Thank you for graciously receiving my post.
You're onto something the Fe goal thing. This is indeed what frustrates Fe-ers when people start threads that stir up loads of controversy to deal with, but which ultimately don't change anything. It seems incomprehensible (from a goal oriented standpoint) to start a discussion that in the end doesn't do anything. I would imagine that Te feels the same way about Ti discussions.
@bold: Likely.
I like it that you've done some thinking about what may work better than the present situation. I think it is important to see a variety of perspectives on how more people can be accommodated effectively.
Thanks for that, but please understand though, I wouldn't have felt like I could even
presume to formulate those ideas without all the data in this thread to help support it.
In fact, it feels scary to just make a list like that. The list seems more strident and bossy than just talking about the issues.
As far as mods though - Cze Cze is an ENFP and Ivy is an INFP. I believe Geoff is also an INFP. Highlander is an INTJ. Geoff is frequently away, but the rest are very active mods. Fi is represented on the modstaff.
My apologies, I mean no offense to CzeCze or Ivy - I didn't think of CzeCze off the top of my head and had forgotten that Ivy changed/added hers ... I haven't seen Geoff around these parts in quite a stretch and yes, Highlander is new and in there too.
Maybe just a mod, regardless of type, who loves engaging at that individual level, who is an empathetic emo-rant-specialist then, even someone already on the admin - who do you think that would be?
I don't know everyone personally well enough to say.
I'm not sure I'm with you on banning anyone who expresses a lack of understanding for Fi though. I think there is a burden on Fi users to explain what their purpose is and even that they don't have a goal per se in discussing certain things. Notice that it is not Fi across the board that gets attacked. It seems to me that there are Fi users on here who are not necessarily using pseudo Fe speak, they are true to themselves, but they still get heard. Some are even quite open about expressing their wariness of Fe, and yet their words are still accepted. This has a lot to do with the way they approach it. Would you say that this is an issue of Fe imposing a goal on them, rather than them expressing themselves in a more native tongue kind of way? I'm not saying that greater understanding isn't needed on Fe-er's parts too, but banning? Can you give me a more specific example of what kind of behaviour you are referring to? Is it something like we saw evidenced in the Introverted Thinking Guide or more general expressions of dislike for Fi perspectives?
It wasn't a lack of understanding Fi per se, it's that a particular kind of ad hominem attack is very distressing to Fi-ers. I think I can explain what you see in different Fi-ers though. Some have simply given up trying to talk about this stuff, don't even come to the boards anymore. Some default to Fe, which is a good strategy really, no one gets their feathers ruffled. Some talk about certain subjects but not the sensitive stuff, keep their thoughts to themselves where they won't get trampled on. And some Fi-ers just let it all hang out, which ironically is sometimes more accepted than people like myself who imagine ourselves a diplomat of sorts, trying to get along with everyone.
As far as reporting posts, this what we've been begging everyone to do all along. Consistently I get the response from Fi users that they aren't snitches and they feel that's underhanded and not their style. Do you see any way of overcoming that sentiment? If we don't know about what's happening, we can't take steps to improve the situation. Right now we are working on the issue of those who are indirectly trolling on a consistent basis, who seem to skate near the line but not cross it. I agree that issue needs to be addressed and I think it may help the situation. In this forum, I see an extraordinarily high level of disclosure in comparison to other forums. To me, that indicates that a lot of people do feel safe expressing themselves, including Fi users. However, it's certainly possible that there's a lot that goes under the radar and if that's the case, then we need to raise awareness so that we can better respond.
I can't explain exactly why some of us Fi-ers don't report stuff ... for some of the reasons you expressed above no doubt. There's more than that though. I didn't flag my first post 'til well over a year here, and prior to that, I had received some personal attacks that I didn't report.
Perhaps we kind of expect that people in charge simply notice bad behaviour, especially when it seems obvious to us ... what we don't realize is that bad behaviour looks different to different people. And there are some tactics that are employed here that, as you say, skirt on the edges. One of my least favorite are the people who post 'til they are sure you have seen it (seeing you back in thread) then delete what they said. Extremely provocative and uncool. It's why I've been on "stealth mode" for a while.
I guess too, on the occasions I have reported a post, I don't receive any feedback that says, "Hey PB we heard that and are on it." I realize this is a lot of extra work to contemplate, but when I do actually report a post, it's something that is extremely offensive to me, no small thing. And then when you hear nothing back, it's hard to know if it's taken seriously. Even some kind of automated reply would be nice to know it actually got to someone, IDK if vBulletin has a hack or setting that enables that.
At any rate, I do appreciate you thinking about this, but it's a mode of expression that doesn't feel as comfortable to me. I am more used to a consensus style of leadership where everyone is heard as an individual first and I hope that the other people posting here have felt they "said what they needed to say" before I attempted to put together a list and ideas for moving forward.
Edit: I see you edited your post somewhat after I quoted it. But the gist of it is still reflected here.
I just want to clarify - Fi-ers aren't necessarily about putting Fi topics in the safe zone, but when we talk about Fi and use Fi language, if people are going to respond to that with insults or personal attacks, on a continual basis, we hope that mod action takes place along the appropriate escalation path, up to and including being banned.