Chad of the OttomanEmpire
Give me a fourth dot.
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2013
- Messages
- 1,052
- MBTI Type
- NeTi
- Enneagram
- 478
- Instinctual Variant
- sx/so
I'm one of those "introverted" extroverts that you hear about on typology forums.
I am what we describe as a "cognitive extravert", and I figured this out only by studying the cognitive functions, which clearly puts Si as my inferior function (hence, I infer that I am Ne-dominant, and it seems to fit).
First, let me state that I am not one of those delusional extroverts who is simply oblivious to how much she puts herself "out there". I mean I am a withdrawn-as-hell human being. I consider myself to be a loner with no social skills; I spend my weekends alone and consider myself chronically unable to make friends. I get all the "introvert" remarks--
- why are you so quiet?
- you need to learn to talk more?
- is something wrong? aren't you enjoying yourself?
- you need to learn to be more outgoing.
- you need to come out of your shell.
--as if telling me these things are going to magically convert me to YOUR obviously superior way of being.
Second, it helps to know I'm a 4w5 on the enneagram, meaning I am stuck between feeling like a freak and feeling completely isolated and different from the rest of humanity. I'm not outgoing, largely because I feel my presence is creepy, unwanted, or intrusive. I don't initiate conversations because I assume it's annoying of me, and I can easily get lost in fantasy land.
Simply put, I fit no one's criteria for "extrovert", especially not the MBTI's. But, I am in fact Ne-dom, and therefore a cognitive extravert. And I fit many extroverted criteria when it is seen as an attunement primarily towards the external environment. These include:
- Terror of the inner workings of my body
- Primary orientation toward things
- Not getting drained after socialization
- Needing outwards stimulation
- Needing to download thoughts externally
- Unable to carry on long chains of internal thought
- Taking other people's words about me as the truth of what I am
- Going stir-crazy when I can't discharge my thoughts
- Feeling like my brain is devouring itself when I try to build long chains of thought
- Being oblivious to one's environment (for Ne-doms)
- And that "Look at Me!" streak that occasionally cuts through my withdrawnness prolly has something to do with this too.
These are all signs of extraversion and have little to do with one's ability to socialize.
In my case, my extraversion does show itself in other ways--it's just very selective. It depends on both my chemistry with you, and upon context.
First, there are many people--I'd say the majority--for whom I simply have no desire to interact with at all. This is not to say that I dislike them, or that I'm being a snob. I'll make polite conversation if necessary, but I simply feel no deep sense of connection or see a reason to burden them with my presence.
In scenarios like these, I can even go into my 5ish "this is all happening on TV" observation mode, and forget I need to interact at all.
A few others can draw me out, and some people are so darn interesting to me I'll even initiate contact. These people can charge me up and my extraversion becomes more obvious to the outer world (this phenomenon happens a lot when I interact with other Ne-doms). Unfortunately, these folks are few and far between.
As to the "context" I mentioned above, well, I feel really awkward about talking to people just because "I'm supposed to". Actually, this just constipates my mind--my chattering brain stops, and my ability to form language is inversely proportional to the necessity with which I must do so. The harder I strain, the harder it is to think of anything to say! "Let's sit here and force conversation". YAY!
If I actually have some context in which to interact, it's that much easier. It's not that I don't want to interact, it's that I'm socially constipated.
Other times, I'd actually like to go do something but actually feel drained thinking about it. So, I decide it's going to be a hassle before I even go out and wind up staying home. If I'd just move past the transitional barrier here, I'd actually gain energy and be unable to settle down, but I always have the perception that being social is somehow going to drain me. Even though it won't.
My childhood had some influence here--I was bullied a lot as a kid. My parents and teachers taught me to "ignore" it, which I interpreted as "withdraw and pretend it doesn't exist". Sadly, this became my dominant view of how people see me and how I should interact.
Prior to this, I recall being a very serious child who was capable of sitting still for hours on end and concentrating, who was fascinated by nearly everything, yet who enjoyed her family's presence, was excited by nightlife, and who was extremely outgoing towards other kids at the park. (I'd say this phase in my life is the healthiest possible model of "introverted extroversion".)
So how do relcusive extraverts like me channel their outward-oriented energy?
- Writing, blogging, journaling
- Talking to the wall (Ne-doms are famous for monologues that no one listens to anyway!)
- Learning to speak foreign languages
- Internet surfing
- Chatting on online forums
- Listening to music really loud
- Juggling 4-5 creative projects at once
- Reading
- Gaming
- Taking brisk walks
- Going to supermarkets
- Doing two or more of these things at the same time
It's not ideal, but we introverted extroverts do exist!
I am what we describe as a "cognitive extravert", and I figured this out only by studying the cognitive functions, which clearly puts Si as my inferior function (hence, I infer that I am Ne-dominant, and it seems to fit).
First, let me state that I am not one of those delusional extroverts who is simply oblivious to how much she puts herself "out there". I mean I am a withdrawn-as-hell human being. I consider myself to be a loner with no social skills; I spend my weekends alone and consider myself chronically unable to make friends. I get all the "introvert" remarks--
- why are you so quiet?
- you need to learn to talk more?
- is something wrong? aren't you enjoying yourself?
- you need to learn to be more outgoing.
- you need to come out of your shell.
--as if telling me these things are going to magically convert me to YOUR obviously superior way of being.
Second, it helps to know I'm a 4w5 on the enneagram, meaning I am stuck between feeling like a freak and feeling completely isolated and different from the rest of humanity. I'm not outgoing, largely because I feel my presence is creepy, unwanted, or intrusive. I don't initiate conversations because I assume it's annoying of me, and I can easily get lost in fantasy land.
Simply put, I fit no one's criteria for "extrovert", especially not the MBTI's. But, I am in fact Ne-dom, and therefore a cognitive extravert. And I fit many extroverted criteria when it is seen as an attunement primarily towards the external environment. These include:
- Terror of the inner workings of my body
- Primary orientation toward things
- Not getting drained after socialization
- Needing outwards stimulation
- Needing to download thoughts externally
- Unable to carry on long chains of internal thought
- Taking other people's words about me as the truth of what I am
- Going stir-crazy when I can't discharge my thoughts
- Feeling like my brain is devouring itself when I try to build long chains of thought
- Being oblivious to one's environment (for Ne-doms)
- And that "Look at Me!" streak that occasionally cuts through my withdrawnness prolly has something to do with this too.
These are all signs of extraversion and have little to do with one's ability to socialize.
In my case, my extraversion does show itself in other ways--it's just very selective. It depends on both my chemistry with you, and upon context.
First, there are many people--I'd say the majority--for whom I simply have no desire to interact with at all. This is not to say that I dislike them, or that I'm being a snob. I'll make polite conversation if necessary, but I simply feel no deep sense of connection or see a reason to burden them with my presence.
In scenarios like these, I can even go into my 5ish "this is all happening on TV" observation mode, and forget I need to interact at all.
A few others can draw me out, and some people are so darn interesting to me I'll even initiate contact. These people can charge me up and my extraversion becomes more obvious to the outer world (this phenomenon happens a lot when I interact with other Ne-doms). Unfortunately, these folks are few and far between.
As to the "context" I mentioned above, well, I feel really awkward about talking to people just because "I'm supposed to". Actually, this just constipates my mind--my chattering brain stops, and my ability to form language is inversely proportional to the necessity with which I must do so. The harder I strain, the harder it is to think of anything to say! "Let's sit here and force conversation". YAY!
If I actually have some context in which to interact, it's that much easier. It's not that I don't want to interact, it's that I'm socially constipated.
Other times, I'd actually like to go do something but actually feel drained thinking about it. So, I decide it's going to be a hassle before I even go out and wind up staying home. If I'd just move past the transitional barrier here, I'd actually gain energy and be unable to settle down, but I always have the perception that being social is somehow going to drain me. Even though it won't.
My childhood had some influence here--I was bullied a lot as a kid. My parents and teachers taught me to "ignore" it, which I interpreted as "withdraw and pretend it doesn't exist". Sadly, this became my dominant view of how people see me and how I should interact.
Prior to this, I recall being a very serious child who was capable of sitting still for hours on end and concentrating, who was fascinated by nearly everything, yet who enjoyed her family's presence, was excited by nightlife, and who was extremely outgoing towards other kids at the park. (I'd say this phase in my life is the healthiest possible model of "introverted extroversion".)
So how do relcusive extraverts like me channel their outward-oriented energy?
- Writing, blogging, journaling
- Talking to the wall (Ne-doms are famous for monologues that no one listens to anyway!)
- Learning to speak foreign languages
- Internet surfing
- Chatting on online forums
- Listening to music really loud
- Juggling 4-5 creative projects at once
- Reading
- Gaming
- Taking brisk walks
- Going to supermarkets
- Doing two or more of these things at the same time
It's not ideal, but we introverted extroverts do exist!
