If God doesn't exist then how was everything/the earth created?

[1487610420]

only retarded weak people believe in god

 

[Beorn]

only retarded weak people believe in god

In the grand scheme of things that's probably a fair assessment of me.
You see one of the first things you learn when you believe in God is that you're not him and you fall rather miserably short of him.

Of course, idk if it's been pointed out yet but OP's question is only an argument for a first cause and not any particular god.

 

[LightSun]

I always love the nonbelievers and their reasons why God doesn't exist.

I struggle at times to believe in a god, but I do know there is some sort of higher being out there...after all, the earth and life itself came into existence from nothing.

When people start blaming God for every bad thing that happens in their lives, that's where they fail to realize God gave everyone free will in how to handle their trials.
They can either stay mad at Him for giving them such a harsh life or do something about it to get their lives to where they want to be.

There's also Satan out there so if people are questioning why there are bad people who do bad things who don't care what they do...that's from Satan, not God.

And some people allow their demons to over power themselves.

If God doesn't exist then how did this very earth and everything living come into existence?

theflame wrote (All quotes are the flame followed by my response and feedback), (1) “...love the nonbelievers and their reasons why God doesn't exist.” “...but I do know there is some sort of higher being …”

(2) “...earth … life itself came into existence from nothing.”

Everything in this universe is built painstakingly over the eons by time, fortuitous circumstance and evolve in homeostasis.

(3) “.…people start blaming God for every bad thing that happens in their lives…fail to realize God gave everyone free will in how to handle their trials.”

It has been scientifically proved that free will is an illusion. Our actions are a result of a nature and nurture paradigm. We get created as individuals by these two forces then our unconscious makes the decision for us before we are even cognizant. Rhetorical question, “Do we rule our beliefs or do they govern us? “ We don’t make conscious choices it is all done out of our perception by the unconscious paradigm of who we are resulting from genetics hard wiring and soft ware of life’s experiences.

(4) “... mad at Him for giving them such a harsh life or do something about it to get their lives to where they want to be.”

Life is 50% choices we make and an outside influence of 50% real reality impinging on are preconceived dreams and aspirations. It’s the luck of the draw and knowing who you know in life that are wild card variables. Together they make and define our life.

Technical verb of cognitive dissonance when reality goes against your preconceived notions. Then the one’s possessing the most resiliency factors by childhood rearing stand a better chance to whether the storm.

(5)“… Satan…why there are bad people who do bad things who don't care what they do...that's from Satan, not God.”

God is responsible. An all caring benevolent God would not allow atrocities like the holocaust and the wars and afflictions which still are rampant in the world. It makes no conceivable reason or logic.

(6) “...demons to over power themselves.”

All manner of crimes on humanity throughout our ages have occurred. Many by religious faiths killing and persecuting the others and expecting all to circumscribe to their belief otherwise they are evil and barbarous.

It is because Christianity or whatever religion one follows does not make you a better person. All manner of atrocities have been performed from the priests. It is because we are all human beings and as such we are all susceptible to blind spots, rationalization, denial and pride-fullness.

(7) "If God doesn't exist then how was everything/the earth created?"

We simply don't know. One can not disprove the concept of God nor disprove it. We will not have a rapture or judgment day. Time will continue marching on and each generation feeling that these are the end times. To me each religion is a hypothesis to explain the inexplicable. It does not use the scientific method nor does it collect objective fact. It exists merely as a construct to explain the unknown. I have watched documentaries and it is shown the human species as a tendency to believe in supernatural causes.

It's what our brain is telling us but our brain lies to us each and every day. It filters in and out information so no one sees reality clearly in it's entirety rather they are perceptions corrupted by one's senses, judgments, stereotypes and hidden blind spots. It has been shown eye witness testimony is unreliable. Unfortunately with religion a hypothesis called God was developed during the bronze age. It is still readily followed. Science on the other hand grows. It develops hypothesis and theories but then revises them with more objectively proven replicated tests. The big bang is science's hypothesis of the origin of the universe. The fact is we may never know the true cause.

There are no causal variables that dictate A happened from B. It is all correlation and guesses none of it subjected to truth for it doesn't have reliable proof. God has yet to be discovered and he can not be measured. He does not exist in a scientific world for it utterly lacks proof.

 

[LightSun]

The issue with the "God" argument is that nothing can ever be sufficient enough because no matter what you say, there will always be a question as to ".. But who created that/him/her/it?" The argument about God tends to be a circular one that I like to engage in, frivolously. I don't like when the discussion starts to get hurtful or argumentative where feelings are getting hurt.

I will say this...

I don't officially subscribe to this view but I believe for the most part that the Universe created itself, somehow. Even if you do believe in God, the question, "..but where did he come from" will always come about , the same way "but where did the universe come from?" .. will always come about... If you get outside of tangible reality, it becomes Theosophical by default....

As far as Satan, God, Good/Bad and why people do bad things and don't care and all of that: Good and Bad don't exist. There's only an opposition. Life is ambiguous. People are not obligated to care, though that is the more noble way. People do bad things because they want to and giving the ability away to "Satan" makes others feel less responsible for their actions. This is why so many murderers tried to pull this in court. "The devil made me do it." - Put in a mental institution and deemed as crazy, when they're really just heartless or did the crime simply for some egotistical motive or because they wanted to for whatever reason.

Good/Bad is subjective and couldn't have been known without the other coming into existence. The same is with God/Satan. They are two sides of the same coin and therefore, are either trolling or the Biblical story is crap... and has hidden meaning in it. I'm leaning towards the latter.

What is clear with the "creator of humans" is that they don't give a crap about our cries about sickness, dying children, and any of that crap people choose to pray for. What makes people think they care if you're grateful or not? You are still going to get sick, die, and so are your children. Praying doesn't do anything but we sometimes trick ourselves into believing in certain things.. until and unless.. we find the audacity to test them out in others ways. If I prayed to a shoe, I'd bet I'd get the same results as I did when I used to be a Christian. The mind is a very powerful thing and we can manifest sensations with our minds if we believe in something strongly, enough.

We treat our fellow man worse than we treat "GOD" who we're not even sure of his character or not. You'd expect your mom to have grabbed your two year old, had she seen him running in the middle of the street, as a huge truck was speeding right in his direction... but if she just sat there, staring at your baby and did nothing, you'd blame her for the death. Well, this is exactly what "God" does and people still find the audacity to pray to, worship, and argue in the name of this so-called, "God" who gave us "free-will." It doesn't make any sense. Some of us will do for our loved ones what God won't but we get held up to higher standards. That makes no freaking sense.

You don't even KNOW WHO THAT IS WHO MADE YOU. You don't have the facts to create a logical argument for the way you go about things. Yet, you go around with your heads held high as if you're mightier and holier than those around you because you believe in a higher power who clearly doesn't care that much about you.

Free will doesn't conflict with being Omniscience , So this "God" should have chosen angels that would CHOOSE to do the right thing. He KNEW all of this was going to happen in the future, according to that book before he put the "angels" and "Satan" in charge of crap and he proceeded. He is either a troll or an egotistical tyrant.. but neither matters because the Bible was written in code and to control the masses.



By the way, when I used the word, "You" I didn't literally mean "you" at times but I mean all people with those viewpoints.
If I'm becoming offensive with my views, just let me know and I will exit your threat, respectfully.

However, I believe your tone in what you wrote was kind of an invitation to speak as blunt as I could.. because you spoke bluntly....

Virtualinsanity wrote, (All quotations are virtualinsanity followed with my response) (1) “…"God" argument is that nothing can ever be sufficient enough because no matter what you say, there will always be a question… "” . ..But who created that/him/her/it?"

(2) ”…argument about God tends to be a circular one that I like to engage in, frivolously.”

One can not disprove God or a phantom of the conscious with avid followers. Nor can one prove God. But for me the burden of proof lays with the believers. If they can show scientific evidence for their belief I’d keep my mind open. God is not yet detected. He can’t be measured. He is not discovered. There is no objective science factual proof available whatsoever.

(3) “…officially subscribe to this view but I believe for the most part that the Universe created itself, somehow. “

(4) “Even if you do believe in God, the question, "..but where did he come from" will always come about , …way "but where did the universe come from?"

Such is my view. In the universe are many mysteries but I do not subscribe them to miracles. There is a valid scientific reason our laws of physics help to cast light on what is real and what is not.

(5) “… Satan, God, Good/Bad and why people do bad things and don't care…”

(6)“Good and Bad don't exist….only … opposition.” “Good/Bad is subjective … without the other coming into existence. The same is with God/Satan.”

(7) “…Life is ambiguous. People are not obligated to care, though that is the more noble way. People do bad things because they want to…”

People do things out of ignorance. Many come from dysfunctional families and not possessing the requisite resiliency factors in place to help them whether the storms of life and be a contributing member to society. It is a sickness of society and faulty child rearing practice that contribute to societies ills where all manner of men commit ‘evil.’ It is because they have a sickness inside from the dual nature’s genetics and nurture’s life experiences in place to act as functional and contributing members of society. They lack ingredients in their very psyche.

(8) “...giving the ability away to "Satan" makes others feel less responsible for their actions.”

(9)“... "creator of humans" is that they don't give a crap about our cries about sickness, dying children…” “...treat our fellow man worse than we treat "GOD" …”

(11) “...held high as if you're mightier and holier than those around you because you believe in a higher power who clearly doesn't care that much about you.”

God is responsible. An all caring benevolent God would not allow atrocities like the holocaust and the wars and afflictions which still are rampant in the world. It makes no conceivable reason or logic. All manner of crimes on humanity throughout our ages have occurred. Many by religious faiths killing and persecuting the others and expecting all to circumscribe to their belief otherwise they are evil and barbarous. It is because Christianity or whatever religion one follows does not make you a better person. All manner of atrocities have been performed from the priests. It is because we are all human beings and as such we are all susceptible to blind spots, rationalization, denial and pride-fullness.

(9)“…Bible was written in code and to control the masses.”

It is well known by historical evidence that it was the Roman Empire that codified the Bible at the Council of Nicaea. It was done for political reasons. Books inclusive were thought to lend stability to the empire. Books that interfered with the Emperors authority are not included.

 

[LightSun]

“I don’t believe in an afterlife, so I don’t have to spend my whole life fearing hell, or fearing heaven even more. For whatever the tortures of hell, I think the boredom of heaven would be even worse.” Isaac Asimov

"If the devil doesn't exist, but man has created him, he has created him in his own image and likeness" Fyodor Dostoevsky (1821-1881)
The Brothers Karamazov, 1879-1880

 

[Red Memories]

I have always felt a belief in the scientific views of creation require as much faith as my own religious belief, because it has just as many holes as my own.

The truth is, I think it is beyond our human comprehension. I just tend to believe something created this earth, particularly since it is so complex. I always feel complex things must have a creator, otherwise it wouldn't work.
A "by chance" argument just baffles me. I don't know how so many people comprehend it. Just my side of things.

 

[Mole]

I have always felt a belief in the scientific views of creation require as much faith as my own religious belief, because it has just as many holes as my own.

The truth is, I think it is beyond our human comprehension. I just tend to believe something created this earth, particularly since it is so complex. I always feel complex things must have a creator, otherwise it wouldn't work.
A "by chance" argument just baffles me. I don't know how so many people comprehend it. Just my side of things.

Natural Selection tells us nothing about the creation of the Earth but tells us the origin of species. And Natural Selection is confirmed by the discovery of DNA and the sequencing of the genome.

And Natural Selection does not proceed from chance. And if you look at the mathematics of Natural Selection you will find no mention of chance.

And if you then go on and look at the mathematics of complexity, you will find the most complex things begin from the simplest.

 

[Population: 1]

only retarded weak people believe in god

A deep and succinct assessment.

Next, phobik takes on free will vs. predetermination. Stay tuned.

 

[Mole]

A deep and succinct assessment.

Next, phobik takes on free will vs. predetermination. Stay tuned.

When we believe in God, we are entranced. And when we are enchanted, our imagination wakes up and leads us rather than our reason.

And like our religion, we are enchanted and entranced by mbti, and the pleasure of mbti is in the free play of our imagination.

 

[Population: 1]

When we believe in God, we are entranced. And when we are enchanted, our imagination wakes up and leads us rather than our reason.

And like our religion, we are enchanted and entranced by mbti, and the pleasure of mbti is in the free play of our imagination.

It's all in jest. I'm a sarcastic guy and I saw an opportunity.

 

[1487610420]

A deep and succinct assessment.

Next, phobik takes on free will vs. predetermination. Stay tuned.

what free will?

 

[Population: 1]

what free will?

Ah well at least you weren't insulted as you knew it was already predetermined that I'd make that comment.

As well as this one!

 

[Mole]

It's all in jest. I'm a sarcastic guy and I saw an opportunity.

Humour is vitally important, particularly as humour is not a function of the entranced mind, humour, interestingly, is not a function of religion, just read the sacred religious books devoid of humour, no, humour is a function of critical thinking in the wide awake critical mind.

On the other hand, humour can be a psychological defence mechanism which is very common in bullying, and racial discrimination, and when we want to hurt someone and deny it, we say, it's just a joke.

And sarcasm is also a psychological defence mechanism, and is commonly regarded as the lowest form of wit. The question to ask the sarcastic is, what are you defending against?

 

[onemoretime]

The need for a creator or first cause is a cultural meme that is so pervasive in the West because of Christianity. The first step is to realize that it's not a necessary meme.

 

[Population: 1]

Humour is vitally important, particularly as humour is not a function of the entranced mind, humour, interestingly, is not a function of religion, just read the sacred religious books devoid of humour, no, humour is a function of critical thinking in the wide awake critical mind.

On the other hand, humour can be a psychological defence mechanism which is very common in bullying, and racial discrimination, and when we want to hurt someone and deny it, we say, it's just a joke.

And sarcasm is also a psychological defence mechanism, and is commonly regarded as the lowest form of wit. The question to ask the sarcastic is, what are you defending against?

The lowest form of wit but the highest form of intelligence. Finished that for you. Well phobik wasn't horribly and irrevocably damaged by my humor so I'll lose no sleep tonight over it.

Humor. You should try it sometime. I've noticed your posts seem to start off as compliments but inevitably drive into the insult zone. Interesting.

 

[Mole]

The need for a creator or first cause is a cultural meme that is so pervasive in the West because of Christianity. The first step is to realize that it's not a necessary meme.

All we have to do is ask who created the universe that is accelerating, accelerating, away from us in every direction, not limited to the speed of light.

Was it Jehovah, was it the Trinity, was it Allah, or perhaps it was Ganesh, with the head of an elephant?

We only have to look at the facts of the universe to see our Gods are preposterous.

 

[Coriolis]

All we have to do is ask who created the universe that is accelerating, accelerating, away from us in every direction, not limited to the speed of light.

Was it Jehovah, was it the Trinity, was it Allah, or perhaps it was Ganesh, with the head of an elephant?

We only have to look at the facts of the universe to see our Gods are preposterous.

Or is it just our perception of deity that is preposterous, as by nature it is beyond our comprehension as mere humans?

As for who created the universe, it was:

 

[thepink-cloakedninja]

This thread is still alive? D:

 

[Mole]

Or is it just our perception of deity that is preposterous, as by nature it is beyond our comprehension as mere humans?

As for who created the universe, it was:

The interesting thing is that the universe is comprehensible, and we have been increasing our comprehension remarkably, from the whole universe accelerating away from us in every direction, to creating the fundamental particles of matter in the cern reactor, to understanding natural selection, to understanding how religion enchants us.

Until recently we thought the universe was incomprehensible so we turned to superstition like astrology to understand the universe, and now we have an enormous grasp of the universe from matter and energy, to dark matter, and dark energy.

Religions were created by those who didn't understand the universe or even the germ theory of disease, and so they fantasied about the universe. Their fantasies we now know were fantastic. But had nothing to do with the actual universe we live in.

 

[GloriaInExcelsisDeo]

The smartest man alive, Chris Langan, with an estimated IQ of 200 says God and Heaven exists. I find that interesting. Apparently he's trying to prove God's existence as we speak. Any thoughts on this man and his endeavour?