that kind of adds to the bias in a backwards way.) Anyway, if that is really true for anyone, it is a huge cop out since everybody on this forum knows, deep inside, that everybody is different and has something to offer the world. Each and every one of us is unique because we're unique. Not because of the letters we assign to our name on an internet forum- not from saying "I'm definitely not an SJ!" The more accurately a person can judge their personalities here, the more unique they will end up- because they can use it for their own growth. If you're calling yourself an INTP while you're really an ISTJ, you're just selling yourself short. In other words, it's their own issue.

 

[EJCC]

I do think it is necessary not only to shred some of the old "traditionalist" stereotypes, but also to see SJs as keepers of systems and groups, rather than keepers of the status quo.

Keepers of the status quo if it works. As the saying goes, "If it ain't broke..."

I kinda wish some profiles listed SJs that helped change or improve society. Like activists, for instance. Aren't there any SJs in the SJ movement?

For sure! Can't think of examples at present -- because I'm guessing anyone who was a "visionary" would be typed as an N. You should start a typing thread about it!

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

Leave the engine repair to the ISTP's, please. If it weren't for motor vehicles, ISTP's would run out of things to do... SJ's have bills to pay and office chairs to keep warm.

My ESTJ boyfriend was a tank mechanic in the Marines and was a motorcycle tech. So they do like engine repair. Well, they tolerate it. I would say I have an element of sophistication. Definitely a lot more patience when things don't go easy. He just goes in with a hammer and a litany of curse words for backup. LOL

I thought I would also share something that happened last night. We were walking to a restaurant and passed an avante guarde art store. The store woman was wearing bright colors and had a small turban on. She didn't look strange to me. She looked like an artist in her element. He turned to me, kinda shook his head as if he'd seen it all and said, "I don't get this free spirit thing at all."

LOL. I laughed and patted his shoulder, "It's okay babe."

He wouldn't be interested in MBTI. I don't think most ESTJ's have the patience for it.

 

[King sns]

My ESTJ boyfriend was a tank mechanic in the Marines and was a motorcycle tech. So they do like engine repair. Well, they tolerate it. I would say I have an element of sophistication. Definitely a lot more patience when things don't go easy. He just goes in with a hammer and a litany of curse words for backup. LOL

err... I was kidding :/

 

[ChocolateMoose123]

Yeah. I didn't take you super seriously. Just thought I'd share.