[ENTJ] How do ENTJs become likeable and less threatening to others?

[ajblaise]

I believe male ENTJs should be held in cages.

And I believe the same of female ENTJs... joint operation in the works?

 

[Nicodemus]

Sorry, bro. The ENTJ women seem rather smooth.

 

[ajblaise]

Exactly. That's why I want them in my cage.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I have yet to find a cage that can hold me.

 

[Falcon]

I believe male ENTJs should be held in cages.

It is necessary to cater to the emotional and instinctive components when people are not being rational.

 

[ReflecTcelfeR]

No one keeps baby in the corner!

 

[Falcon]

No one keeps baby in the corner!

You know that's why they love us

 

[bcubchgo]

:steam: You're jumping to conclusions here. Where did you read that I had aspirations of being only logical? Are you trying to argue just to argue?

could ask the same question of you.

:steam: Both being detached emotionally and being overly involved in emotions are a problem - this is your case, no, since you report being "Limbic" on the SLOAN test, or the equivalent of "Neurotic" in the Five Factor Model.

lol I never said that, you're just saying that to be a pain in the ass. Again, I am not Limbic, I've told you that before. I am inquisitive do you see it in my SIG?

:steam: What are you talking about? These definitions are not personal, they come from researchers in the field? Why are you talking about selfless, don't you think that's idealistic?

just an opinion. take it or leave it. The selfless part means that you have the ability to step outside your own interests and emote in someway if someone requests that you do it. Few people have the ability to do this because as a society we are increasingly sending approval messages to people who behave like hardasses or stubborn obstinates. I really think that collaboration is becoming a lost art form, and some of it has to do with a very "mavericky" disposition that seems to be all the rage in America these days.

:steam: What are you talking about, this is not correct!

in your opinion.

 

[Windigo]

Personally, I like ENTJs ... except for that tendency many have to want to take charge all the time. A bit more leadership by committed would be nice. Of course, I imagine that many ENTJs see me as a bit too laissez faire.

Even as a child when I wasn't trying to take charge annoying people followed me around asking me what to do . . .
In high school I had no idea I was the center of a clique until I moved away and not one of the 5 girls I ate lunch with every day had spoken to one another after I moved to a different state.

What was REALLY sad is that each one wrote me a beautiful letter telling me that I was the BEST friend they ever had and I didn't have a clue. Hmmmm.

In college everyone was always calling me to find out what was going on and people were always fighting to be a part of my study group because not only did we get the highest scores but we studied WHILE rock climbing, mountain biking hanging out at the beach, etc.

I guess ENTJs have a knack for finding other interesting, active, intelligent people to hang around with and sometimes forget in the excitement of the proverbial battle of wit that there can be collateral damages.
It was probably an ENTJ that wrote "iron sharpens iron."

I'm not usually trying to tell other people what to do but if you're going to join in on my game you'll have to pass any changes to the rules through me. Otherwise start your own damn group.

 

[ReflecTcelfeR]

Give the people what they want, speak out against oppression! Yeah, seems rather charming.

 

[Spamtar]

I think they do best if they just allow their natural shine to shine. Like in the Shining. ;-)

Maybe add a bit of oil of clove when drilling into peoples teeth.

I have a natural admiration for ENTJ women to the point of being sexual even without seeing how they look; I mostly only get off-put by ENTJs (both men and women) when they go on a revenge/stomp down on people (not just me just when they do it to people in general). They don't seem to always realize when they go overboard on people (both in length of time and intensity); to put it lightly.

My advice: hold back on the discipline/punishment as it harms you more than the enemy when you go overboard (whereas some other types seem to be able to get away with this with impunity). For whatever reason, when they do that there is that uneasy feeling...which is hard to pinpoint...as when one would imagine one gets when sleeping with a cannibal.

 

[Windigo]

We are winners, so whenever, even subtely, we get the impression that we can't attain something or aren't allowed to, we will do it to prove we can.

We become single minded when this happens, other peoples feelings just don't factor in, we are in competitive mode, and I am sure other ENTJ's can relate.

I have to admit that if someone tells me I CANT do or have something it makes me weigh the worth of fighting for it. Sometimes I realize the chase isn't really worth the prize and walk away. . . but once I'm in competition mode a sort of hyper-focus (. . . idk, blood lust?) sets in. My ISTP husband LOVES this about me for some strange reason.

@SPAMTAR:

I mostly only get off-put by ENTJs (both men and women) when they go on a revenge/stomp down on people (not just me just when they do it to people in general).

I learned really young that my immediate temptation was to get vindictive . . . but perhaps because I watched my ESTP mother leave a bloddy trail of wounded souls behind her I learned to curtail it pretty quickly.

I spend a lot of time trying to LISTEN to people to get their perspective (somewhere I realized along the way that people are usually trying to do their best and just want to be validated) however you're damned if you do and damned if you don't . . . People then get pissed off at me for acting too emotionally detached (like their psychiatrist) and feel as though I am being dishonest with them (silently plotting their destruction?) Which in a way I am (being dishonest that is) . . . it's really hard for me to ooze warm fuzziness in most circumstances . . . but I always try to be objective.

 

[Spamtar]

. . . but once I'm in competition mode a sort of hyper-focus (. . . idk, blood lust?) sets in. My ISTP husband LOVES this about me for some strange reason.

Yes it is strangely attractive. Lucky ISTP and lucky you as I suspect IxTPs can particularly appreciate this otherworldly aesthetic.

 

[Windigo]

I do find that most of my romantic interests in life have been IxTPs. Although, I generally have many different types of male friends, most have admitted to me that my competition and intelligence intimidates them. I think all IxTP men have fantasies which include strong women as long as those same women respect them in return.

 

[figsfiggyfigs]

They don't seem to always realize when they go overboard on people (both in length of time and intensity); to put it lightly.

To be honest, I have a really hard time with this... I've upset quite a few people by being too intense, whether I'm being playful, or serious.
I tend to push push push until I push too far. I like knowing where the limits are, but most of the time, I don't even know that I'm doing it--I haven't even started "testing my limits" with said individual and they've already reacted.

I don't like "revenge", I find it to be a waste of time. However.... I have "stomped down" on a few people, or at least, that's how it would appear, when in fact, I was only expressing my utter frustration with them.

 

[Vie]

I'm that same way.
I push people and I don't even realize I'm doing it. I set really high expectations of those around me - even if they are the same expectations I hold for myself, it seems to annoy those around me.
The shitty thing about it is, is that even when I finally notice that I'm doing it - it's near impossible for me to stop. I've been told that I treat life like a giant chess game and the people around me are my pawns who I push about in hopes of achieving a goal. I don't think it's so much that but more of...you know, I can't even say why I do it. I just do. Push, push, push. Intensely and extremely fierce. Some men/people like this at first - but when they really that my enthusiastic intensity rarely fades, they see it as a vice. Smh.

I don't really get revenge, either. Stomping down on people occurs when I've reached my threshold of annoyance with them. I say or do what needs to be said and wash my hands of them. One time occurrence, just so they know to stay away from me. Revenge is a waste of time, energy, and accomplishes nothing.

 

[MoneyTick]

To be honest, I have a really hard time with this... I've upset quite a few people by being too intense, whether I'm being playful, or serious.
I tend to push push push until I push too far. I like knowing where the limits are, but most of the time, I don't even know that I'm doing it--I haven't even started "testing my limits" with said individual and they've already reacted.

I don't like "revenge", I find it to be a waste of time. However.... I have "stomped down" on a few people, or at least, that's how it would appear, when in fact, I was only expressing my utter frustration with them.

^^^ I guess this something that applies exclusively to ENTJ women.

As for myself, I can be "intense" when it comes down to business and things need to get done - but when I'm dealing with people outside of such context I generally perceive myself as pleasant, mannerly, and nice (or so I've been told).

Albeit, at work - I slit throat. I don't tell people what to do, I give them a good reason to do it. I shove their personal goals down their throat so they get excited, and make them regurgitate results for the company. A costly counterstrike from a competitor is great news in my territory, it just means were ahead of the game. Nasty demand action notices from the FDA and IRS? Its like reading pleasant poetry! I have to show you an apology letter I got from the IRS one day! Haha

And when the "good times" come crumbling down leaving devastation, depression and failure in its wake - its good morning all over again!

A day at work for me is like the entire chronicles of World War II coming alive in my office with Hitler himself holding me at gunpoint ready to pull the trigger if I botch something up. This is what I thrive on, and I fucking love it.

And then ... all of a sudden, I get home and everything changes.

It doesn't feel natural for me anymore to boss my colleagues/friends/peers around. I become extremely nice, even to the point where I start sucking up to people. I can't seem to have that "confrontational tone" anymore.

Outside of work - I'm just a mannerly, nice guy that genuinely respects people.

I guess I'm a really paradoxical person.

 

[Windigo]

@MoneyTick

I can totally relate to what you're saying. I thrive on the battlefield mentality . . . must be why I enjoy war movies so much.
I have always been nice and pleasant, the one people wanted at their parties when I was younger, but now that I am older and a mother to teenagers, I'm beginning to recognize that the ENTJ mind set is NOT appreciated. Not by my children or other mothers with whom I am forced to associate due to Brownies, school function, ect.
And my anger at my teenage daughter because of her lack of reasoning skill and repeatedly making the same mistake should not make me want to kick her out of the house (ie "fire her ass") and yet it does and none of the other moms understand how I can be so cold. It's excruciatingly painful for me to watch her make the same mistakes repeatedly and expect different results . . . I am learning to master the "Oh, that's nice dear," approach.

I think this is where ENTJs really have a lot of learning to do, when they marry and have children. It's a whole painfully different ball game than work . . . it is painful to realize that not everyone has the same high expectations for their life as you do for yours. Some people thrive on the experience of being used, kicked around and labeled by other . . . others thrive on just pissing you off and because you can't fire them . . . you have to just learn to love them anyway. FRUSTRATING but mellowing for an ENTJ. I don't know if ENTJ men have the same task as fathers.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I'm at the bottom of the totem pole at work so I just try and be nice to everyone and work as hard as I can.

 

[Falcon]

@MoneyTick

I can totally relate to what you're saying. I thrive on the battlefield mentality . . . must be why I enjoy war movies so much.
I have always been nice and pleasant, the one people wanted at their parties when I was younger, but now that I am older and a mother to teenagers, I'm beginning to recognize that the ENTJ mind set is NOT appreciated. Not by my children or other mothers with whom I am forced to associate due to Brownies, school function, ect.
And my anger at my teenage daughter because of her lack of reasoning skill and repeatedly making the same mistake should not make me want to kick her out of the house (ie "fire her ass") and yet it does and none of the other moms understand how I can be so cold. It's excruciatingly painful for me to watch her make the same mistakes repeatedly and expect different results . . . I am learning to master the "Oh, that's nice dear," approach.

I think this is where ENTJs really have a lot of learning to do, when they marry and have children. It's a whole painfully different ball game than work . . . it is painful to realize that not everyone has the same high expectations for their life as you do for yours. Some people thrive on the experience of being used, kicked around and labeled by other . . . others thrive on just pissing you off and because you can't fire them . . . you have to just learn to love them anyway. FRUSTRATING but mellowing for an ENTJ. I don't know if ENTJ men have the same task as fathers.

You are completely right. When younger, we think we are nice, but we are far tougher than the others. With time, we become ever tougher. We are not there to be appreciated. The price to pay for competence is to be disliked superficially - it's a small price, and it's really worth it.

Forget about the "oh that's nice dear" approach or the anger approach - both are stupid. Make a plan to *maximize* the competence of your daugher - it doesn't matter what level she reaches, if you have put everything in place, you have done your job. You then need to understand if her logic is flawed, which could explain her motivational bias.

Just get out there, start projects and get involved... there's nothing better than managing projects and making things progress.