[Type 8] Te and eight

[miss fortune]

My dad is absolutely an 8 and many people think ENTJ. He isn't, he's an ESTJ, perhaps ESTP.

this type of thing is why I like the enneagram better than MBTI...

there are a lot of misconceptions about ESTPs being dumb jocks pretty much, while they have the capability of being just as good of 8s as Te doms do... maybe some different motivations, but the same sort of consequences

 

[Virtual ghost]

Yes, Se vacuums up everything and dumps it into Ni but Te is going to decide how/where it's used. At least that's how I see it.

This is perhaps most common combination but there are alternative combinations.

1. Te detect a problem and goes through the situation/data, once findings are gathered those findings go through Ni and they are then thown through Te at the problem.
2. There is no time: Direct Te/Se control of the situation
3. Out of random Ni signalizes that there is a problem, Se starts to search and Te/Ni/Se solve it togather once it is found.

Even if they don't want to be the boss they will be because a) they can't handle it being done by incompetent people and b) for an 8, they'll act if their environment is being invaded.

Yes. Power just comes out due to circumstances even of a person has no direct wish to be in control. (famous reactivness of 8s)
In 8w9 this is even more visible if you pay attention.

 

[Virtual ghost]

yeah, I have the tendency to ignore protocol and get shit done in most cases... see a problem and solve a problem!

I am not so "impulsive" regarding this since I usually want a moment to think things through ... in order to reduce chances that I don't know what I am doing and that the whole thing doesn't backfire somehow. (Ni/5 fix)

 

[miss fortune]

I am not so "impulsive" regarding this since I usually want a moment to think things through ... in order to reduce chances that I don't know what I am doing and that the whole thing doesn't backfire somehow. (Ni/5 fix)

which is a bit different from my impulse to stabilize the situation (prevent it from getting any worse) and then collect the necessary information to fix the situation, which I suppose is a good illustration of Se-Ti in a way

of course, I tend to work in an environment where things move quickly and can get bad very quickly, so reacting with speed is necessary when something goes wrong... there's no time to think unless you're thinking while fixing and I've gotten a bit decent at that by this point

 

[Virtual ghost]

this type of thing is why I like the enneagram better than MBTI...

there are a lot of misconceptions about ESTPs being dumb jocks pretty much, while they have the capability of being just as good of 8s as Te doms do... maybe some different motivations, but the same sort of consequences

I totally agree. Ennegram is much better at presenting people for what they really are.


I have through Enneagram came to realization that I am not what I thought I am. My last typing made perfect sense at face value at the time, however with removal of health problems and a part of really bad social environment my energy level jumped. Also there is a fact that until I was 10 that I have spend 4-12 hours a day with other kids every day, but through the severe political mess, passive family, bad education system and endless economic depression I have become detached/loner. The warning sign was that I don't collapse into 7 when unhealthy (and that I am bad with Fi), instead I was already completely deconstructed into a 5. Therefore when I finally managed to get out of the mess my type simply couldn't be maintained. (especially if you calculate in hours of playing strategic video games every day ... even in the darkest times)


While in MBTI you simply don't see something so sophisticated.

 

[miss fortune]

I totally agree. Ennegram is much better at presenting people for what they really are.


I have through Enneagram came to realization that I am not what I thought I am. My last typing made perfect sense at face value at the time, however with removal of health problems and a part of really bad social environment my energy level jumped. Also there is a fact that until I was 10 that I have spend 4-12 hours a day with other kids every day, but through the severe political mess, passive family, bad education system and endless economic depression I have become detached/loner. The warning sign was that I don't collapse into 7 when unhealthy (and that I am bad with Fi), instead I was already completely deconstructed into a 5. Therefore when I finally managed to get out of the mess my type simply couldn't be maintained. (especially if you calculate in hours of playing strategic video games every day ... even in the darkest times)


While in MBTI you simply don't see something so sophisticated.

I totally agree with that... like 100% agree

due to other factors, I have a hard time really feeling that any MBTI type fits all that well (the site has other ideas, but they really only see what I give them here and it's the same with every member)... enneagram seems more all encompassing, covering motivations and drives, which change a lot less frequently than behaviors do. I know someone'll point out that you should look at cognitive processes and that they never change, but that doesn't take into account difficult backgrounds or people who do change a lot over time and have experienced a lot of things... some things are really difficult to untangle.

 

[Virtual ghost]

I totally agree with that... like 100% agree

due to other factors, I have a hard time really feeling that any MBTI type fits all that well (the site has other ideas, but they really only see what I give them here and it's the same with every member)... enneagram seems more all encompassing, covering motivations and drives, which change a lot less frequently than behaviors do. I know someone'll point out that you should look at cognitive processes and that they never change, but that doesn't take into account difficult backgrounds or people who do change a lot over time and have experienced a lot of things... some things are really difficult to untangle.

In my opinion it is not overly likely that a person can be a real 8 unless it has difficult years/decades in their lifepath. The core off 8 energy is coming exactly out of the mess in the outside/real world and thus creates very thick skinned and determined person (even if this may not be visible at first in some cases) . If there are no such bad elements in the story the naturally determined person will probably grow up into a 3 or 1.

 

[miss fortune]

In my opinion it is not overly likely that a person can be a real 8 unless it has difficult years/decades in their lifepath. The core off 8 energy is coming exactly out of the mess in the outside/real world and thus creates very thick skinned and determined person (even if this may not be visible at first in some cases) . If there are no such bad elements in the story the naturally determined person will probably grow up into a 3 or 1.

I know in my case I've become considerably more 8 with age... started out identifying as a 7 and things went to shit and they REALLY went to shit in my life... emerged from that and made a much better 8 than 7... the walls came up over that time period and I doubt that some of them will ever come down again.

Which brings up the questions of Do enneagram types change over lifespans? and Can you effectively type anyone until they've grown?

 

[á´…eparted]

Which brings up the questions of Do enneagram types change over lifespans? and Can you effectively type anyone until they've grown?

I am inclined to think no. However, I think if someone experiences something very psychologically intense, there are some rare individuals who will change. Considering there is theory that enneagram type is developed in part through childhood experiences, it makes sense it could be influenced later in life with enough pressure.

 

[Virtual ghost]

I know in my case I've become considerably more 8 with age... started out identifying as a 7 and things went to shit and they REALLY went to shit in my life... emerged from that and made a much better 8 than 7... the walls came up over that time period and I doubt that some of them will ever come down again.

Which brings up the questions of Do enneagram types change over lifespans? and Can you effectively type anyone until they've grown?

I see it as pretty fluid, real life is real life. You can't explain lifes of billions of people with simple psychology theory in a way that everything works all the time. I had bad luck that my country got invaded in Nazi Germany style when I was 6 and I can tell you that in such moment you can throw fair amount of typology through the window. Since the theory doesn't predict such a large scale shock.


I started as 5 simply because my parents didn't socialize me at until I was 5 years old (and they gave me science books to study). After that I had a social phase that was 8ish or 7ish in nature. Alot of action, people and time spent togather .... however due to problem in all spheres, self-destructive society and the fact that most of my friends moved away one by one I ended up alone. Creating a 5 like personality that is dependant on gaming to spend his aggresive energy. Plus health problems covered up that tertiary Se (tertiary is what balances you) ... and now I am where I am. Unless there will be new shocks I presume that I will remain relatively similar to what I am now. I through entire life balance 8/5 and Te/Ni and that is probably not going to change, however the environment and cirrcumstances will decide which gives a better results under cirrcumstance.


I am 60% E and 40% I unless clearly unhealthy or in situations that are complete mess. (ambivert)

 

[miss fortune]

I am inclined to think no. However, I think if someone experiences something very psychologically intense, there are some rare individuals who will change. Considering there is theory that enneagram type is developed in part through childhood experiences, it makes sense it could be influenced later in life with enough pressure.

I see it as pretty fluid, real life is real life. You can't explain lifes of billions of people with simple psychology theory in a way that everything works all the time. I had bad luck that my country got invaded in Nazi Germany style when I was 6 and I can tell you that in such moment you can throw fair amount of typology through the window. Since the theory doesn't predict such a large scale shock.


I started as 5 simply because my parents didn't socialize me at until I was 5 years old (and they gave me science books to study). After that I had a social phase that was 8ish or 7ish in nature. Alot of action, people and time spent togather .... however due to problem in all spheres, self-destructive society and the fact that most of my friends moved away one by one I ended up alone. Creating a 5 like personality that is dependant on gaming to spend his aggresive energy. Plus health problems covered up that tertiary Se (tertiary is what balances you) ... and now I am where I am. Unless there will be new shocks I presume that I will remain relatively similar to what I am now. I through entire life balance 8/5 and Te/Ni and that is probably not going to change, however the environment and cirrcumstances will decide which gives a better results under cirrcumstance.


I am 60% E and 40% I unless clearly unhealthy or in situations that are complete mess. (ambivert)

I have always had a hard time believing that anything relating to a personality could be static... people do change and some change pretty dramatically over time and to think that one type would cover them before that change and after that change would be pretty silly in my book. Personal experience makes me question the idea that type wouldn't change though and that brings up some stuff that I really don't feel that comfortable discussing on the forum at large. I can see how a person could change from a 5 to an 8 depending on circumstances because that sort of thing makes sense to me... I tested as a 3 in my teens and very early 20s, a 7 in a good majority of my 20s and after everything I find 8 to be the best fit and it fits quite well. Previous traits can be completely beat out of a person due to circumstances or they can merely become less prominent with time while other traits step into the spotlight and that makes perfect sense to me.

 

[Virtual ghost]

I have always had a hard time believing that anything relating to a personality could be static... people do change and some change pretty dramatically over time and to think that one type would cover them before that change and after that change would be pretty silly in my book. Personal experience makes me question the idea that type wouldn't change though and that brings up some stuff that I really don't feel that comfortable discussing on the forum at large. I can see how a person could change from a 5 to an 8 depending on circumstances because that sort of thing makes sense to me... I tested as a 3 in my teens and very early 20s, a 7 in a good majority of my 20s and after everything I find 8 to be the best fit and it fits quite well. Previous traits can be completely beat out of a person due to circumstances or they can merely become less prominent with time while other traits step into the spotlight and that makes perfect sense to me.

It depends on environment, if environment is stable then the personality will probably be the same. However as environment becomes more and more unstable there will be a greater need for change. You can fight change but in some situations you just have to adapt ... or you will be vanquished.

 

[RedAmazoneFriendZone]

What is the connection? I want to know.

They mainly THINK they are right and THINK THEY CAN kick your ass at any cost.

Which is of course total bullshit as this is just a sadistic projection of their inner dictature world.


For the good ENTJ (if that exists) don't feel concerned about my own feeling. That's just a feeling, you know......

 

[Typh0n]

ENTj often gets associated with type 8, though many 8s are not ENTjs, and many ENTjs are not 8s.

For the good ENTJ (if that exists) don't feel concerned about my own feeling. That's just a feeling, you know......

Well, personally, it bothers me when people rely on feeling to judge things that feelings are not supposed to judge. But I don't have a problem when people say "I feel that..." when it comes to relationships, or people, since I do that too and its better that way. It all depends of the context, but I notice FP types often try to use emotional manipulation to get out of situations which are not a question of how you feel, but they try to make it a question of "how you feel" because they are not confident in their logical capacities. Which doesn't mean they are stupid, just not comfortable with using facts, logic, and numbers to prove a point.

But as Jung said, logic needs to be used for questions which require logic, and feeling for questions that require feeling, and alot of people, accoroding to Jung, mix the two functions up.

 

[Evo]

Se?

 

[yeghor]

What is the connection? I want to know.

I believe E8s are Se-doms, they would have a connection to Te if they are ESFPs.

yeah, I have the tendency to ignore protocol and get shit done in most cases... see a problem and solve a problem!

I am not so "impulsive" regarding this since I usually want a moment to think things through ... in order to reduce chances that I don't know what I am doing and that the whole thing doesn't backfire somehow. (Ni/5 fix)

Tendency to ignore protocol is P behaviour and suggests impulsivity. Assuming E8 is Se, ESFPs have tertiary Te. ESTPs have auxiliary Ti, but they would prefer to interact with the world mostly thru Se (impulse/action/aggression) or Fe (compassion, feigned?).

8 and Te/Se loop are basically the same thing described by two different personality systems. It is possible to have one without another but the two are just natural fit.

How can you be the real "boss" if you don't have commanding/organizing skills and ability to see what is going on ? Or if you have good commanding/organizing skills and ability to see what is going on there are good chances that you will be in charge sooner or later.

Te-Se loop is only available in xSFPs and xNTJs.

Se?

Agreed, E8 is Se.