Yeah, it's interesting. It's startling when I understand someone more by how they say things than what is said, bypassing language barriers. However, it's also startling to see a person maimed by autism or some other sort of debilitation when I'm suddenly forced to see our common trait; we're just trying to get by. It's even more humbling than watching a fully functioning bacteria move or a wild animal operate on pure instinct.
Of course many people re-calibrate their behaviors for social or otherwise practical reasons, but re-calibration follows from weirdness, and "weirdness" follows from ignorance in every case. It leads me to believe that people believe they are individualized when they are not. Not that we ought to conform for our similarities, but maybe that we can entertain the thought of being so self-aware that we can function according to the individual and the group, as John Nash was depicted saying in A Beautiful Mind in reference to The Nash Equilibrium.
Eat mah salad
You didn't ask me specifically, but yes. And technology these days can usually detect DS quite early in pregnancy (within reasonable abortion guidelines), although some people don't have the desire for or the access to these tests.First, there was no chance or a medical technology existed for the expecting mothers( especial;y 30 yrs ago) to know that are pergnant with someone with DS,... Also, can you honestly say that we have the right to do that??
If the answer is Yes, what if there was a technology that would enable the expecting parents to know whether or not they were having a child who will grow up to be a narcassitst,... would you then say they should also abort their child????
BTW I am in no ways equatting people with DS with narcassists since they are lovely and kind..
Redherring wrote:
... despite all my parent's efforts to the contrary and although I could and probably would (about the role of intellect in people's lifes, what makes us human, subjective and objective aspects of quality of life, my own subjective values, the pros and cons of those standards, what I would do if I had a child with a mental disability, what I would do and how guilty I would feel if it turned out I couldn't emotionally connect to them enough because of the lacking mental connection, etc.) So yes, they can trigger uncomfortable thoughts and feelings.
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So can you make a mental connection with an intelligent person who despite his/her intelligence chooses to be lazy coach potato with no dreams, aspriation and motivation, using parents' money and others' to survive, ...while intellectualizing and rationalizing his laziness... ?? love to hear your response.
Sure, probably. Why shouldn't I?
That does not mean that I have to condone their every action or choice. I have friends with different values and different lifestyles from my own.
Im sure people get shocked and scared of the unknown and don't want to be politically incorrect or accidentally rude or crude when they come across this sort of thing. A lot of subsitute teachers declined to help with special needs sections of the school--which is where I made all of my money.
Usually though, at least with mild downs syndrome, they're cooler to hang out with than some normal people are. I'm not going to say I have a soft spot for genetically deficient or different people.. I just really don't think much on the subject. If they're cool enough to hang out with, I hang out with them. If they're beyond normal human interaction, I either humor them the same way I humor children or I empathize and take some consideration for the people caring for them.
I've found it's even harder to care for someone who doesn't immediately 'look' damaged. My grandmother has Alzheimers, and you wouldn't know at first glance..we've frequently been the receipients of accusing glares and judgement from strangers in restaurants and shops for having to be firm with my grandmother about things like not eating food that can kill her.
So I was wondering ,how do you guys ( honestly) react when you see a person with Down Syndrome ? (i.e on media, in person,..etc)??
Also, the parents quite likely had the baby after the recommended age. I don't assume my reaction is always justified, I'm just being honest. I have some spartan values that I don't expect many people to relate to.First, there was no chance or a medical technology existed for the expecting mothers( especial;y 30 yrs ago) to know that are pergnant with someone with DS,...
Yes. That used to be no-brainer in the past. It would actually be a improvement from that, since we don't have to wait until the fetus develops a consciousness anymore.Also, can you honestly say that we have the right to do that??
I assume you mean narcissistic. And if by narcissistic you mean someone who actually has the disorder, the answer is definitely yes. I used to have a boss with that disorder and I'm confident that the world would become a better place without that kind of people. In fact, NPD is much more harmful to society than DS.If the answer is Yes, what if there was a technology that would enable the expecting parents to know whether or not they were having a child who will grow up to be a narcassitst,... would you then say they should also abort their child????
Point is people with DS are basically a dead weight to the society. They are born to be treated with pity or contempt for the rest of their lives. We could solve that.BTW I am in no ways equatting people with DS with narcassists since they are lovely and kind..
Also, the parents quite likely had the baby after the recommended age. I don't assume my reaction is always justified, I'm just being honest. I have some spartan values that I don't expect many people to relate to.
Yes. That used to be no-brainer in the past. It would actually be a improvement from that, since we don't have to wait until the fetus develops a consciousness anymore.
I assume you mean narcissistic. And if by narcissistic you mean someone who actually has the disorder, the answer is definitely yes. I used to have a boss with that disorder and I'm confident that the world would become a better place without that kind of people. In fact, NPD is much more harmful to society than DS.
Point is people with DS are basically a dead weight to the society. They are born to be treated with pity or contempt for the rest of their lives. We could solve that.
I don`t think its right to think that you lose your sister with downs, more like getting your sister eventually without. People take abortion without any good reason all the time. DS is a reason more.
Its like saying you can`t treat your rabies because that would alter your mind back to normal..
Once again a dodgy example.. yay.
http://open.spotify.com/track/0em18R0T5Phr6yv3bBP7cD
I'm different from you. Like RedH mentioned, for some of us the intellectual connection is quite important.D. If you read all my posts in this thread, you will see that I mentioned about the positive impact that my sister had on my Outlook towards life.. Another suggestion, if you have not already, you may want to read Ginko's post...
Maybe I'm both. But abortion is not murder. It's like destroying a seed, but a bit more controversial.I know INTPs' tendeny to be logical, yet there is a major difference between "cruelty", and "rationality" and your stand seems to be of the first one.
Ummm.... thats a great point, having a role of care taker of someone who does not appear to be a person with" special needs" seem to be more challenging. I
I tend to have an issue with the term "damged" after all, are not we all damaged somewhow, maybe emotionally or spritualily,...
I believe that when life cuicumstances place you in the posotions to be around people with "special needs",( especially if you are related by blood) its likely that you develop more sympothy towards people w other specialy needs....
Mildly annoyed. They should have been aborted. I don't think they look funny.
We're the only species that try to save life that's not self-sustaining.Why do you think they should have been aborted?
Anyways.. I'd argue DS is better than Autism, if the DS is mild to moderate and the autism moderate to severe. Autism kids are a bitch to deal with no matter what, they were the most challenging to deal with at work. Deaf was easy, dumb easier, blind easiest, DS the funnest, and retardation of various sorts fair enough of a challenge depending on the severity.. Autism was difficult no matter what the level stated seemed to be.