simulatedworld
Freshman Member
- Joined
- Nov 7, 2008
- Messages
- 5,552
- MBTI Type
- ENTP
- Enneagram
- 7w6
- Instinctual Variant
- sx/so
Just tell them their feelings are stupid and irrational. Works every time!
Here's my two cents...
If I'm upset at you, it is for one of two reasons:
1. You hurt my feelings.
2. You disrespected my values.
[Obviously, there are times when it is a mixture of both.]
If you hurt my feelings, I need a hug, a compliment, and an assurance that you value our friendship a lot. If you disrespected my values, you'd better appologize, or at least acknowledge my feelings and agree not to do it again.
Explainations are okay so that I can see your point of view. You don't want me to think that you're a heartless monster. Excuses, however, are to be avoided. "I completely stepped on your values and treated you horribly. But I was just having a bad day. It isn't my fault." Yeah... that really doesn't work. There is no excuse for being a bad friend. In all cases, it is best to take the knife. I personally have a habit of taking at least part of the blame, even when it is the other person's fault.
One thing I would like to say about disrespecting values: They're MY values. Not yours. It doesn't matter if YOU think that they're pointless or irrational. If you respect me and value our friendship, you will respect my boundaries, in the same way that I respect yours.
Don't forget though friendships exist because you respect other people's values.
But if you are gonna judge others by how they perceive your values, be coherent.
Not a thing you can do. Just pretend to agree with their values. If the F in question has a well developed T, you can reason with them. Just ignore their emotional reaction for the time being, if they really have a good T they will appreciate your point eventually. After their passions tame down and they get around to think. But with most Fs, if you cannot avoid dealing with them, just lay low and be polite, you're walking a minefield.
If you're getting mashed, remember, Henry Kissinger said 'if you want to win someone back, never disagree with them'. Not necessarily that you should try to 'win them back' or be on good terms with them, thats too much of a headache no doubt, just to get them off your back agree with everything they say. Smile. Say it gently. Remember, to Fs it doesn't really matter what you say, only how you say it, so don't be afraid to make blatantly false claims or contradict what you said 5 seconds ago. They will hardly notice, and if they do and have an emotional reaction about it, even that will be overshadowed by the 'gentle and agreeable' way you said it. Remember, to an F, truth doesn't really matter, it is all about what 'feels' like harmony. Doesn't have to be genuine harmony or long-lasting, or with any good potential, just in the moment it must feel 'good' and like harmony to the F. In short, it doesn't even need to make any sense, it just has to feel 'good' to an F, and I believe the above shows how to induce such a feeling within an F.
*Mental note: notice how if you were to come to an F with your problem, they would make no effort to make sense of it or help you solve it. They would just keep on saying, its okay! You're great! You did the right thing! Everything will be alright!
(Even though all of those comments are complete non-sense often)
This is what they want to hear. To a T it sounds ridiculous to have these things said as they are filtered through our critical thinking faculties, they don't filter anything. They just take it for face value. Tell them 'you're great' they buy it wholesale. Their emotions are directly influenced by what is said, not by their thoughts on what is said.
There have been numerous very negative reactions to this. I don't understand - this seems like a very good advice that will get the job done - a good working "tool".
To all who hate it: Why?
I don't understand.
I calm down my infp friend using logic first to make him think that there can be perspective. Then use even harder logic thats too much for him to understand to make him confused. After he is confused and seeing that there is another perspective to it he calms down and thinks.
Dunno if this works with all NF's or even all infps
As long as you don't propound that the T route is the right route, I actually quite enjoy hearing these perspectives. I ask advice from Ts for exactly this reason. Sometimes their lack of F is a hindrance, but they are also the ones to tell you how to tell someone to sod off, or how best to get out of a sticky situation. You may still have reservations about their advice (because it tends to overlook a lot of "unspoken" elements that you know exist but can't articulate) but I feel reassured when I get advice from two separate Ts that correlates in some way. It makes me think "Maybe they're on to something here!"
What I find frustrating is when Ts act as if your "problem" is not really a problem at all, and just get angry or scoff at you.
ARE YOU TELLING ME THAT I HAVE PROBLEMS?OMGROFLLOLZ. YOU HAVE PROBLEMS YOURSELF YOU BIG #%&@#% @%%! @@%&&*+&/##@@
Here, let me list them for you...