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2020 Democratic Party primary thread

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I just think Biden's polling in a general is inflated because of the name recognition factor due to being a VP. I envision him going on the campaign trail and the debate stage in the general and tanking badly. He scans like somebody who wants to retire and let people talk him into running.
 

Kingu Kurimuzon

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I just think Biden's pollin in a general is inflated because of the name recognition factor due to being a VP. I envision him going on the campaign trail and the debate stage in the general and tanking badly. He scans like somebody who wants to retire and let people talk him into running.

His best chance was in 2016 IMO. I can see him doing nearly as poorly as Mondale in a GE.
 
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Reading from various angles, I've kinda given up on second-guessing all this. From the last things I've seen, Bernie had the highest support across the party, and maybe in a GE against Trump on a national level as well, but not in the battleground states that are going to determine the actual 2020 election. In the battleground states only, the last polling I saw had Biden up 8 on Trump and Bernie only 3-4, which is damned close to the margin of error. So that seems to be driving the concern.

[I think the national parties' purpose (ideally) -- when the electoral college is still part of our selection of the presidency -- would be just be to ensure that their party has a competitive nominee on the national level rather than having someone selected via state primaries who cannot win a national election -- but between the parties' incompetence and corruption in recent years and then voters losing faith in the party heads, they have been incapable of playing that role.]

Let's face it, you can get as many zillions of Democratic votes as you want in California and it won't change the election outcome. We already found that out. The battlegrounds are going to determine who wins.

That was polling I saw maybe Fri/Sat. So I have no idea what it is now. Things might have already changed. But the chances for a contested nom are way way up.

Whatever is going to be, will be. My concern is more that things are going right where they were in 2016, and the centrists hate the Berners and vice versa, each feeling like each is destroying the country and/or stealing the nomination from the other group. (Honestly, neither of them is my first-choice candidate for the nom, but I know how I'm voting in a GE.) With all the vilification and disgust, regardless of who wins the nom, Trump's going to win the GE if this train wreck keeps up. Good job, team.

I see centrists falling in line easier than the Berners. The one thing that's clear is that they don't like Trump; it's the only thing they've talked about since 2016. I don't necessarily say that's what I would do.... if Biden won a plurality of delegates, I would certainly vote for him, but it's just my sense of whose anger is more likely to dissipate.

One thing it sounds like you and I can agree on is that a contested convention would be very bad, and that would happen if the superdelegates decide to hand the nomination to someone other than who won the plurality. That would backfire, and I hope they're smart enough, and care enough about defeating Trump to avoid doing that. I have my doubts, though. At least one superdelegate donates to Republicans and hasn't donated to Democrats in years.
 
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His best chance was in 2016 IMO. I can see him doing nearly as poorly as Mondale in a GE.

It's hilarious how establishment Democrats fret about McGovern but never talk about Mondale.
I read an article this morning that said that it was obvious McGovern was going to lose well before the election. He was 16 points behind Nixon in June. It's not June yet, but Sanders is ahead of Trump; it's hard for me to anticipate it dipping that badly.

It's not 1972 and Bernie Sanders is not McGovern

I remember people threw around the same McGovern bullshit about Howard Dean, also from Vermont. Dean was considered a radical at the time just for being against the invasion of Iraq. And we all know how wrong he turned out to be on that one.
 

Kingu Kurimuzon

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It's hilarious how establishment Democrats fret about McGovern but never talk about Mondale.
I read an article this morning that said that it was obvious McGovern was going to lose well before the election. He was 16 points behind Nixon in June. It's not June yet, but Sanders is ahead of Trump; it's hard for me to anticipate it dipping that badly.

It's not 1972 and Bernie Sanders is not McGovern

I remember people threw around the same McGovern bullshit about Howard Dean, also from Vermont

And Dean was just a centrist who happened to be vocally anti-war. Funny how they painted him a radical.

Anyway, it is too early to really tell, even with the head-to-head polling favoring Bernie.

I would say to the people invoking 1972 that other candidates have been far behind in July of their respective election years and still pulled ahead to win.
 

Jaguar

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Right. All of this flailing and desperate maneuvering should speak volumes to voters about just how anguished the lib center is. And how their power is deteriorating daily.

The irony. Those words sound like Donald Trump Jr.
 

Totenkindly

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Either way this has been fun to watch. Contested conventions are mostly a thing of the past so it would be interesting from a historian's perspective to see that play out in the current year.

I think I would find it more fascinating (from a historian's perspective) if it wasn't my own country and I and my children and people I care about wouldn't have to live with the rolling tsunami of this mess.
 

Kingu Kurimuzon

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I think I would find it more fascinating (from a historian's perspective) if it wasn't my own country and I and my children and people I care about wouldn't have to live with the rolling tsunami of this mess.

Well yeah there's that. But the observer part of me is very excited when I get past the initial terror and anxiety of this whole mess.
 

Jaguar

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Obama is notorious for "staying out" publicly at least and I had read was specifically not picking sides yet publicly... Not sure about privately.

Endorsing, yes. But I was referring to the reports that were out already about both Obama and Biden speaking with Pete shortly after he dropped out. That both Pete and Amy are headed to Dallas to be with Joe at his rally tonight made me wonder if she had only spoken with Joe or both Joe and Obama. As for Obama, he called Joe to congratulate him on his win in S.C. but he has previously said he wants the process to play out before endorsing.
 

Kingu Kurimuzon

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Pete or Warren would have been my second choice (at least out of anyone left with a real chance) after Bernie.
 

Virtual ghost

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I think I would find it more fascinating (from a historian's perspective) if it wasn't my own country and I and my children and people I care about wouldn't have to live with the rolling tsunami of this mess.



Well, American 2020 could easily define just about everything in where this world is actually going. Especially due to amplifiers such as environmental problems, policy on China, stock market or general social climate. Therefore you can't really hide from this.
 
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Endorsing, yes. But I was referring to the reports that were out already about both Obama and Biden speaking with Pete shortly after he dropped out. That both Pete and Amy are headed to Dallas to be with Joe at his rally tonight made me wonder if she had only spoken with Joe or both Joe and Obama. As for Obama, he called Joe to congratulate him on his win in S.C. but he has previously said he wants the process to play out before endorsing.


He's going to fight hard to win against Trump, for sure.
 

Totenkindly

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Well, American 2020 could easily define just about everything in where this world is actually going. Especially due to amplifiers such as environmental problems, policy on China, stock market or general social climate. Therefore you can't really hide from this.

I'm referring to some other things that you are not, but yes, I get it -- the whole world is fubar. Thanks for the reminder.
 

Tellenbach

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There's a 68% chance this race goes to a brokered convention according to some org called 538. Basically, Bloomberg is splitting the moderate vote and Warren is splitting the socialist vote, so it's unlikely that Bernie or Biden will get to 50% + 1. Several superdelegates have already stated that Bernie should expect a thorough colonscopy if that happens and he should just grin and bear it. This is so much fun. :D
 

Maou

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Are Bernie supporters okay with the amount of Dems flipping Republican, or refusing to support Bernie? In states like Florida? I personally do not think Bernie stands a chance in swing states. I myself being in Ohio, and seeing hate for him in Florida too. Penn is up in the air though, but I think I recall something about people switching parties there too. I guess the #walkaway took root more than people expected.
 
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