[Type 5] ENFP 5???

[Sunny Ghost]

[MENTION=10082]Starry[/MENTION] I'm glad that any input I had was helpful in helping you understand your ISFP. Even more surprising that it/I/my comments had an impact. That makes me happy to hear.

I've known a lot of ENFP's. And each had their intellectual side, where they wanted to discuss deeper matters. But a lot of them showed more of a playful side. Especially the ones who I would consider e7's. And most of them leaned more towards the spiritual/hippy side.

The two in particular that I thought might be e5's had less of that religious/spiritual side and more of the debating side to them. But the more I think about it, the more I think they may be more 4w5. I'm not as familiar with enneagram as I am mbti.

Oh, as far as ISFP's and intellectually stimulating conversation goes: we do enjoy it. Or at least I do. But it depends on the manner in which information is being presented and also who is involved in the conversation. You'll never catch me in the middle of a group discussion. And especially if some of the speakers and opinions are of mean spirit. In more personable groups, I'm willing to discuss ideas to greater lengths. Or at least hear them out.

 

[Lady_X]

It's possible they were 8w7 too maybe?? I say that since you mentioned debate. My enfp type 8 ex was all intellectual and liked to debate.

 

[Azure Flame]

Is this possible?
I never saw any ENFP 5s on this forum, it's more common for INTs to be 5s. I know there are ENTP and INFP 5s, so why not ENFPs too?
It would explain why I mistook myself for an INTP a whole lotta time.

Could you imagine how an ENFP 5 would be like?

Have you tried INFJ?

enfp's and infj's often mistype as one another.

 

[Stephano]

Yeah, I considered it, but now I'm definetely sure that I'm not a judger.

I'm rather ENFP, INFP, ENTP,..
But I'm pretty sure that I have Fi and extroversion.

 

[Starry]

I think I know what you're getting at. Ne doms seem so expansive and exploratory while e5s seem so specialized in their expertise and self-contained with the "avarice" (along with the detached observer thing going on... ENXPs usually seem to be in the action). I think the expansive and exploratory nature of Ne doms could easily make them highly intellectual but not typically in the e5 sort of way. I see e7s as more guilty of gluttony while e5s are more guilty of being stingy.

I am a fairly INFJ-like ENFJ but it always felt like cognitive dissonance when I was convinced of e5 for myself. On the surface, I come off like a strong introvert but no matter how much I try to be a hermit, I always crave interaction with the outer world after a day or two... it never works out. Lol

Exactly G. Expanding out vs expanding within <-er well maybe not ha. idk I just woke up. But the photo-negative (to each other) qualities of e7 & e5 have always been interesting to note...especially this misguided belief that seems to keep each perspective type perpetually distracted from what the *real* problem is... this thought of IF I can just get to point B (point B being a new point in time in the future, a new in-taking of information, a new idea or person or situation, a new discovery via the rehashing of already acquired information...) THEN I will be okay/happy/confident.

You are a quiet ENFJ. And I believe e5 has served its purpose. But now it's time for you to arrive and become an image spinning attention whore claim your spot in the sun.

 

[Starry]

Oh, as far as ISFP's and intellectually stimulating conversation goes: we do enjoy it. Or at least I do. But it depends on the manner in which information is being presented and also who is involved in the conversation. You'll never catch me in the middle of a group discussion. And especially if some of the speakers and opinions are of mean spirit. In more personable groups, I'm willing to discuss ideas to greater lengths. Or at least hear them out.

Well, I'm a bit bummed to learn this because I've always wanted to organize an 'All ISFP' mean spirited discussion but now...?

It's interesting because I was just saying a similar thing re ISFPs (to what you said above) to gromit. You have always struck me as 'an intellectual'...many ISFPs do and I think it's due in part to being able to straddle the line between the theoretical and the practical. ESFPs do this as well. There's comfort in both realms completely void of that sickening intellectual competitiveness and arrogance. And the playing field is always level and welcome to all. I often struggle to communicate with this never-ending traffic jam of info and ideas I've got in this head of mine...And not once has my ISFP made me feel inferior because of this but naturally balances my far out notions with practical applications <-because he knows this is the part I lack. You have always done a similar thing here and it's of such great value.

And please VM me concerning your avi pic because it's making me crazy! haha

 

[Sunny Ghost]

Well, I'm a bit bummed to learn this because I've always wanted to organize an 'All ISFP' mean spirited discussion but now...?

It's interesting because I was just saying a similar thing re ISFPs (to what you said above) to gromit. You have always struck me as 'an intellectual'...many ISFPs do and I think it's due in part to being able to straddle the line between the theoretical and the practical. ESFPs do this as well. There's comfort in both realms completely void of that sickening intellectual competitiveness and arrogance. And the playing field is always level and welcome to all. I often struggle to communicate with this never-ending traffic jam of info and ideas I've got in this head of mine...And not once has my ISFP made me feel inferior because of this but naturally balances my far out notions with practical applications <-because he knows this is the part I lack. You have always done a similar thing here and it's of such great value.

And please VM me concerning your avi pic because it's making me crazy! haha

I have a really close ENFP female friend. We've only become close in the last 6 to 8 months. But I love this chick. We went on a vacation recently, and normally long car rides at some point will create a lull in the conversation. Which I'm totally cool with, because I like to take in the scenery, or listen to music or zone off mentally. But this ENFP and I talked the entire car ride of 8-9 hours. I don't think I've ever done that with anyone before. She's always mentally jumping around from one idea to another cool topic. She always has interesting little tid bits of knowledge. And one of her comments to me, was that somehow I always have tidbits of knowledge that she doesn't know, that somehow fit along with topics she brings up. So we have very fluid, interesting, intelligent conversations all the time. And I love that about her. She allows me to dig in my brain and bring up things I've read elsewhere or learned elsewhere, that not many people give me the opportunity to do.

She refused to let me tell her she was an ENFP though. I think that was the only time she got mad on the entire car trip.

What's wrong with my avitar? haha.

 

[Azure Flame]

Yeah, I considered it, but now I'm definetely sure that I'm not a judger.

I'm rather ENFP, INFP, ENTP,..
But I'm pretty sure that I have Fi and extroversion.

I'm definitely sure you don't have a grasp of the functions yet. The 4 letters mean nothing unless you're using Kiersey, which is a different system entirely on its own. In kiersey, you could very well be an ENFP. In kiersey, I'm an ISTP, but sometimes come off as ENTJ. But my cognitive functions are Se Ti Fe Ni.

What is your reason for Fi?
What is your reason for extroversion?

 

[Stephano]

I'm definitely sure you don't have a grasp of the functions yet.

I know ENTPs use Fe, but despite that I consider it as my third possibility.

What is your reason for Fi?
What is your reason for extroversion?

I'm idealistic and often have different values than the people around me. I only buy chocolate and coffee that is fairtrade certified and refuse to consume it when I get an offer.
No one in my family seems to care about it but me and there's nobody with dom/aux Fi for sure, mostly SJs.

I get energized by people. Although I don't like parties that much, I'm an extro. When I'm alone at home for to long I get depressed.

 

[Azure Flame]

I know ENTPs use Fe, but despite that I consider it as my third possibility.



I'm idealistic and often have different values than the people around me. I only buy chocolate and coffee that is fairtrade certified and refuse to consume it when I get an offer.
No one in my family seems to care about it but me and there's nobody with dom/aux Fi for sure, mostly SJs.

I get energized by people. Although I don't like parties that much, I'm an extro. When I'm alone at home for to long I get depressed.

hmm, part of your coffee example sounds like Si, but its hard to say.

 

[Azure Flame]

I have a really close ENFP female friend. We've only become close in the last 6 to 8 months. But I love this chick. We went on a vacation recently, and normally long car rides at some point will create a lull in the conversation. Which I'm totally cool with, because I like to take in the scenery, or listen to music or zone off mentally. But this ENFP and I talked the entire car ride of 8-9 hours. I don't think I've ever done that with anyone before. She's always mentally jumping around from one idea to another cool topic. She always has interesting little tid bits of knowledge. And one of her comments to me, was that somehow I always have tidbits of knowledge that she doesn't know, that somehow fit along with topics she brings up. So we have very fluid, interesting, intelligent conversations all the time. And I love that about her. She allows me to dig in my brain and bring up things I've read elsewhere or learned elsewhere, that not many people give me the opportunity to do.

She refused to let me tell her she was an ENFP though. I think that was the only time she got mad on the entire car trip.

What's wrong with my avitar? haha.

Let me guess, she did the talking and you did the listening?

 

[Lady_X]

You need to get out and meet more enfps I'm thinkin dj.

Its a pretty rare and awesome thing to find a friend who you enjoy talking with so much. It's not just enfps just like to talk. Maybe some do. Idk I've never met those But the ones I know can be just as quiet and anyone else unless they're with someone who they just click with conversation wise. It wouldn't happen with everyone. When my isfj sister used to go in trips together wed spend the whole time talking. We've always been that way too. I'm that way with my infj mom too and the amount of talking is equal... Was that way with an infj friend too. My esfj friend now that's a different story. She's the one talking most of the time.

 

[Avocado]

A common comment my mother would get is:

"Wow, your boy sure is sweet, but he can sure talk..."

 

[Sunny Ghost]

Let me guess, she did the talking and you did the listening?

Lol. She def. kept it going most of the time, I won't deny that. But, it was enjoyable. We both always have something to add on to the others comments.

 

[Avocado]

Hey Stephano,

As an ENFP e7 ... I don't feel right saying 'no' or 'never' or 'not possible' to anything. With regards to ENFP e5 though? I know there are enneagram amateurs and professionals that claim any MBTI/e-type combo is possible but I admit to having my doubts especially as it pertains to Pe-dominance and e5.
Okay I will admit to thinking this combination is not possible. I do not believe there are...any true ENFP or ENTP e5s.

What I do believe?

I believe the e7 descriptions are the absolute worst of all of the e-types...possibly combined (while we're on the topic of combos...) I believe an actual e7...over the age of 16 and new to enneagram...will read any one of the countless e7 descriptions out there and think... 1.) no, I'm nothing like Charlie Sheen... 2.) not like Robin Williams either huh...? 3.) no this isn't right...I'm sure as hell not happy all the time...I definitely become depressed and experience a good deal of pain and suffering. I think deeply on all subjects...and I have great compassion for others and the conditions of the world. I'm not addicted to meth, alcohol, sex or attention...I'm not the 'life of the party' - I fuckin hate crowded spaces. I must be an e4, 5 or 6.

Actual ENxPs that have matured will often be hard-pressed to see themselves in the e7 descriptions. Actual 7w6s will often be hard-pressed to see themselves in the e7 descriptions (in general they seem to be written with a 7w8 & Se bias.) But it is the ENxP that is over the age of 16-18 that has experienced some debilitating life circumstance/struggle that will be the most challenged of all to see themselves in the e7 descriptions. They will usually believe [edit: start to question if] they are INxPs... And/or if they have a 6 wing that is exaggerated at that time and they are experiencing a lot of anxiety and paranoia... they generally come to believe they are e6w7. Overactive 6 wing + stressful connection to e5...6w5. Some depression coupled with an over-focus on the self... e4w5.... Isolation, sobriety, hoarding time, energy, ideas and affection...

I have definitely seen a few ENFPs in my time that had their e-type listed as e5. I am of the opinion they were actually e7s starring down some of the shittiest descriptions known to man.

That 7w6 does sound a lot like me...
especially if you factor in a stressful connection to 5...
Although...
4w5 fits decently, too...
I sit around and analyze my deeply hurt feelings...
[MENTION=5418]Lady X[/MENTION]
would ultimately agree...

 

[Starry]

That 7w6 does sound a lot like me...
especially if you factor in a stressful connection to 5...
Although...
4w5 fits decently, too...
I sit around and analyze my deeply hurt feelings...

[MENTION=5418]Lady X[/MENTION]
would ultimately agree...

Well, if Lady X has discussed this with you and *ultimately agrees* then in some amazingly-strange-mystical-alternate-universe... I may have also *ultimately agreed* and just don't know it yet. Only time will tell.

edit: do keep in mind that Lady X is one of those superhuman e7s that have e2 in their tritype as opposed to e4. There was a time I had enough energy to devote to sitting around and analyzing my deeply hurt feelings...and out of that was birthed some of the worst poetry ever written. But damn did I feel awesome feeling so not awesome. During this same time Lady X was vacationing in some tropical land.

 

[Avocado]

Well, if Lady X has discussed this with you and *ultimately agrees* then in some amazingly-strange-mystical-alternate-universe... I may have also *ultimately agreed* and just don't know it yet. Only time will tell.

I talked about the deep void inside me…
Is it possible to be simultaneously a 7w6 and a 4w5?
What would that look like?

By the way, I like how you played off of my typo…
I was just asking her how I could make the pain deep inside of me stop, and she said pain like that could only come from fi mixed with 4w5.
She didn't specifically say that was core, though…

I do the 7w6 escape thing, too…
…but it's like trying to put out a house fire with a squirt gun…
…could you blame me for trying, though?

 

[Starry]

I talked about the deep void inside me…
Is it possible to be simultaneously a 7w6 and a 4w5?
What would that look like?

By the way, I like how you played off of my typo…
I was just asking her how I could make the pain deep inside of me stop, and she said pain like that could only come from fi mixed with 4w5.
She didn't specifically say that was core, though…

I do the 7w6 escape thing, too…
…but it's like trying to put out a house fire with a squirt gun…
…could you blame me for trying, though?

First, I am honest when I say that I have no idea what you are talking about with regards to a typo haha. If you typed something incorrectly...and I did the same...then I assure you those were two separate typos with only ENFP to bind them together.

You know, I don't believe you can be two types at the same time...but with all I've seen and heard I imagine there are some out there that do haha. Perhaps google that. But I will say I recently asked another member if an individual can possess merely a deux-type as opposed to a tri-type because I fail to make a connection with any of the 'guts.' The only thing that I sense as it pertains to me (not you my dear)...is a counterphobic wing will put me at e8...but I only experience 7w6 and 4w5 as well.

Here's the deal though...you are a Head-Type...and in no stretch of the imagination a Heart-Type. You are all ADhD & worry & coming undone at the seams ...just like every other Head-Type here with you on the planet.

I know you do the 7w6 escape thing. You and I are so different and yet there are these things I see in you that remind me so much of myself had I been a nice, friendly young person as well. There definitely comes a point when what you are used to doing for distraction can no longer manage all the pain you have built up...using distraction. And here is where many e7s turn to actual vice/addiction. You can feel so proud of yourself that this is not what you are doing but rather here...figuring it all out. I have so much respect for you Magic Qwan. You will get there...this I know.

 

[Julius_Van_Der_Beak]

A lot of ENFPs I've met seem hostile to the very idea of a 5.

So I'm guesing, no.

 

[Lady_X]

Well, if Lady X has discussed this with you and *ultimately agrees* then in some amazingly-strange-mystical-alternate-universe... I may have also *ultimately agreed* and just don't know it yet. Only time will tell.

edit: do keep in mind that Lady X is one of those superhuman e7s that have e2 in their tritype as opposed to e4. There was a time I had enough energy to devote to sitting around and analyzing my deeply hurt feelings...and out of that was birthed some of the worst poetry ever written. But damn did I feel awesome feeling so not awesome. During this same time Lady X was vacationing in some tropical land.

haha!! oh god yeah for sure...see i don't do that at all but recognize it as 4ish. all of my reactions and instincts are 7, 2 and 9 ish. typically i distract...for a loooong time without knowing it....i may self sacrifice help others...forget about my stuff...or do nothing...be frozen...or mediate..compromise...but eventually i get sorta 5 ish (or maybe it's still 7) and detach...intellectualize...dissect...feel at peace with deep understanding of the greater significance/lesson etc.

never once did i sit in deep pain for any long period...i mean i hurt deeply...but i can't sit with it and explore it emotionally or intensify it

i mean...i am an sx...and there is mad intensity of emotion. it can feel like the most torturous broken heart movie...but what is going on feels much different than what goes on for a 4. you will not see my head lowered and defeated. i will not feel all woe is me...i will be like fuuuuuuuuuuuuuccccccccccckkkkkkkkkkkkkkk yooooooooooooooooouuuuuuuuuuu!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! or feel like i've been hit with a thousand daggers to the heart...but it's quick and sudden and cuts...it's not a stewing of emotion.

does that makes any sense at all?

plus...starry knows way more about enneagram than i do...i just know me...and some other people. that's all i got. and as a 7 i don't relate to his experience of pain.