[Ne] ESxJs...How do you experience Ne-doms?

[Amargith]

*sneaks into SJ Guardhouse*


Im starting to wonder about the dynamic between the Dominant function and the Tertiary. Since you guys hold the tertiary to our dominant....I was wondering:

What are Ne-doms like for you? Do you get along with them? If so, does that have to do with the Ne-connection? If not, is it due to feeling corrected by the Ne-dom? And how does that manifest itself?

 

[SD45T-2]

Well, I think Mark Steyn and P. J. O'Rourke (both ENTPs) are awesome.

 

[Haven]

First, i smile, wave, wait for them to get bored and move on.

If they haven't, chances are we become good friends. Distant friends if we have too many disagreements. In rare cases, bitter enemies.

I don't feel corrected? Not sure what that's a reference to, usually it's me doing the correcting.... or encouraging.

 

[Showbread]

Um, it really depends on the person. I don't know many ENTPs, the one I did know was seriously bitchy, which I don't attribute to her type.

I generally like ENFPs though, we get a long quite well. I appreciate their spontaneity, they appreciate my ability to plan things when we need structure. I think my biggest frustration is that I often find them flakey. :/ Or, they think I am boring. I do have one ENFp that I am particularly close to. When we met like 6 years ago she was kind of a mentor figure for me, but we are basically peers now. We've have a good long run with our friendship. Her flakiness is definitely what bothers me most about her.

 

[Amargith]

Yeah flakiness is not..an easy thing to turn off or deal with Ive found

Tnx for the replies. I meant to ask specifically about Ne, because it is your tertiary. And I've noticed that the tertiary and the dominant version of it can sometimes run into problems, where the dominant will pull rank on the tertiary in interactions and dictate how things 'should be' - Intjs and Istps for instance often run into that problem, I find. I was wondering if you experienced that with dominant Ne.

And, you alerted me to something else - which you also see in the INTJ - ISTP issues: the secondary with the inferior. Si. Our Si must occasionally look really incompetent to you.

Anycase, it's just a pet theory about the dynamics found in mbti that I was wondering about.

Funny fact: I...like SJs, I just feel like I torture them with my presence - that they do not know what to do with me, where to put me, how to read me, unless I really tone myself down. They are amazing though when you're having problems with some stupid details you aint seeing that ruin everything - true life savers. But I also know that my...sheer rate of random chaos and flakiness tends to drive them batty as i unwillingly ruin their...well, routine and systems, set up for keeping this stuff orderly.

 

[chubber]

First, i smile, wave, wait for them to get bored and move on.

If they haven't, chances are we become good friends. Distant friends if we have too many disagreements. In rare cases, bitter enemies.

I don't feel corrected? Not sure what that's a reference to, usually it's me doing the correcting.... or encouraging.

haha, or criticizing

 

[Showbread]

Yeah flakiness is not..an easy thing to turn off or deal with Ive found

Tnx for the replies. I meant to ask specifically about Ne, because it is your tertiary. And I've noticed that the tertiary and the dominant version of it can sometimes run into problems, where the dominant will pull rank on the tertiary in interactions and dictate how things 'should be' - Intjs and Istps for instance often run into that problem, I find. I was wondering if you experienced that with dominant Ne.

And, you alerted me to something else - which you also see in the INTJ - ISTP issues: the secondary with the inferior. Si. Our Si must occasionally look really incompetent to you.

Anycase, it's just a pet theory about the dynamics found in mbti that I was wondering about.

Funny fact: I...like SJs, I just feel like I torture them with my presence - that they do not know what to do with me, where to put me, how to read me, unless I really tone myself down. They are amazing though when you're having problems with some stupid details you aint seeing that ruin everything - true life savers. But I also know that my...sheer rate of random chaos and flakiness tends to drive them batty as i unwillingly ruin their...well, routine and systems, set up for keeping this stuff orderly.

My feedback may not be terribly valuable in this case then since my Si is only marginally more dominant than Ne...

 

[EJCC]

Im starting to wonder about the dynamic between the Dominant function and the Tertiary. Since you guys hold the tertiary to our dominant....I was wondering:

What are Ne-doms like for you? Do you get along with them? If so, does that have to do with the Ne-connection? If not, is it due to feeling corrected by the Ne-dom? And how does that manifest itself?

I find that our senses of humor mesh well. Like Ne-dom humor is a less restrained version of our humor. B/c it really takes The Right Environment for our Ne to show itself -- and even then it's not as Ne as your Ne.

On that note, I guess it is correction, in a way (though I would have used the word "balance"). You folks help us loosen up a little. Encourage us to push those boundaries. ENTPs especially, since boundary-pushing is pretty much their favorite hobby.


Edit: I get along extremely well with ENFPs -- my best friend in the world is an ENFP -- but the ENTPs I've met IRL have generally rubbed me the wrong way. But that's almost entirely an Fi vs. Ti issue.

Yeah flakiness is not..an easy thing to turn off or deal with Ive found

Tnx for the replies. I meant to ask specifically about Ne, because it is your tertiary. And I've noticed that the tertiary and the dominant version of it can sometimes run into problems, where the dominant will pull rank on the tertiary in interactions and dictate how things 'should be' - Intjs and Istps for instance often run into that problem, I find. I was wondering if you experienced that with dominant Ne.

I can't imagine Ne ever forcing someone to think that something "should be" a particular way. That's not what Ne does. Unless I'm missing something?

Funny fact: I...like SJs, I just feel like I torture them with my presence - that they do not know what to do with me, where to put me, how to read me, unless I really tone myself down. They are amazing though when you're having problems with some stupid details you aint seeing that ruin everything - true life savers. But I also know that my...sheer rate of random chaos and flakiness tends to drive them batty as i unwillingly ruin their...well, routine and systems, set up for keeping this stuff orderly.

I wonder if this is the case with SJs who were more encouraged towards stereotypical SJ-ness throughout their lives... if that makes sense. SJs who had a lot of SJ friends, or friends who had more "established"/"popular" senses of humor. Compared with SJs who had more of an N presence in their lives, be it in their family, their friend group, wherever. Really it's just a matter of what humor we're used to. If we're used to Ne, then we'll love Ne. Otherwise it's "weird".

(Background: Most of my friends are Ns, my parents are respectively INTP and INFJ, and like I said earlier, my bestie is ENFP. Also feel free to extend the word "humor" to all aspects of Ne, when you read this post)

 

[PimpinMcBoltage]

I heard that the ESxJs like to go Ne dom hunting so that they can beat them with a bundle of clean socks tied to a string. Is this true? It sounds like fun.

 

[1487610420]

Yes.

 

[Amargith]

I find that our senses of humor mesh well. Like Ne-dom humor is a less restrained version of our humor. B/c it really takes The Right Environment for our Ne to show itself -- and even then it's not as Ne as your Ne.

On that note, I guess it is correction, in a way (though I would have used the word "balance"). You folks help us loosen up a little. Encourage us to push those boundaries. ENTPs especially, since boundary-pushing is pretty much their favorite hobby.

Edit: I get along extremely well with ENFPs -- my best friend in the world is an ENFP -- but the ENTPs I've met IRL have generally rubbed me the wrong way. But that's almost entirely an Fi vs. Ti issue.

I hear ya there, my friend *glares at ENTPs *

I can't imagine Ne ever forcing someone to think that something "should be" a particular way. That's not what Ne does. Unless I'm missing something?

See, I would love to believe that. I so want that to be true. But let's face it - *EVERY* dominant function rules like a king. It's the perspective you see the world through and it can get domineering with others, for sure. That includes Ne.

I...find that for myself it manifests itself in sheer irony - in typical Ne trickster fashion.

I find myself insisting that other people *see* all f**** angles already, it aint that hard! That they see all povs of other people and take them into account. Occasionally, the misunderstandings that happen due to not seeing each others pov makes me wanna

But...let's face it. That is a form of hypocrisy as I'm shoving Ne(Fi) pov switching down their throat
It's the eternal question of...do you get to be intolerant towards intolerance and how is it not hypocritical?

I wonder if this is the case with SJs who were more encouraged towards stereotypical SJ-ness throughout their lives... if that makes sense. SJs who had a lot of SJ friends, or friends who had more "established"/"popular" senses of humor. Compared with SJs who had more of an N presence in their lives, be it in their family, their friend group, wherever. Really it's just a matter of what humor we're used to. If we're used to Ne, then we'll love Ne. Otherwise it's "weird".

(Background: Most of my friends are Ns, my parents are respectively INTP and INFJ, and like I said earlier, my bestie is ENFP. Also feel free to extend the word "humor" to all aspects of Ne, when you read this post)

I do believe you re correct. I have a sister in law like that...ESFJ. She isn't too fond of our family populated with Ne-doms for that very reason

It is possibly also the correlation between the aux and the inferior. Ive noticed lately that the Dominant and the tertiary fight like adult and teenager, and the aux and the inferior possibly have a similar relationship as the big sister who sighs that the baby is so f*** helpless it needs everything spelled out.

The impatience my sister in law displays with me, my brother and even my father is...indicative of that. My mom however, Si-dom that she is, coddles my inferior - and I hers.

But, so far, you guys are disproving my theory

 

[1487610420]

I find myself insisting that other people *see* all f**** angles already, it aint that hard! That they see all povs of other people and take them into account. Occasionally, the misunderstandings that happen due to not seeing each others pov makes me wanna

But...let's face it. That is a form of hypocrisy as I'm shoving Ne(Fi) pov switching down their throat
It's the eternal question of...do you get to be intolerant towards intolerance and how is it not hypocritical?

And such a good first step towards becoming a well-rounded individual and unbound by BS type stereotypes (OIW fear of stepping out of one's comfort zone but expecting others to do so).

 

[Amargith]

And such a good first step towards becoming a well-rounded individual and unbound by BS type stereotypes (OIW fear of stepping out of one's comfort zone but expecting others to do so).

Uh huh. Last I checked, I wasn't the only Ne-dom here, cup cake

Ive always sort of known this, but there is a difference between knowing it and actually doing something with it. For that matter, stepping out of your dominant perspective should be an exception, as far as Im concerned as that is where your strength lies. But still, it begs the question posed in this thread. Pulling rank with your dominant function is something that many of us do without realising, I think and the cause of many a rift between people, and delay on work, as well as the foundation for politics from what I can see. And it certainly has its place, as it can cut through bullshit and rally the troops when need be. Im just questioning how others, especially the teenage version..experience it, put up with it, appreciate it, hate it, etc.

Aka...more Ne-homework

 

[1487610420]

Uh huh. Last I checked, I wasn't the only Ne-dom here, cup cake

Ive always sort of known this, but there is a difference between knowing it and actually doing something with it. For that matter, stepping out of your dominant perspective should be an exception, as far as Im concerned as that is where your strength lies. But still, it begs the question posed in this thread. Pulling rank with your dominant function is something that many of us do without realising, I think and the cause of many a rift between people, and delay on work, as well as the foundation for politics from what I can see. And it certainly has its place, as it can cut through bullshit and rally the troops when need be. Im just questioning how others, especially the teenage version..experience it, put up with it, appreciate it, hate it, etc.

Aka...more Ne-homework

sounds like you've got a lot of work ahead of you. Better get started.

 

[Amargith]

sounds like you've got a lot of work ahead of you. Better get started.

*looks at you*
*holds up mirror*
*eats apple*

 

[chubber]

I thought the key was to build bridges, at least halfway, instead of DIY everything. They need to build the other part too.

 

[Amargith]

I thought the key was to build bridges, at least halfway, instead of DIY everything. They need to build the other part too.

You cannot force them to do so, or do it for them when they are against it though..thats the problem.

 

[chubber]

You cannot force them to do so, or do it for them when they are against it though..thats the problem.

And you are trying to figure out the carrot to place in front of the donkey?

 

[Amargith]

And you are trying to figure out the carrot to place in front of the donkey?

I'm trying to find out what the stick-part of Ne looks and feels like to others and how I can swap it for an Ne-carrot instead

 

[chubber]

I'm trying to find out what the stick-part of Ne looks and feels like to others and how I can swap it for an Ne-carrot instead

ESFJs continue to surprise me.

Your specific question was related to ESFJ. Maybe your problem with them is more Fe-dom related and you wish to connect to them on Ne? My best guess is that when it comes to ESFJs, you will have to be consistent and show it through your actions (not being flaky), to feed that Fe Si combo of ESFJs. Once they trust you, they will probably open up more. I also tried the Ne approach with them. It does interest them, but Fe Si will be always have this watchful eye over you, hence the requirement of showing them through actions.