I don't see how God could plausibly exist (Christian definition of God)

[Snuggletron]

not necessarily. He could put the universe on autopilot and focus on another hobby. Like painting miniatures for the dungeons and dragons roleplaying game.

 

[Mole]

God and DNA

If God created us in His own image, God himself has DNA in an arrangement of four letters.

And as far as we know, all DNA on Earth is arranged in four letters.

Every living creature on Earth, from puppy dogs to bananas to homo sapiens, is built by the four letters of DNA.

So not only are we created in the image and likeness of God, but so are puppy dogs and bananas.

Surely this makes a mockery of God in the same way the four letters of MBTI make a mockery of personality tests.

 

[miss fortune]

I like your quote about the thread being longer than your attention span, that made me laugh.

I've got to say that I dont recognise the Christian God in what you're saying here, perhaps you're familiar with the whole idea through or from secondary sources and not the bible or Christian literature at all?

In the new testament God when he is talked about as a seperate entity from Jesus is a pretty forgiving deity, slow to anger, quick to forgive, likewise in the books of revelation, book of James, chapter thirteen of Mark which are all the references which I can think of which deal with apocalypse, they describe horrible things happening but they are a consequence of the actions of demons or men, not God.

In fact the only explicit mention of judgement which I recall is in Matthew and it details Jesus talking about the flip side of failing to do unto others as you would have them do unto you, ie that he'll reward those individuals as they rewarded him when he was in need and they shunned him, to me that's just desserts and not too terrible.

I'm much less of an authority on the old testament, although I can see a progressive revelation taking place, in which it appears that either God or Man or perhaps both in unison are under going progressive revelation about one another and developing as a consequence. Its pretty complex and I cant recall it verbatim but Jung talks about something like this in his Answer To Job book.

To be honest the Christian God is one of the only deities to have experienced incarnation as a man, suffered pretty much the worst life had to offer and one of the worst deaths I can imagine, whether you have total insight into the existence of an afterlife or not (which I actually dont believe Jesus had being true God and true man and crying out that God had abandoned him on the cross) that's some excurciating shit there. To me that pretty much pays for any suffering which God may have visited upon mankind or any all to human accusations of caprice or callousness at creation per se or the tragedy of mortal existence (life being too short and too full of misery), not that that was necessary.

It makes the Christian story appear more plausible to me than other religions because it answers certain questions, although they are perhaps human, all too human questions, about why a deity would bother with creation at all because is not a process of divine design or even divine accident which has resulted in creation but creation is something which God is actively engaged with, in each of us, in everything but especially in the one complete incarnation which was Jesus Christ.

I don't know, but the Great Flood, the plagues on Egypt, driving "his people" to war all of the time, Sodom and Gamorrah and things of that sort don't exactly strike me as NICE

also, the concept of Hell disturbs me... I couldn't damn someone eternally and I sure as hell refuse to beleive in a god who's meaner than I am

 

[Ginkgo]

If God created us in His own image, God himself has DNA in an arrangement of four letters.

And as far as we know, all DNA on Earth is arranged in four letters.

Every living creature on Earth, from puppy dogs to bananas to homo sapiens, is built by the four letters of DNA.

So not only are we created in the image and likeness of God, but so are puppy dogs and bananas.

Surely this makes a mockery of God in the same way the four letters of MBTI make a mockery of personality tests.

 

[Snuggletron]

I don't know, but the Great Flood, the plagues on Egypt, driving "his people" to war all of the time, Sodom and Gamorrah and things of that sort don't exactly strike me as NICE

also, the concept of Hell disturbs me... I couldn't damn someone eternally and I sure as hell refuse to beleive in a god who's meaner than I am

what's important I think aren't so much the specifics, but the idea that a loving and just god (new and old testament god, anyway) has to deal with sinners in harsh ways. Sinners who could have been angels if god wanted them to be, yet they're run through the test of life with free will and make mistakes, which an all-knowing god would already have planned. So the game made by the creator is rigged just like everything else, the sins committed are already known inherently to god. He's at least a sadist in that respect. And pretty much insane.

in the membrane.

 

[IZthe411]

what's important I think aren't so much the specifics, but the idea that a loving and just god (new and old testament god, anyway) has to deal with sinners in harsh ways. Sinners who could have been angels if god wanted them to be, yet they're run through the test of life with free will and make mistakes, which an all-knowing god would already have planned. So the game made by the creator is rigged just like everything else, the sins committed are already known inherently to god. He's at least a sadist in that respect. And pretty much insane.

in the membrane.

Do you understand what Sin is?

A lot of people don't, and that's why they have this crook-faced opinion of God.

 

[Snuggletron]

I know sin can be variable for different faiths, but since we're talking about the Christian God I recognize sin as an infringement on divine law/moral law which is influenced by divine law. This is rejecting god because he defined good and evil. Unless I've misunderstood the Christian god, his will is almighty and so to infringe upon his divine laws would be within his will. If he wasn't aware of each individual's path or agenda, then he wouldn't be god. A creator of everything should have to know everything about that everything. If not, then I'd assume there is some outside influence that can rival and get one over on god.

 

[Sniffles]

Why would God infringe upon his own law or will?

 

[Snuggletron]

not god, any individual.

 

[Sniffles]

Ok I misread, although I think your overall argument is still flawed. For example you mentioned this:

Sinners who could have been angels if god wanted them to be, yet they're run through the test of life with free will and make mistakes, which an all-knowing god would already have planned. So the game made by the creator is rigged just like everything else, the sins committed are already known inherently to god. He's at least a sadist in that respect. And pretty much insane.

That's assuming that God doesn't actually want these people to be "angels"(saints would be a more correct term). God does actually want them to join him in heaven, but he's not going to force anybody to do this. So I fail to see how the game is rigged, since God presents us with plenty of oppurtunities to seek repentence and reconciliation for the sins we've committed.

 

[Beorn]

I know sin can be variable for different faiths, but since we're talking about the Christian God I recognize sin as an infringement on divine law/moral law which is influenced by divine law. This is rejecting god because he defined good and evil. Unless I've misunderstood the Christian god, his will is almighty and so to infringe upon his divine laws would be within his will. If he wasn't aware of each individual's path or agenda, then he wouldn't be god. A creator of everything should have to know everything about that everything.

If this is true why is it bad?

 

[Snuggletron]

Ok I misread, although I think your overall argument is still flawed. For example you mentioned this:

That's assuming that God doesn't actually want these people to be "angels"(saints would be a more correct term). God does actually want them to join him in heaven, but he's not going to force anybody to do this. So I fail to see how the game is rigged, since God presents us with plenty of oppurtunities to seek repentence and reconciliation for the sins we've committed.

This makes God look too passive to be...God. Also that's an assumption in itself; to say his desire is for us to join him in heaven. If God wanted to create the universe and did that then what is stopping him from not being so direct with his desire for our participation with him in the afterlife, and our adherence to his definition of good and evil (and all that falls under those categories)? The game would necessarily be rigged because the creator is the means to the start of everything.

maybe I'm missing your point. I'm only reiterating mine, really.

If this is true why is it bad?

why would his limited knowledge be bad? It's bad because it seems to be a prerequisite for pure creation. If we're discussing creation from absolute scratch, knowledge of all of the individual pieces is necessary, whether they be material or abstract ideas/thoughts.

 

[EcK]

I don't know, but the Great Flood, the plagues on Egypt, driving "his people" to war all of the time, Sodom and Gamorrah and things of that sort don't exactly strike me as NICE

also, the concept of Hell disturbs me... I couldn't damn someone eternally and I sure as hell refuse to beleive in a god who's meaner than I am

"You just don't understand S&M love"

I don't think the claims of people sub contracting their self esteem through some kind of wierd memetic pyramid scheme should be taken utterly seriously in the first place.
I mean, it's not like children are treated any better, and THEY have the excuse of little experience, cultural endoctrination, wetware based poor judgment etc.

 

[Sniffles]

This makes God look too passive to be...God. Also that's an assumption in itself; to say his desire is for us to join him in heaven. If God wanted to create the universe and did that then what is stopping him from not being so direct with his desire for our participation with him in the afterlife, and our adherence to his definition of good and evil (and all that falls under those categories)? The game would necessarily be rigged because the creator is the means to the start of everything.

maybe I'm missing your point. I'm only reiterating mine, really.

So God should just come forward and fix all your problems?

 

[EcK]

So God should just come forward and fix all your problems?

I'd rather have santa. Imaginary mass murderers claiming to be my daddy just aren't my thing. Call me strange.

 

[Sniffles]

I'd rather have santa. Imaginary mass murderers claiming to be my daddy just aren't my thing. Call me strange.

I'll just call you a Village Atheist.

 

[EcK]

I'll just call you a Village Atheist.

As if changing the size of the sample made you look any less profoundly delusional.

 

[Snuggletron]

So God should just come forward and fix all your problems?

Well, he could just come forward. But It's not possible for God to come out from just over the horizon because he would have to leave the realm of the supernatural.

 

[Sniffles]

As if changing the size of the sample made you look any less profoundly delusional.

Sophistry as only a Frenchman could perform. Bravo!

 

[Beorn]

you misunderstood the question. Even if it is "rigged" why is it bad?