Wow! I honestly didn't expect so many posts have been generated!
I think this would be better addressed in the Relationship's sub-section, but mind games exist with, or without intent. Honesty doesn't take someone off the hook. I'll elaborate further when this topic broadens beyond the NF extremes.
Honestly I have browsed through the entire forum but couldn't locate the sub-section. If you don't mind, I would like to know where it is.
For example:
You gotta show a guy that you have a life and it doesn't revolve around him. [...] Let him miss you. --This is actually very solid advice.All the psych experts say that you should try to retain a degree of healthy detachment, especially at the start of a relationship. That way you're in a better position to evaluate the other person objectively and to break things off if troubling signs appear.
This is exactly what I mean, and works for friendships even. I don't think people will generally miss each other if you get to see them too often, or available. This is probably the biggest problem for INFJs as one of our significant traits is being clingy to those who mean the world to us, or those people (especially ENFPs) who we are drawn to immensely. Nevertheless, that's part of mind games that's being played.
People want to be attracted and stimulated by their partner. If you are not at least somewhat interesting.....its not going to last. You can't just stay in your own bubble and own form, without getting into the mind of the person you are interacting with...and you shouldn't be encouraged to do so either.
I wonder what's your type in typology? I quite enjoy reading your posts along the way. Oh, and I absolutely dig your sassy avatar as well!
Here's the thing, I'm once convinced that those introverts who should take it all slow and natural and let others (especially for those Extroverts) to get to know you once you've found a potential admirer. The sad thing is, that's also when many opportunities will die off if we're not being receptive enough.
I once dated this guy and thought we connected really deeply though I am really bad at expressing my inner-emotional through my facial expression, so he ended up giving up, thinking that I'm uninterested toward him.
So for me, in order to break the bubble around us, I would say that the only way to get away from this vicious cycle of letting a potential lover slipped away is to play games a little in the early stage.
On the other hand, being too obviously admiring and pursuing a man openly appears to be some kind of turn off. I guess it looks bad to them, even if the real story is I'm still seeing other people. It doesn't matter if you're still maintaining your own life or even not keeping all your eggs in one basket...it just matters what it looks like, at least in the beginning.
Of course, but staying mysterious and playing a little hard to get probably won't.
not to say i go overboard when i give up, but i usually end up making some little contact or smiling or whatever else that opens my door back up again. perhaps it's a good thing. never have i ever had anyone say to me that i seemed desperate - if anything, i have heard that i am somewhat aloof and send mixed messages - but i feel like my inability to just run away robs me of power.
Don't you just hate that? I have the same problem here. However, usually when others considered that I've been sending mixed signals, most of them interpreted it as negative instead of positive signals (perhaps due to my pickiness?)
(though, i should note, that i don't really fall for people until we know each other fairly well... so by that time... i really have something to lose if "ignoring" is interpreted the wrong way.)
Wow, you sound like my idential twin there! Don't you just hate that when that happens? On what occasions do you ignore? I usually do that to avoid conflicts or if I was overwhelmed by disappointments. I just need to take my own space a little for that matter.
I've been rarely falling for strangers like you. I usually fall for them after I get to know them deeply on a personal level. Though I must say that one of the sign to show that I'm interested in people is to start finding ways to get closer to them, without dropping any hints. The thing is, after a while, once they've opened up to me privately and share their dark sides, I fell "immediately." Does this happen to you too?
Btw, I really like the links under your signature. Can I use it too?
My older sister once told me "The one who loves the least controls the relationship".
It's true.
This is why I despise games, but as much as I wish they didn't exist, they do exist.
Beautiful quote, btw!
I assume people started to play games, not only restricted in controlling a relationship, when they've been hurted consecutively. I mean even most kids know how to lie to get away from blame. Any lie is a form of emotional manipulation and it's part of mind games to me.
i think we also "play games" in part because emotions can come on strong and uninvited... if a not-very-close friend confessed their love to you, would you really be able to handle that in the same way that you could handle perhaps a little flirting, and then a little more flirting, and then a little more? it would be more truthful of them to open up, instead of pretending to only be a little interested, but would it be better...?
True, I've always have problems to reject someone by simply saying "No" as I don't want to hurt their feelings. Though what I hate about the whole notion of playing games is that it added extra layer of negative suspicions when I try to read people. Someone may be genuine about expressing their feelings (like if they are being overly-enthusiastic), but that can lead to many false accusations--particularly of my "J" influence on jumping into conclusions (which I'm still trying to work on it).
I have to say that girls, and marmies posts on this subject are exactly part of why I dont even try to date anymore, i was pretty unsuccessful as it was because people who believe that everyone is playing these control games, never trust that you are not playing games too, and since they cannot figure out what you are doing (since you actually are not playing games) they get scared, thinking you are out playing them, and they've lost all control... and they run off...
It's hard to believe this is coming from an ENFP. But you have made some intresting points for me to ponder upon. I think for myself, sometimes I have this 'blank' expression that people can't really read what I'm thinking, and those who're really into playing games thought I did outplay them (when I did nothing, and it's frustrating).
For example, I was interested in this guy and then I tag one of my best friend along (and she's quite masterful in playing games). We all had a weekend-getaway and partied in a different city, which is 50 miles away. Anyways, we all got pretty drunk and I ended up passing out in my bed (she's supposed to share the bed with 'me'), after a little while, I started to hear the mattress from the other bed start tweeking. So I was overwhelmed as she knew that I am head over heels on him prior to the trip. Anyways, the next morning, I pretended nothing happen (nor they), and since I felt really uncomfortable (note: I didn't feel angry, but rather embarrassed to be in their 'newfound fling' company, I insisted that I want to drive the car back. Though in the middle of negotiation (she promised to drive back home as I droved there in the first place), I just slurred out and told them, "I knew what happened last night and I don't want to feel awkward by being a passenger." She thought she got snapped by me whereas I just wanted to keep my mind busy through driving. It's weird that from that day she had accused me of playing games to irk her off, when my intention of offering to drive is pure.
and heres the issue, what you are describing is NOT a lack of games, or honest open-ness, its ANOTHER type of game, the kind of person that uses being "open" as a form of control, it is not the same as being open and honest, because the person is not taking responsibility for their own feelings, they are pushing them on to YOU... refusing to play mind games is much different, by refusing to play it does not mean that you tell them automatically every little thing you think and feel, but you DO if they are interested in it, you dont lie about your feelings, you dont hold anything back when honesty is asked for, but it doesnt mean you have to gush all over everyone, and try to make THEM responsible for YOUR feelings... trying to force somebody else to take responsibility for what YOU feel is just as much a part of the mind games as any of the others, and its one a lot of people play on themselves as well...
Excellent point. I do rarely open up to people even if they're close to me. It takes years (not exaggerating) for me to reveal my most private information and all. Though I thought most ENFPs do have a power to lead others to open up (their magical ability of questioning). And of course, I'm not referring to those creepy people who randomly openup to you in the beginning. I had a co-worker once told me his tragic story (his wife got killed a day after the wedding from an accident) on his "first day" of work. I'm not sure what's the intention there. To start up a conversation? With that? Anyhow, I build an invisible wall around him from day two afterward.
I'll get back from page six next time as there are works waiting for me to finish up.