J or P?

[Mycroft]

I get along fine with the Ps who don't make it their mission to help me see the supposed error of my ways and "loosen [me] up".

 

[Mole]

What is normal?

Normal, dear Hmm, is easy to measure. And when you graph your measurements they turn out to be shaped like a bell - with almost everyone in the middle and only the very tiniest number at either end.

So normal is a statistical term and almost everyone is normal. But this is disguised in a society where everyone says, "I am an individual". And where it is just not cool to be normal.

I mean who wants to be Norma Normal?

So we have a situation where it is not cool to be normal but we socially exclude the tiny number of the subnormal and the abnormal.

This is called cognitive dissonance.

And if we can tolerate the mental pain of cognitive dissonance, we can learn something new.

 

[Mycroft]

Normal, dear Hmm, is easy to measure. And when you graph your measurements they turn out to be shaped like a bell - with almost everyone in the middle and only the very tiniest number at either end.

What are the units of measurement?

 

[Mole]

What are the units of measurement?

In measuring normality we are not measuring a quantity, rather we are making a comparison.

So the units of measurement can be relatively arbitrary, as long they are constant in all measurements, so that a reliable and valid comparison can be made.

What is extraordinary is that almost all human characteristics, and I mean almost all, fall under the same graph, called a Bell Curve.

That means that almost all of us are normal.

This makes evolutionary sense as we only need a very tiny number of the subnormal and the abnormal to enable us to adapt to a changed environment.

And we need a large number of normal people now who are adapted to our present environment.

And the social exclusion of the subnormal and the abnormal makes sense as a way of restricting their ability to reproduce until the environment changes sufficiently for them to be fit.

 

[Mycroft]

In measuring normality we are not measuring a quantity, rather we are making a comparison.

So the units of measurement can be relatively arbitrary, as long they are constant in all measurements, so that a reliable and valid comparison can be made.

True enough, but to assemble a graph, you're going to need units to assign to the X and Y axes. The Y axis is simple enough; the number of people. For the X axis I propose "normalcrons".

The test could have questions like:

When was the last time you read a book of 300 or more pages?

a.) Within the past week.
b.) Within the past month.
c.) Within the past year.
d.) Fuck you, man, when was the last time you got laid?

Note to those who selected option d: please refrain from turning around and totally high-fiving your buddies during the designated testing period.

The responses would be weighted as such:

a: 1 point
b: 2 points
c: 3 points
d: 4 points

The questions and responses would be selected such the number of points equivalent to an equal number of "b" and "c" responses would be the center of the bell curve.

 

[Mole]

True enough, but to assemble a graph, you're going to need units to assign to the X and Y axes. The Y axis is simple enough; the number of people. For the X axis I propose "normalcrons".

The test could have questions like:

When was the last time you read a book of 300 or more pages?

a.) Within the past week.
b.) Within the past month.
c.) Within the past year.
d.) Fuck you, man, when was the last time you got laid?

Note to those who selected option d: please refrain from turning around and totally high-fiving your buddies during the designated testing period.

The responses would be weighted as such:

a: 1 point
b: 2 points
c: 3 points
d: 4 points

The questions and responses would be selected such the number of points equivalent to an equal number of "b" and "c" responses would be the center of the bell curve.

I don't understand psychometrics so I can't really say.

But I suspect on a Bell Curve you are looking at a large number of points randomly selected.

How you gather the data would be interesting. I guess you would want to avoid your own biases and perhaps you would want some kind of double blind.

And what you are looking for in the data is comparison - so you would need an excellent grasp of statistics.

And of course the last thing you would ever do is test yourself because your data would be contaminated from the word go.

So where does that leave us?

It leaves us testing ourselves. And it is fun, social and free. So why not?

 

[INTJMom]

I get along fine with the Ps who don't make it their mission to help me see the supposed error of my ways and "loosen [me] up".

I know, right?!
I LIKE being this way.
I would hate being a "P"!



(Of course, if I was a "P" I know I technically would like it,
since it would be my preference,
but you know what I mean.
If you don't know what I mean,
you are an "S".)

 

[entropie]

I know, right?!
I LIKE being this way.
I would hate being a "P"!



(Of course, if I was a "P" I know I technically would like it,
since it would be my preference,
but you know what I mean.
If you don't know what I mean,
you are an "S".)

And if you do not like apple pie, you are a nazi !

 

[Mycroft]

And if you do not like apple pie, you are a nazi !

Since I've never once in my life seen a Nazi eating apple pie, this is clearly irrefutable.

 

[mlittrell]

lol to above post

and as far as my J friends go: 3 ENTJs, 2 ISFJs, 3 INFJs, 2 ISTJs, 1 ENFJs, 4 ESTJs, 1 ESFJ

so to answer your question, yes, Ps and Js can get along

that's off the top of my head at 1:12 in the morning

 

[Xander]

Considering that many Ps are quite obviously annoying and should be shot plus many of my friends and family are Js I'd say yes.

Personally I'm more likely to befriend a J than a P because at least you know what you've got without having to try and bring out the industrial tools to get at the interesting stuff. There's nothing more annoying to me than a habitually avoidant P!

 

[INA]

Sometimes it's the reverse though. Sometimes a certain J I know will SAY she doesn't mind, but only because her Fe doesn't want her to appear bossy. She does have a preference, but says she doesn't. So she forces me to choose where we eat, say, and then sits there like a wet weekend the whole way through. Then later tells me she didn't want to go to that place and it makes her feel uncomfortable but she just went there because I suggested it, then accuses me of being bossy! :steam:

I've learned now to counter this with insistance that she chooses where we eat and *I* don't mind if she's bossy

Argh . . . I had a picky ESTJ-friend pull this same thing. So half-way through she was clearly less than thrilled. I told her I refused to let her ruin it for me when she clearly had preferences she didn't express and I was the one who truly didn't care where we went. And then I ate my dinner with relish.
Err . . . Not the condiment, the 'tude.

 

[Gen]

Considering that many Ps are quite obviously annoying and should be shot plus many of my friends and family are Js I'd say yes.

Personally I'm more likely to befriend a J than a P because at least you know what you've got without having to try and bring out the industrial tools to get at the interesting stuff. There's nothing more annoying to me than a habitually avoidant P!

cuz you're a J!!!

 

[Xander]

cuz you're a J!!!

Some, of course, resist even the most thorough measures... this is what we, in the know, breed special cats for. Talk or your thighs get acupunctured into next week!!!

 

[Grayscale]

i like Js. i prefer to be the only anomaly in my environment, so i tend to be more comfortable around them in a "i like to know my boundaries so i can break them" sort of way.

i dont like when people "J me out", but that really has nothing to do with real J-types as much as someone exemplifying the more annoying of the stereotypes

like, you know, you have to put your dishes in the washer a certain way, or whatever. what if i dont want to take the mule tour once we're in mexico? i need to save my pesos for questionable looking street food

 

[Giggly]

This is on my mind again today. Still wondering.

Any personal experiences to share?

 

[Virtual ghost]

Look at it this way.

In the case that they can get along this world would have collapsed long ago.

 

[Nocapszy]

The closest thing I have to a friend is a J.
So yes.

 

[Nocapszy]

Also, Hmm; for your consideration.

It's no worry if there's a might too much for you to grapple with -- I tend to get verbose when frustrated.

 

[Giggly]

Also, Hmm; for your consideration.

It's no worry if there's a might too much for you to grapple with -- I tend to get verbose when frustrated.

Thanks. I've just read a few posts of that and I can tell it's something that might help me. Why are you frustrated though?